More Wives after Death for Righteous LDS Men?

[_Yoda]

Nothing will change my thoughts on this.

I think President Gordon Hinckley would answer that we should not be troubled by these flecks and glitches in our history since they do not represent what we are about today and that he was not sure we even teach that since such purported doctrines could more easily have been derived from a sexual itch than from a holy commandment.

That's my feeling as well, Mok.

[_Buffalo]

People really should learn not to believe everything they read, and to instead research the FULL truth and facts related to a subject. The actual truth isn't always so "simple".

http://en.fairmormon.org/Joseph_Smith/P ... nry_Jacobs

http://www.fairlds.org/FAIR_Conferences ... r_Men.html

by the way.... No, this is not a case of when LDS would "whip out their handy dandy Old Testament and quote where Jehovah gave wives to David...or Solomon..."

Thus, another example of anti-mormon lying and tranferring their own prejudices and ignorance is if such is the same thing as "fact".

Nothing in your C&P links refute anything I posted in the least. Sorry.

[_Yoda]

People really should learn not to believe everything they read, and to instead research the FULL truth and facts related to a subject. The actual truth isn't always so "simple".

http://en.fairmormon.org/Joseph_Smith/P ... nry_Jacobs

http://www.fairlds.org/FAIR_Conferences ... r_Men.html

by the way.... No, this is not a case of when LDS would "whip out their handy dandy Old Testament and quote where Jehovah gave wives to David...or Solomon..."

Thus, another example of anti-mormon lying and tranferring their own prejudices and ignorance is if such is the same thing as "fact".

Nothing in your C&P links refute anything I posted in the least. Sorry.

The angle that Alan Wyatt's article seemed to take was one of intent. He pointed out that Zina's various marriages were her choice, and that there was no malice or ill-intent on the part of either Brigham Young or Joseph Smith.

I, however, was not convinced of the ill-intent.

And, furthermore, even if the intent was not poor, a God who would force anyone to make this type of choice is monstrous, in my eyes. I just cannot believe that a loving Heavenly Father would approve of such cruelty.

[_just me]

‘If you will take this step, it will ensure your eternal salvation & exaltation and that of your father’s household & all of your kindred.[‘] Said to 14 year old Helen Mar Kimball.

‘Tell Zina, I put it off and put it off till an angel with a drawn sword stood by me and told me if I did not establish that principle upon the earth I would lose my position and my life’”. A message to the married Zina from Joseph through her brother just months after her wedding.

“[He] told me about his great vision concerning me. He said I was the first woman God commanded him to take as a plural wife.” Mary Rollins recollection of what Joseph said to her when she was 12 years old while in Kirtland.

Spiritual Abuse

Joseph Smith was in a position of power and he abused that. He had no right to do what he did. He held power of government and religion over these people. When people tried to expose him or said no to him he would publicly humiliate them.

And while we may no longer teach that righteous men will get more wives after death it certainly was a teaching once and it is part of our legacy. Some people still believe it. I know that I did and my husband still does.

Quotes from wivesofjosephsmith.org

[_Yoda]

‘If you will take this step, it will ensure your eternal salvation & exaltation and that of your father’s household & all of your kindred.[‘] Said to 14 year old Helen Mar Kimball.

‘Tell Zina, I put it off and put it off till an angel with a drawn sword stood by me and told me if I did not establish that principle upon the earth I would lose my position and my life’”. A message to the married Zina from Joseph through her brother just months after her wedding.

“[He] told me about his great vision concerning me. He said I was the first woman God commanded him to take as a plural wife.” Mary Rollins recollection of what Joseph said to her when she was 12 years old while in Kirtland.

Spiritual Abuse

Joseph Smith was in a position of power and he abused that. He had no right to do what he did. He held power of government and religion over these people. When people tried to expose him or said no to him he would publicly humiliate them.

And while we may no longer teach that righteous men will get more wives after death it certainly was a teaching once and it is part of our legacy. Some people still believe it. I know that I did and my husband still does.

Quotes from wivesofjosephsmith.org

Good points, Just Me. And, I think that both Brigham Young and Joseph Smith were guilty of Spiritual Abuse in these instances.

[_just me]

‘If you will take this step, it will ensure your eternal salvation & exaltation and that of your father’s household & all of your kindred.[‘] Said to 14 year old Helen Mar Kimball.

‘Tell Zina, I put it off and put it off till an angel with a drawn sword stood by me and told me if I did not establish that principle upon the earth I would lose my position and my life’”. A message to the married Zina from Joseph through her brother just months after her wedding.

“[He] told me about his great vision concerning me. He said I was the first woman God commanded him to take as a plural wife.” Mary Rollins recollection of what Joseph said to her when she was 12 years old while in Kirtland.

Spiritual Abuse

Joseph Smith was in a position of power and he abused that. He had no right to do what he did. He held power of government and religion over these people. When people tried to expose him or said no to him he would publicly humiliate them.

And while we may no longer teach that righteous men will get more wives after death it certainly was a teaching once and it is part of our legacy. Some people still believe it. I know that I did and my husband still does.

Quotes from wivesofjosephsmith.org

Good points, Just Me. And, I think that both Brigham Young and Joseph Smith were guilty of Spiritual Abuse in these instances.

Heck yeah. And they taught others to abuse their power and authority as well.

[_Buffalo]

Heck yeah. And they taught others to abuse their power and authority as well.

"Amen" to their priesthood!

[Guest]

Liz.... Frankly then you completely don't understand Plural Marriage in God's eyes.
It's a higher law of LOVE.... Not lust, not perversion, or anything else.
When it's practiced according to God's ways, it's pure and beautiful and completely non-compulsory. This is how the Church in most instances practiced it. This is not how apostate sects practice it. They have lost the light.

I once condemned Polygamy also..... But I was so wrong, completely looking at it how the world does, not how God does, and also as to the full facts of the institution.

Do you have any examples of polygamy being practiced in a pure, beautiful and completely non-compulsory way?

We will probably disagree about the term "non-compulsory." When you teach women that the only way to get to the highest heaven is to be married to a priesthood holder you aren't giving them very fair choices (hmmm, heaven or damnation...it even says it in DC 132). When you have a man in a position of power and trust who has charisma and has set himself up as the mouthpiece of God who then starts telling women (and it can happen with men, too) that God wants them to sleep with you this is ABUSE. It is very, very difficult for victims not to succumb to these predators. Joseph Smith had game...he often would groom his victims by living with them prior to abusing them. Not only was he their religious and political leader he was practically "family."

There is something about these men...these charismatic alpha male leaders. Sometimes they do such a good job of grooming their victims that the victims come to them. There is nothing pure or beautiful about that. I hope you will watch the 4 minute cut from the larger documentary linked below.

Inside the Michael Travesser Cult

[_Buffalo]

Inside the Michael Travesser Cult

Those poor girls. Just like the girls Joseph fooled into sleeping with him.

[_just me]

Inside the Michael Travesser Cult

Those poor girls. Just like the girls Joseph fooled into sleeping with him.

VERY sad. Of course, it was non-compulsory and they saw heaven opened up to them.....

It is interesting that in that cult no one is allowed to have sex except the leader. The leader has 2 or 3 wives...one of which was his sons wife. *boggle*