Marlin K Jensen: Large numbers NOT apostatizing

[_Franktalk]

Equality,

I was just showing what was available. Those who desire numbers can find some. If you seek more it is at the Church's discretion. I was surprised to find what I did.

Many of the numbers may be subjective. Why get in an argument on who to count and who not to. It is all a waste of time. People will find fault with anything. People will make up their own numbers. Nothing will change. Why invite a distraction?

[_Gentile Persuasion]

Why would the church provide the data, to what end would it be released? ... Why would the Church help the world? It makes no sense.

I agree. The church should be permitted to remain focused on its avowed purpose: proclaiming the truth and helping the world.

[_Themis]

The Mormon church should just reform the membership roles. IF they haven't seen someone in some period of time (say a year), just automatically kick them off the roles. IF they want to come back and be reinstated, they can ask to be.

Some religions actually do this. I don't think the church should have to. They can do it how they like. It's just good to know when trying to compare to other groups who may do things differently.

Membership should be a privilege, not a trap and people don't value free or cheap either. For example, I was an ex-mormon atheist and living far outside the "norms" of Mormonism for almost 10 years. During that period, I was hardly a good example of what being a Mormon is all about and certainly an embarrassment to the church.

Not at all. I don't think the church worries about it's image that much with less active members.

IF I were an "active" Mormon, I would find that highly insulting and ridiculous.

Most members are not insulted by members who do not live an LDS lifestyle. You seem to be indicating you are still not an active member.

Also, there is no good reason for the church to not report the "true" numbers of members of the church.

They may not give much detail about membership records, but I see no reason to doubt their numbers as being accurate. They just count everyone who is baptized whether they attend or not.

I'm sure it is probably around a million "active" members anyway, and allowing their critics (a.k.a. as "enemies" in Mormon-lingo) to conjecture about that number is just as destructive.

You can look at some of the numbers from governments, etc to get a basic idea, which I think would be around 4-5 million world wide who attend at least some of the time.

[_bcspace]

The Mormon church should just reform the membership roles. IF they haven't seen someone in some period of time (say a year), just automatically kick them off the roles.

I generally agree. The problem is the notion and doctrine of rescue which is found in 3 Nephi. The Church does not keep these members on the rolls to stack the numbers, the Church actually believes it's own doctrine and that whatever spiritual experiences someone once had are real and can be referred to and restored in the process of rescue.

[_bcspace]

You can look at some of the numbers from governments, etc to get a basic idea, which I think would be around 4-5 million world wide who attend at least some of the time.

I don't think polls necessarily catch the true percentage. The rolls, usually being at or near 50% attendance, indicate more like 7 million actives and 4.6 million temple going and tithe paying. Subtract for Democrats and other liberals, and there are perhaps 3.7 million TBMs.

[_SteelHead]

Did you subtract Pres. Fuast out of those numbers?

How about Jensen?

[_Themis]

I don't think polls necessarily catch the true percentage. The rolls, usually being at or near 50% attendance, indicate more like 7 million actives and 4.6 million temple going and tithe paying. Subtract for Democrats and other liberals, and there are perhaps 3.7 million TBMs.

Are you assuming 50% attendance out side of the US?

[_SteelHead]

Nah, he is just inventing statistics. The worldwide percentage for active member is less than 30%. The percentage of adults that hold recommends among eligible adults is even lower.

A huge number of members were baptized in Brazil and Chile who do not even know which church they were baptized into and were never seen again after their baptisms.

[_Tobin]

Most members are not insulted by members who do not live an LDS lifestyle. You seem to be indicating you are still not an active member.

I am not. I have come back, but go only occasionally for the sacrament. I've still got a long way to go before I can really go much further with the church. I have a lot of my past I'm still dealing with.

[_Themis]

I am not. I have come back, but go only occasionally for the sacrament. I've still got a long way to go before I can really go much further with the church. I have a lot of my past I'm still dealing with.

Well I hope things go well for you.