The Person and Nature of Jesus in the Book of Mormon

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[_Mittens]

Sounds like the Book of Mormon is teaching abdominal doctrines

An abridgment taken from the Book of Ether also, which is a record of the people of Jared, who were scattered at the time the Lord confounded the language of the people, when they were building a tower to get to heaven—Which is to show unto the remnant of the house of Israel what great things the Lord hath done for their fathers; and that they may know the covenants of the Lord, that they are not cast off forever—And also to the convincing of the Jew and Gentile that Jesus is the Christ, the Eternal God , manifesting himself unto all nations—And now, if there are faults they are the mistakes of men; wherefore, condemn not the things of God, that ye may be found spotless at the judgment-seat of Christ.

Translated by Joseph Smith, Jun.


2 Nephi 26:12 And as I spake concerning the convincing of the Jews, that Jesus is the very Christ, it must needs be that the Gentiles be convinced also that Jesus is the Christ, the Eternal God ;


Mosiah 5:5 For behold, the time cometh, and is not far distant, that with power, the Lord Omnipotent who reigneth, who was, and is from all eternity to all eternity, shall come down from heaven among the children of men, and shall dwell in a tabernacle of clay, and shall go forth amongst men, working mighty miracles, such as healing the sick, raising the dead, causing the lame to walk, the blind to receive their sight, and the deaf to hear, and curing all manner of diseases.

Mosiah 5:15 Therefore, I would that ye should be steadfast and immovable, always abounding in good works, that Christ, the Lord God Omnipotent , may seal you his, that you may be brought to heaven, that ye may have everlasting salvation and eternal life, through the wisdom, and power, and justice, and mercy of him who created all things, in heaven and in earth, who is God above all . Amen.

3 Nephi 19:18 And behold, they began to pray;
and they did pray unto Jesus, calling him
their Lord and their God.


Sounds exactly like the Creeds of the 4th and 5th century

Pearl of Great Price verse 19 Joseph Smith

19 I was answered that I must join none of them, for they were all awrong; and the Personage who addressed me said that all their creeds were an abomination in his sight;



These verses from the Book of Mormon sounds just like they came from the Creeds, here's a few more



2 Nephi 31:
21 And now, behold, my beloved brethren, this is the way; and there is none other way nor name given under heaven whereby man can be saved in the kingdom of God. And now, behold, this is the doctrine of Christ, and the only and true doctrine of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost, which is one God , without end. Amen.


Alma 11:
44 Now, this restoration shall come to all, both old and young, both bond and free, both male and female, both the wicked and the righteous; and even there shall not so much as a hair of their heads be lost; but everything shall be restored to its perfect frame, as it is now, or in the body, and shall be brought and be arraigned before the bar of Christ the Son, and God the Father, and the Holy Spirit, which is one Eternal God , to be judged according to their works, whether they be good or whether they be evil.

Mormon 7:
7 And he hath brought to pass the redemption of the world, whereby he that is found guiltless before him at the judgment day hath it given unto him to dwell in the presence of God in his kingdom, to sing ceaseless praises with the choirs above, unto the Father, and unto the Son, and unto the Holy Ghost, which are one God , in a state of happiness which hath no end.

The Testimony of Three Witnesses
And the honor be to the Father, and to the Son, and to the Holy Ghost, which is one God . Amen.
Oliver Cowdery
David Whitmer
Martin Harris

Doctrine and Covenants 20 :
28 Which Father, Son, and Holy Ghost are one God, infinite and eternal, without end. Amen.

[_Bazooka]

I'll accept your perspective...but whatever a "real" Mormon is, Tobin isclearly not it.

I'm not sure that's fair on Tobin.
One can be classed as a Mormon but have less than orthodox beliefs.

“Members of the Church vary in their levels of participation or belief. Latter-day Saints who have seriously contravened or ignored cardinal Church teachings (publicly or privately) are considered apostates, whether or not they have officially left the Church or affiliated with another religion” (Encyclopedia of Mormonism [1992], 1:59).

I actually think Tobin's view on what constitutes "the Church of Christ" is probably something that sits with me better than Mormonism's "we are the one and only true Church" philosophy. Tobin has stated a number of times that, in his opinion, the Church of Christ is the collection of people who follow Christ's teachings in practice, regardless of which denomination of religion (if indeed, any religion) they have chosen to utilise as a mechanism of showing worship and respect to Christ.
But that doesn't mean Tobin isn't a Mormon, just that he isn't an orthodox Mormon.

(Tobin, I hope I haven't misrepresented your view)

[_Albion]

McTavish, what exactly in my post do you find contrary to the definition of a "real" TBM that I gave. It is the one used by the Mormon Church itself in defining who exactly measures up to their standard. If there is some other official yardstick perhaps you will provide it. I am here because I have an interest in religion and particularly that aspect which separates Mormonism from accepted Christianity. I have lived with and around Mormons and Mormonism at its very heart and believe that knowledge is useful in giving them pause to relook at their doctrine and beliefs. Now you may find that objectionable or time wasting, so be it, but I do enjoy jousting with them based on common interest. How is that any different from your being here as someone who has stated that he finds all religion suffering from the same nonsensical foundation., Why exactly are you here and how is you presence fundamentally different?

[_Albion]

Your point is taken, Bazooka, but I am using the Mormon Church's own standard as my definition. If that standard is incorrect then perhaps they should change it.

[_Tobin]

Your point is taken, Bazooka, but I am using the Mormon Church's own standard as my definition. If that standard is incorrect then perhaps they should change it.

I think you are missing the point that it is changing. The LDS Church is slow to change and the current leadership is not willing (for a number of reasons) to admit when they are wrong. I'm sure it is pretty obvious to most people that they are walking away from the teaching that man will someday be God. You need look no further than GBH's interview with Larry King to see that.

[_Albion]

If the Mormon Church is abandoning a false teaching, I am glad to hear it.

[_Bazooka]

Your point is taken, Bazooka, but I am using the Mormon Church's own standard as my definition. If that standard is incorrect then perhaps they should change it.

I think you are missing the point that it is changing. The LDS Church is slow to change and the current leadership is not willing (for a number of reasons) to admit when they are wrong. I'm sure it is pretty obvious to most people that they are walking away from the teaching that man will someday be God. You need look no further than GBH's interview with Larry King to see that.

Here is the current position of the Church:

Do Latter-day Saints believe they can become “gods”?
Latter-day Saints believe that God wants us to become like Him. But this teaching is often misrepresented by those who caricature the faith. The Latter-day Saint belief is no different than the biblical teaching, which states, “The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: and if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together” (Romans 8:16-17). Through following Christ's teachings, Latter-day Saints believe all people can become "partakers of the divine nature" (2 Peter 1:4).

http://www.mormonnewsroom.org/article/mormonism-101#C13

[_Albion]

We are talking at cross purposes. My quote you use above was directed at the definition (the one I use is the Mormon's own definition) of a true believing Mormon. On the subject of Godhood, I am willing to accept that the Mormon position is perhaps changing. It wasn't always so..."As man is God once was...as God is, man may become." This implies more than a sampling of the divine nature.