False Prophet=Joseph Smith=Brigham Young

[_Molok]

Joseph Smith was right. There are Men on the Moon.

[_SteelHead]

Again, with regard to the different accounts of the invasion. The matter is likely that there was more than one invasion involved, if you study your Bible. Please see: http://markhaughwout.com/Bible/Hezekiah ... cherib.htm

No, there's no evidence whatsoever of more than one invasion (and your link is to a student paper). Not only did such double-invasions not happen back then, but there would be no conceivable reason for it if the text is accurate, since it says he first gave Sennacherib all the money in his treasury. He would have no money for Sennacherib to come back for, and it obviously wasn't a scorched earth campaign. The fact that Jerusalem magically has all this money back, but Hezekiah refuses to give in, is indication enough that we're dealing with completely different accounts of what happened. The fact that the spelling of Hezekiah's name is different from one account to the next (and nowhere else does it change) is further evidence. There's just no possible way to avoid the conclusion that we have different and conflicting accounts of what happened.

Now, with regard to a donkey talking -------- it seems to me that the serpent did the very same thing in the garden. Could such have been telepathic in nature? Some day, I may just ask Jesus that question, but for how I know that nothing is impossible with God.

In other words, you just believe it because you've arbitrarily decided to believe it. Mormons have to be held accountable for claims of the impossible, but you just get to bark that "nothing is impossible with God." There's the unavoidable and asinine double standard into which every believer must inevitably fall when they seek to try to hurl empirical evidence against a faith tradition. Thank you for proving that you cannot even begin to defend your own beliefs from the very criticisms you level at the beliefs of others.

And Mak wins by knockout.

[Guest]

[

Now, with regard to a donkey talking -------- it seems to me that the serpent did the very same thing in the garden. Could such have been telepathic in nature? Some day, I may just ask Jesus that question, but for how I know that nothing is impossible with God.

In other words, you just believe it because you've arbitrarily decided to believe it. Mormons have to be held accountable for claims of the impossible, but you just get to bark that "nothing is impossible with God." There's the unavoidable and asinine double standard into which every believer must inevitably fall when they seek to try to hurl empirical evidence against a faith tradition. Thank you for proving that you cannot even begin to defend your own beliefs from the very criticisms you level at the beliefs of others.

There is no evidence for the Book of Mormon. Mormons are held to biblical standards by Christians. And Mormon beliefs are found to contradict the Bible. If you don't wish to believe that God could make a donkey communicate with his owner, why would a Mormon believe that an angel would communicate with Joseph Smith. You believe in angels? Why? Have you ever seen one? But angels are biblical and so such is possible from a biblical point of view. But then if a prophet gets it wrong, then he becomes a false prophet. That is biblical also.

[_LittleNipper]

Now, with regard to a donkey talking -------- it seems to me that the serpent did the very same thing in the garden. Could such have been telepathic in nature? Some day, I may just ask Jesus that question, but for how I know that nothing is impossible with God.

In other words, you just believe it because you've arbitrarily decided to believe it. Mormons have to be held accountable for claims of the impossible, but you just get to bark that "nothing is impossible with God." There's the unavoidable and asinine double standard into which every believer must inevitably fall when they seek to try to hurl empirical evidence against a faith tradition. Thank you for proving that you cannot even begin to defend your own beliefs from the very criticisms you level at the beliefs of others.

There is no evidence for the Book of Mormon. Mormons are held to biblical standards by Christians. And Mormon beliefs are found to contradict the Bible. If you don't wish to believe that God could make a donkey communicate with his owner, why would a Mormon believe that an angel would communicate with Joseph Smith. You believe in angels? Why? Have you ever seen one? But angels are biblical and so such is possible from a biblical point of view. But then if a prophet gets it wrong, then he becomes a false prophet. That is biblical also.

[_maklelan]

There is no evidence for the Book of Mormon.

Retreating to broader assertions about evidence now? Not only is your comment not true (there's certainly no proof, but there's plenty of data that serves as evidence), but the exact same thing could be said of any and all faith claims made by the Bible. People who believe the Bible's claims do so for one reason and absolutely one reason only: they want to. There is nothing else to promote that belief, and I defy you to show me otherwise.

Mormons are held to biblical standards by Christians.

Standards to which they refuse to hold themselves.

And Mormon beliefs are found to contradict the Bible.

Of course, the Bible is found to contradict the Bible repeatedly.

If you don't wish to believe that God could make a donkey communicate with his owner, why would a Mormon believe that an angel would communicate with Joseph Smith.

You really think this is going to distract from the fact that you accused us of believing the impossible and then crowed that in your case "nothing is impossible with God"? Your entire premise fell flat on its face, and this hasty retreat isn't going to come close to salvaging your sectarianism.

You believe in angels?

Maybe. Maybe not.

Why? Have you ever seen one? But angels are biblical and so such is possible from a biblical point of view. But then if a prophet gets it wrong, then he becomes a false prophet. That is biblical also.

So the Bible is wrong, then, according to its own standard. As we've seen, prophets from Isaiah and Ezekiel all the way to Jesus himself were wrong. You guys were either too afraid or too uninformed to do much more with that argument than just cough up whatever websites Google gave you. I showed how uninformed and manipulative they were and you guys just ran away.

[_LittleNipper]

Maklelan writes, " As we've seen, prophets from Isaiah and Ezekiel all the way to Jesus himself were wrong."

This is unfounded. This is an opinion of someone who doesn't hold to the inerrancy of God's Holy Word as found only in the Bible. There are certainly other views and opinions that uphold the Bible. One must be willing to weigh them both. Jesus was never wrong and that is because Jesus is God.

[_maklelan]

Maklelan writes, " As we've seen, prophets from Isaiah and Ezekiel all the way to Jesus himself were wrong."

This is unfounded. This is an opinion of someone who doesn't hold to the inerrancy of God's Holy Word as found only in the Bible.

And to defend your belief in the accuracy of Jesus' prophecies by asserting that his words are inerrant is to beg the question. This is a fallacy. I've pointed several of them out and you've not responded. Do you know what fallacies are?

There are certainly other views and opinions that uphold the Bible.

And I have repeatedly asked you to share them. You have refused.

One must be willing to weigh them both. Jesus was never wrong and that is because Jesus is God.

In other words, "Nu-uh, because nu-uh." Jesus quite explicitly said that disciplines standing with him would live to see his second coming. That didn't happen. Full stop.

[_jordon3]

As a side note it is really ironic that you both are trying to attack Mormonism here since this board is known for being very critical of Mormonism. ****Most of us here do not believe**** Joseph Smith was a prophet and we are very skeptical about the Mormon Church today. It should tell you something when the critics of the people you are attacking think you're wrong.[/quote]

Fencesitter, glad to hear that most on here do not believe Joseph Smith was a prophet. Finally one of you admits. There is way to much damning evidence to prove that he is not a prophet inspite of the churches attempts to twist and contort these facts. ie for example Book of Abraham and errors Joseph Smith copied from the KJV of the Bible to the Book of Mormon etc etc

MY beef is---- WHY do Mormons insist on being called Christians when they have a completely different and opposing doctrine than Christians?

Now the foundation of Mormonism is based on the teachings and doctrines that Joseph Smith fabricated ie you say most on here don't believe he was a prophet. YES? So what you are essentially saying is Mormonism is a man-made religion. Right?. If Joseph Smith is not a prophet then what is the foundation of the religion called Mormonism???
Fencesitter I am actually a nice guy and my questions are serious and not as your say an attack. Please believe me.

[_The Erotic Apologist]

MY beef is---- WHY do Mormons insist on being called Christians when they have a completely different and opposing doctrine than Christians?

Numerous people have already answered this question. Perhaps you should take a break from cutting-and-pasting your 3000-word diatribes and instead read what others have posted.


_________________
Surprise, surprise, there is no divine mandate for the Church to discuss and portray its history accurately. I've worked with the Historian's office. Their mandate is to preserve history and make it available to scholars and others, not to write about it. The clerks who work in the department are more clueless on some basic issues of history than I am, and that's not saying much.
--Robert D. Crockett

[_maklelan]

MY beef is---- WHY do Mormons insist on being called Christians when they have a completely different and opposing doctrine than Christians?

And your beef has been directly engaged multiple, multiple times, only to have you brush aside the argument and repeat your beef. The beef is getting rancid, Jason, and no one is willing to entertain any longer the notion that you're here to do anything other than bark at the moon.

Now the foundation of Mormonism is based on the teachings and doctrines that Joseph Smith fabricated ie you say most on here don't believe he was a prophet. YES? So what you are essentially saying is Mormonism is a man-made religion. Right?. If Joseph Smith is not a prophet then what is the foundation of the religion called Mormonism???
Fencesitter I am actually a nice guy and my questions are serious and not as your say an attack. Please believe me.

I would love to believe you, but you continue to ignore honest and direct responses to your concerns, only to turn around and repeatedly demand exactly what has been given to you.