sheryl wrote:I grew up Mormon and like you was very curious at the display of tears and emotion during the Fast and Testimony meetings. I had never felt anything similar to what they described as being overcome or swept away by spirit.
What I found curious was that people displayed this type of emotion both when they ascribed the finding of car keys to divine intervention and also when something genuinely moving (births, deaths, etc) happened. There was no way of differentiating between emotional outbursts and the touch of the spirit.
“We look to not only the spiritual but also the temporal, and we believe that a person who is impoverished temporally cannot blossom spiritually.” Keith McMullin - Counsellor in Presiding Bishopric
"One, two, three...let's go shopping!" Thomas S Monson - Prophet, Seer, Revelator
Drifting wrote: Mormonism disagrees with you. In fact you can only have the constant companionship of the Holy Spirit if you are baptised a member of the Mormon Church.
You non Members get the watered down version, Holy Ghost Lite! Which only works in conjunction with the Book of Mormon. For the full App. you need to get wet...
Yes, I know that Mormonism disagrees with me, as do many religions! That does not make them right. :)
I do, though, agree with them in that there are different levels of the Holy Spirit, or of the Light Presence and Power of Christ. So that each person can receive according to their ability to receive. It is just that in my experience, what is offered through the Mormon Church is one of the watered down versions.
What the disciples experienced on the Mount of Transfiguration is available for those who are able to receive it. Which are few presently in the world. So the watered down versions are what is most helpful for most of humanity.
Drifting wrote:What I found curious was that people displayed this type of emotion both when they ascribed the finding of car keys to divine intervention and also when something genuinely moving (births, deaths, etc) happened. There was no way of differentiating between emotional outbursts and the touch of the spirit.
Perhaps if we view that finding lost car keys carries the same truth as finding anything that is lost, including lost souls, we would understand why there can be a deep reaction.
Finding lost car keys reminds us of something on an inner level that is very powerful.
The Kingdom of Heaven is like a man who lost his car keys, and when he found them he rejoiced and became filled with joy...
I grew up Mormon and like you was very curious at the display of tears and emotion during the Fast and Testimony meetings. I had never felt anything similar to what they described as being overcome or swept away by spirit. But then in college, in my sorority, during a very special rush preparation, we were all overcome with emotion - with love for each other, and began crying together. I remember thinking ah, this is what they experienced, love!
Since then I have come to learn that yes, love will invoke spirit, a spiritual presence. Not only will we be carried away, even weeping, if we are sensitive we will detect spiritual presences that are drawn to that energy. Certainly we can call this the Holy Spirit, for like attracts like, meaning that angelic presences carrying the Holy Spirit will be attracted when we make ourselves more like God, when we love, for example.
The point being that the feeling during Fast and Testimony is not phenomenon applicable only to Mormonism, but to good energy. As we make ourselves more like God we will experience more of God. Not as a confirmation of anything outside of us, but as a confirmation of what we have done within ourselves.
In truly seeking, in giving, in loving, we make ourselves more like God and attract more of God into our awareness, within and without, which becomes quite emotional as we awaken at greater depths to who we truly are.
Peace be within you.
Sheryl
Shalom my friend!!!!!!!!!!! I see you wasted no time when I told you about this website. Welcome, Welcome!!!!
Drifting wrote:What I found curious was that people displayed this type of emotion both when they ascribed the finding of car keys to divine intervention and also when something genuinely moving (births, deaths, etc) happened. There was no way of differentiating between emotional outbursts and the touch of the spirit.
Perhaps if we view that finding lost car keys carries the same truth as finding anything that is lost, including lost souls, we would understand why there can be a deep reaction.
Finding lost car keys reminds us of something on an inner level that is very powerful.
The Kingdom of Heaven is like a man who lost his car keys, and when he found them he rejoiced and became filled with joy...
;)
Peace. Sheryl
You were credible until this post.
“We look to not only the spiritual but also the temporal, and we believe that a person who is impoverished temporally cannot blossom spiritually.” Keith McMullin - Counsellor in Presiding Bishopric
"One, two, three...let's go shopping!" Thomas S Monson - Prophet, Seer, Revelator
Actually that was the best of the thread so far. Can you not see how the details of this world are just that, details. Can you not see that spiritual matters are not separated like worldly matters. Why must you see a spiritual realm as the same as this one. By its very definition it is more and controls this one. But on a different level of understanding. In this world we can touch a car but in the spirit world what manifest can be very different. I have not been there so I can give no first hand witness. But from what I read it is not like this one. I suspect that a lie will show up and you can see it. Just my opinion.
Drifting wrote: Mormonism disagrees with you. In fact you can only have the constant companionship of the Holy Spirit if you are baptised a member of the Mormon Church.
You non Members get the watered down version, Holy Ghost Lite! Which only works in conjunction with the Book of Mormon. For the full App. you need to get wet...
Hi Drifting,
Not all LDS believe what you just wrote. The others who do are confused with the ordinance of "receiving" the Holy Ghost as being distinct from the work of the Holy Ghost.
Though I have only been posting on this board for a few days, I have already commented on at least one other thread about this very issue. I like to refer members who are mistaken about this, back to Joseph Smith himself. He did not "receive" the Holy Ghost until years after he had been called and was being prepared to assist God in restoring His Church. Also, it is very clear in the Bible that the witness on the earth is the Holy Ghost. He is here 24/7 and is available to everyone. He reveals whatever Truth Father directs Him to to whomever Father deems is ready and able to receive. You do not have to be a member of the Church, or even be a member of ANY church to be able to receive the Truth Father thinks you are ready for.
I have known individuals who have had much more experiencing of the Holy Ghost than members of the LDS Church.
Perhaps if we look at the human body a bit differently this confusion might find some clarity?
Here in physical incarnation, it is known by wisdom traditions that we are composed of more than just a physical body. We also have a mental body, a vital or emotional body, and subtler bodies which operate under the same premise, but are not part of this discussion.
Each body accesses and functions in a particular world or realm. The physical of course appears or accesses and functions in the material realm. The vital or emotional in vital or emotional realms which are the lowest heavens, as well as the hells and the in-betweens or the midsts. The mental accesses and functions in the next level of heavens, still considered lower heavens. (Our more subtle bodies access and function in middle and higher heavens.) All of our bodies are accessing and functioning in their respective heavens, irregardless of our awareness of these heavens. (It is through our subtle bodies that we do become aware of beings of other realms, and of the other realms themselves - which becomes obvious as we spiritually awaken.)
Our emotional or vital body is reactive, at least in its bestial state. Emotions arising because of stimuli. They can react to physical or mental stimuli, which is easy for us to see the connection, but they can also react to stimuli from more subtle realms. For example angels vibrating in love might stimulate a more subtle body, our vital body reacting to that with an emotional reaction. And then we have a multiple-realm event, such as we experience something in the physical through our mundane senses, bringing an emotional reaction, attracting higher beings from subtle realms, stimulating us on a more subtle level, also affecting the emotional body, resulting in a very powerful reaction to something in the physical that seems rather simple on the surface.
This is what is so unique about humanity - their bodies span the entirety of creation - through all realms and worlds, and so can bring 'heaven' even the Highest Heaven, to earth.
And we really cannot separate ourselves in that way, put an emotional reaction here and a spiritual (or subtle) reaction or response over there. We are interconnected, within ourselves and in this way within and throughout all creation - all of creation being connected as One Body on the most subtle levels.
And so while in physical incarnation, it is impossible to have a spiritual reaction or response without an emotional, nor even a mental or physical reaction. So when we are touched by a testimony, or even a commercial, for example, it is because some notion of a deeper truth has been spoken through the event, touching deeper parts of ourselves which awaken and respond, resulting in what appears to be a nonsensical reaction on the emotional level.
Now the key is purification - as scripture tells us through denying self or through crucifying the 'flesh' (which means the physical, emotional, and mental bodies) we become purified so that we are no longer unconsciously reacting to stimuli on the various levels, but are aware, and thus begin to respond consciously, meaning we are aware of the stimuli and consciously permit the response by our will, as it comes, through purification, in alignment with the Will of God. Thus bringing heaven to earth through the response of our earthly bodies to heavenly stimulus. This is how Light is brought into the world.
So I would say that emotions and spirituality are confused when we are asleep spiritually - unaware of ourselves and the multiplicity of realms that we touch, unaware of our inner bodies. Thus the key to finding God and Truth is within ourselves, awakening to these subtle layers of self that already know God, our most subtle level being Eternal.
Peace be within you.
Sheryl
Shalom Sheryl!
I was wondering as I read your post if this could help explain the seven spirits of Christ?
Drifting wrote: Mormonism disagrees with you. In fact you can only have the constant companionship of the Holy Spirit if you are baptised a member of the Mormon Church.
You non Members get the watered down version, Holy Ghost Lite! Which only works in conjunction with the Book of Mormon. For the full App. you need to get wet...
Hi Drifting,
Not all LDS believe what you just wrote. The others who do are confused with the ordinance of "receiving" the Holy Ghost as being distinct from the work of the Holy Ghost.
Though I have only been posting on this board for a few days, I have already commented on at least one other thread about this very issue. I like to refer members who are mistaken about this, back to Joseph Smith himself. He did not "receive" the Holy Ghost until years after he had been called and was being prepared to assist God in restoring His Church. Also, it is very clear in the Bible that the witness on the earth is the Holy Ghost. He is here 24/7 and is available to everyone. He reveals whatever Truth Father directs Him to to whomever Father deems is ready and able to receive. You do not have to be a member of the Church, or even be a member of ANY church to be able to receive the Truth Father thinks you are ready for.
I have known individuals who have had much more experiencing of the Holy Ghost than members of the LDS Church.
Love,
jo
Well the Church seems to agree with me.
The Gift of the Holy Ghost
All honest seekers of the truth can feel the influence of the Holy Ghost, leading them to Jesus Christ and His gospel. However, the fulness of the blessings given through the Holy Ghost are available only to those who receive the gift of the Holy Ghost and remain worthy.
After a person is baptized into The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, one or more Melchizedek Priesthood holders lay their hands on the person's head and, in a sacred priesthood ordinance, confirm him or her a member of the Church. As part of this ordinance, called confirmation, the person is given the gift of the Holy Ghost.
The gift of the Holy Ghost is different from the influence of the Holy Ghost. Before baptism, a person can feel the influence of the Holy Ghost from time to time and through that influence can receive a testimony of the truth. After receiving the gift of the Holy Ghost, a person has the right to the constant companionship of that member of the Godhead if he or she keeps the commandments.
“We look to not only the spiritual but also the temporal, and we believe that a person who is impoverished temporally cannot blossom spiritually.” Keith McMullin - Counsellor in Presiding Bishopric
"One, two, three...let's go shopping!" Thomas S Monson - Prophet, Seer, Revelator