Contradiction in the Book of Mormon?

[_gdemetz]

Mittens, as usual, you and Albion are way off base. The Book of Mormon was definitely not written by people who believed in the false Athenasian Creed! Anyone who has actually read that ridiculous creed and still believes it, in my opinion, probably has lost touch with reality! Remember, Joseph Smith translated the Book of Mormon as well as having seen the Father and Son SEPARATELY AS ALL TRUE BIBLICAL AND Book of Mormon PROPHETS HAVE SEEN WHO HAVE HAD THAT VISION! The witness statement just confirms that the Godhead (the true Biblical term) which we worship is simply also referred to, since it is one unit, as one God. However, the more correct Biblical term is Godhead! The oneness is FIGURATIVE! Christ also stated that He would pray for his apostles that they may all be one JUST AS HE AND HIS FATHER WERE ONE! Does it make since to pray to the same "substance," or that part of the same substance would know when part would return to the earth, but the other part would not, not to mention the absurdity of the three manifestations at Christ's baptism?!?

"FOR THE TIME WILL COME WHEN THEY WILL NOT ENDURE SOUND DOCTRINE...AND SHALL BE TURNED UNTO FABLES."

[Guest]

by gdemetz » Wed Jul 18, 2012 7:32 pm
Does it make since to pray to the same "substance," or that part of the same substance would know when part would return to the earth, but the other part would not, not to mention the absurdity of the three manifestations at Christ's baptism?!?

You failed to read the difinition of the Trinity, I produced 6 different sourses for it and all said three separate and distinct persons represent the One God,
[God- Godhead- Substance- Essence- being [ all Synonyms ] always three when refering to persons always one when refering to [God- Godhead- Substance- Essence- being [ all Synonyms ] You need to read post before going into rant


Jesus even said there is only One God and that was the greatest comandment
Mark 12:
28 And one of the scribes came, and having heard them reasoning together, and perceiving that he had answered them well, asked him, Which is the first commandment of all?
29 And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord:
30 And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment.
31 And the second is like, namely this, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these.

Joseph Smith Jr disagrees with Book of Mormon and Jesus

Joseph Smith said the Trinity is three gods.
"I have always declared God to be a distinct personage, Jesus Christ a separate and distinct personage from God the Father, and the Holy Ghost was a distinct personage and a Spirit: and these three constitute three distinct personages and three Gods," (Teachings of Prophet Joseph Smith, p. 370).

[_gdemetz]

Mittens, I have read the original; the ridiculous Athenasian where this whole stupidity started! You should read that! I know that false concept very well!

[_Mittens]

gdemetz » Wed Jul 18, 2012 8:02 pm

Mittens, I have read the original; the ridiculous Athenasian where this whole stupidity started! You should read that! I know that false concept very well!

I agree with the Athansion Creed, it is divided into two parts, One says when Jesus was Jehovah of the Old Testament he was equal with the Father, yet line 33 says he was inferior with the Father since laid aside the eqality when he became man.

Phil 2:
[Let Him be your example in humility:]

6 Who, although being essentially one with God and in the form of God [[b]possessing the fullness of the attributes which make God God], did not [c]think this equality with God was a thing to be eagerly grasped [d]or retained,


Which part of the Athanasion creed do you diagree with gdemetz

[_Franktalk]

8 And behold, it is wisdom that this land should be kept as yet from the knowledge of other nations; for behold, many nations would overrun the land, that there would be no place for an inheritance. (Book of Mormon, 2 Nephi, Chapter 1)

This is what Nephi was told by God circa 590bc.

Yet...

The book was written by many ancient prophets by the spirit of prophecy and revelation. Their words, written on gold plates, were quoted and abridged by a prophet-historian named Mormon. The record gives an account of two great civilizations. One came from Jerusalem in 600 B.C., and afterward separated into two nations, known as the Nephites and the Lamanites. The other came much earlier when the Lord confounded the tongues at the Tower of Babel. This group is known as the Jaredites. After thousands of years, all were destroyed except the Lamanites, and they are among the ancestors of the American Indians. (Book of Mormon, Introduction)

So why didn't God inform Nephi that the land had in fact been inhabited before and hadn't been kept from all other nations as a Land of Promise pending Nephi's groups arrival?

So are you saying that other nations knew of the Americas? I always thought that God revealed this to small groups and not nations. Can you back up your statement with historical documents showing that other nations knew of the Americas around 600 BC? Or are you saying that the small group that left Jerusalem was a nation? Just what are you saying? Please form your ideas in a way that makes sense.

[_gdemetz]

Which part? Actually, there are many parts that I do not agree with and consider false man made doctrines:

!- I don't agree with: "Whosoever will be saved, before all things it is necessary that he hold the Catholic faith...{or}perish everlastingly."

2- I don't agree with: "And the Catholic faith is this, that we worship one God in Trinity and Trinity in Unity. NEITHER CONFOUNDING THE PERSONS, NOR DIVIDING THE SUBSTANCE" (as well as the rest of this ridiculous first paragraph).

3- I don't agree with: "...so we are forbidden by the Catholic religion to say, there be three Gods or three Lords" {I have to admit that this brainwashing has really sunk in just as Satan wished for!}..."neither made, nor created, nor begotten, but proceeding" {? If you can't dazzel them with brilliance, then just baffel them with BS!}.

4- I don't agree with: "{along with the rest of paragraph 3} He therefore that will be saved MUST THUS THINK OF THE TRINITY" {over the centuries this brainwashing has really sunk deep!}.

{I don't really have a problem with paragraph 4 if it is taken in the correct light.}

5- I don't agree with: {in addition to some of the same redundant BS} {Christ} "...descended into hell..." {actually, the spirit world, and He commissioned others to preach in hades} "... and they that have done evil into everlasting fire {only okay if taken as prophetic language and not literally}. This is the Catholic Faith {sic}, which except a man believe faithfully and firmly, he cannot be saved." {BS}

If you don't divide the "substance," and they are all the same "substance," then what kind of dumb substance would that be where it's all together, but you still pray to your own "substance," and part of it knows when you will return to the earth, but the other part doesn't (even though it is not divided), and part of the flexible substance lands on itself during part of it's baptism, all the while while the baptized part throws it's voice to heaven stating that it is well pleased with the other part which is baptized, and... never mind {BS}.

[_Mittens]

Which part? Actually, there are many parts that I do not agree with and consider false man made doctrines:

!- I don't agree with: "Whosoever will be saved, before all things it is necessary that he hold the Catholic faith...{or}perish everlastingly."

The term Catholic means "universal" not Roman Catholic

2- I don't agree with: "And the Catholic faith is this, that we worship one God in Trinity and Trinity in Unity. NEITHER CONFOUNDING THE PERSONS, NOR DIVIDING THE SUBSTANCE" (as well as the rest of this ridiculous first paragraph).

confouding means not mixing up the persons like Joseph Smith did

Mosiah 15
3 The Father, because he was conceived by the power of God; and the Son, because of the flesh; thus becoming the Father and Son—
4 And they are one God, yea, the very Eternal cFather of heaven and of earth.

Mosiah 16:
15 Teach them that redemption cometh through Christ the Lord, who is the very Eternal Father. Amen.


Alma 11:38 Now Zeezrom saith again unto him: Is the Son of God the very Eternal Father?


Ether 3:14 Behold, I am he who was prepared from the foundation of the world to redeem my people. Behold, I am Jesus Christ. I am the Father and the Son. In me shall all mankind have life, and that eternally, even they who shall believe on my name; and they shall become my sons and my daughters.


3- I don't agree with: "...so we are forbidden by the Catholic religion to say, there be three Gods or three Lords" {I have to admit that this brainwashing has really sunk in just as Satan wished for!}..."neither made, nor created, nor begotten, but proceeding" {? If you can't dazzel them with brilliance, then just baffel them with BS!}.

The Book of Mormon says Jesus was uncreated

2 Nephi 26:12 And as I spake concerning the convincing of the Jews, that Jesus is the very Christ, it must needs be that the Gentiles be convinced also that Jesus is the Christ, the Eternal God;

4- I don't agree with: "{along with the rest of paragraph 3} He therefore that will be saved MUST THUS THINK OF THE TRINITY" {over the centuries this brainwashing has really sunk deep!}.

{I don't really have a problem with paragraph 4 if it is taken in the correct light.}

5- I don't agree with: {in addition to some of the same redundant BS} {Christ} "...descended into hell..." {actually, the spirit world, and He commissioned others to preach in hades} "... and they that have done evil into everlasting fire {only okay if taken as prophetic language and not literally}. This is the Catholic Faith {sic}, which except a man believe faithfully and firmly, he cannot be saved." {BS}

That's in the Apostle Creed and The Bible says Jesus went to hell for three days
Acts 2
25 “King David quoted Jesus as saying: ‘I know the Lord is always with me. He is helping me. God’s mighty power supports me.
26 ’No wonder my heart is filled with joy and my tongue shouts his praises! For I know all will be well with me in death—
27 ’You will not leave my soul in hell or let the body of your Holy Son decay.
28 ’You will give me back my life and give me wonderful joy in your presence.’
29 “Dear brothers, think! David wasn’t referring to himself when he spoke these words I have quoted, for he died and was buried, and his tomb is still here among us.
30 But he was a prophet, and knew God had promised with an unbreakable oath that one of David’s own descendants would be the Messiah and£ sit on David’s throne.
31 David was looking far into the future and predicting the Messiah’s resurrection, and saying that the Messiah’s soul would not be left in hell and his body would not decay.
32 He was speaking of Jesus, and we all are witnesses that Jesus rose from the dead.
33 “And now he sits on the throne of highest honor in heaven, next to God. And just as promised, the Father gave him the authority to send the Holy Spirit—with the results you are seeing and hearing today.
3 4“No, David was not speaking of himself in these words of his I have quoted, for he never ascended into the skies. Moreover, he further stated, ‘God spoke to my Lord, the Messiah, and said to him, Sit here in honor beside me
3 5until I bring your enemies into complete subjection.’

If you don't divide the "substance," and they are all the same "substance," then what kind of dumb substance would that be where it's all together, but you still pray to your own "substance," and part of it knows when you will return to the earth, but the other part doesn't (even though it is not divided), and part of the flexible substance lands on itself during part of it's baptism, all the while while the baptized part throws it's voice to heaven stating that it is well pleased with the other part which is baptized, and... never mind {BS}.

Yes the Substance or Godhead is One

[_jo1952]

Mittens, as usual, you and Albion are way off base. The Book of Mormon was definitely not written by people who believed in the false Athenasian Creed! Anyone who has actually read that ridiculous creed and still believes it, in my opinion, probably has lost touch with reality! Remember, Joseph Smith translated the Book of Mormon as well as having seen the Father and Son SEPARATELY AS ALL TRUE BIBLICAL AND Book of Mormon PROPHETS HAVE SEEN WHO HAVE HAD THAT VISION! The witness statement just confirms that the Godhead (the true Biblical term) which we worship is simply also referred to, since it is one unit, as one God. However, the more correct Biblical term is Godhead! The oneness is FIGURATIVE! Christ also stated that He would pray for his apostles that they may all be one JUST AS HE AND HIS FATHER WERE ONE! Does it make since to pray to the same "substance," or that part of the same substance would know when part would return to the earth, but the other part would not, not to mention the absurdity of the three manifestations at Christ's baptism?!?

"FOR THE TIME WILL COME WHEN THEY WILL NOT ENDURE SOUND DOCTRINE...AND SHALL BE TURNED UNTO FABLES."

Hi GD!

Indeed, when the Book of Mormon was originally being written, neither the Nephites nor the Lamanites would even have heard of ANY of the creeds, the Trinity Dogma, the Council of Nicea in 325 AD, the Early Church Fathers, none of the manuscripts which would eventually be canonized and known as the Bible, who the people were who followed Christ in His earthly ministry, Paul, that the Temple had been rebuilt and then subsequently destroyed, the destruction of Jerusalem and the death of over a million Jews in 70AD, the Septuagint etc., etc.

Blessings,

jo

[_Albion]

Surely that would all have been known in the 1800s even in backwoods NY state?

[_Mittens]

Joseph Smith Jr knew of a little Island NE of madascare on west African coast developed in 1500 with capital called Nephi