Martin Luther on God's Acceptance of Lies

[_LittleNipper]

Example of God being an author of a lie

https://i.imgur.com/zcxh40m.jpg

Example of God considering doing evil, then repenting. Exodus 32:14.

"And the LORD repented of the evil which he thought to do unto his people."

It took Moses to talk God out of being an ahole. Since Moses, nobody bothers, apparently.

I believe the Bible is expressing how GOD "feels" in human terms for our benefit. And GOD teaches man through such interactions. Remember Abraham dealing with GOD concerning Sodom and Gomorrah? The reality is we see that there were not 10 righteous individuals in any of those cities or GOD would have sparred them. Clearly, Abraham could not conceive that there could not be at least 10.

[_Maksutov]

I believe the Bible is expressing how GOD "feels" in human terms for our benefit. And GOD teaches man through such interactions. Remember Abraham dealing with GOD concerning Sodom and Gomorrah? The reality is we see that there were not 10 righteous individuals in any of those cities or GOD would have sparred them. Clearly, Abraham could not conceive that there could not be at least 10.

Abraham the holy. The dude who would have killed his son for Yahweh and gave his daughters up to be raped for the same. Abraham was a disgusting man who found favor with an equally disgusting deity. I can tell a lot about people by what they worship.

A lovely story to tell people to value their shaman above their family.

[_SPG]

What harm would it do, if a man told a good strong lie for the sake of the good and for the Christian church … a lie out of necessity, a useful lie, a helpful lie, such lies would not be against God, he would accept them.

--Martin Luther, cited by his secretary, in a letter in Max Lenz, ed., Briefwechsel Landgraf Philips des Grossmuthigen von Hessen mit Bucer, vol. 1. Source: Sissela Bok, Lying: Moral Choice In Public and Private Life‎, New York: Pantheon Books, 1978, p. 47. German text of the quote.

This was a man after my own heart. We look for the functionality of thing more than the truth of it.

[_SPG]

It might be noted that this comment is quite different than advising or commanding polygamy. It might also be observed that Luther declining to condemn polygamy does not mean he thinks that the government could not rule against it.

Luther tended to view people using their own judgement on decisions as a good thing.

Why would he condemn polygamy? Human relationships are not defined be the mathematics of them. He probably had several friends in such relationships.

[_Res Ipsa]

What harm would it do, if a man told a good strong lie for the sake of the good and for the Christian church … a lie out of necessity, a useful lie, a helpful lie, such lies would not be against God, he would accept them.

--Martin Luther, cited by his secretary, in a letter in Max Lenz, ed., Briefwechsel Landgraf Philips des Grossmuthigen von Hessen mit Bucer, vol. 1. Source: Sissela Bok, Lying: Moral Choice In Public and Private Life‎, New York: Pantheon Books, 1978, p. 47. German text of the quote.

This was a man after my own heart. We look for the functionality of thing more than the truth of it.

Are you saying it's the consequences that matter and not the truth?

[_aussieguy55]

Dietrich Bonhoffer " It is better to be a lover of truth and tell a lie than a liar and tell a truth"

"If a teacher asks a student "Did your father come home drunk again last night it is ok for the student to lie and avoid shame. It is none of the teacher's business"

Luther "It is better to be ruled by a wise infidel than a Christian fool"

[_SPG]

Are you saying it's the consequences that matter and not the truth?

Truth is demonstrated in the consequences. Truth is a quest, and often a noble one, but also a fool's errand. It cannot be found.

The end result, (while measured and judged by our concepts of truth) should be really measure of thought or deed.

I wanted an entire town go at each other in the name of truth. I was like, "who cares, we are family." Which, in it's own was way truth, but not the whole truth, and just my take on truth. But I could tell, that this particular quest for truth, was pure maddest.

[_Res Ipsa]

Are you saying it's the consequences that matter and not the truth?

Truth is demonstrated in the consequences. Truth is a quest, and often a noble one, but also a fool's errand. It cannot be found.

The end result, (while measured and judged by our concepts of truth) should be really measure of thought or deed.

I wanted an entire town go at each other in the name of truth. I was like, "who cares, we are family." Which, in it's own was way truth, but not the whole truth, and just my take on truth. But I could tell, that this particular quest for truth, was pure maddest.

That bit you stuck in parenthesis is the bit that makes your view of truth v. effect incoherent. Yes, you can use postmodernist deconstruction to tear down the ideas you don’t like while protecting the ideas you like by special pleading, but the unjustified inconsistency is pretty glaring.

[_moksha]

Common Liturgical Calendar: Tomorrow will be Spy Wednesday.

Spy Wednesday gets its name because that is the day on which Judas betrayed Jesus to the General Authorities in the Sanhedrin.

Hope that helps.

[_SPG]

That bit you stuck in parenthesis is the bit that makes your view of truth v. effect incoherent. Yes, you can use postmodernist deconstruction to tear down the ideas you don’t like while protecting the ideas you like by special pleading, but the unjustified inconsistency is pretty glaring.

You say I'm bias in my deconstruction of ideas?

Maybe....

But I try to be consistent. I admit that even my favorite ideas can be torn a apart. But, it's true that I like some ideas more true than others. I can use some ideas more than others. Just because I find an idea useful doesn't make it more truth then one I don't like. I think the actual truth of the universe scares us.