Why do Mormons want to be called Christian?

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_sr1030
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Re: Why do Mormons want to be called Christian?

Post by _sr1030 »

maklelan wrote:
sr1030 wrote:Don't tell me what I am saying. I am quite capable of that myself. The LDS Church will not be pitied with this. It is very hypocritical of the LDS Church to cry foul at this when their entire existence rests on nothing but a complete and total apostasy of the church in the early 19th century.

sr


So you are kicking us out of the club only because you think we're being mean to you. Bravo.


LDS were never in the club, they have been fighting to get in it since their inception.

I never stated or inferred that LDS were being mean to me. That is entirely a notion of your own invention. I will again state the obvious, that LDS are hypocritical to cry foul with this issue.

sr
_Brackite
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Re: Why do Mormons want to be called Christian?

Post by _Brackite »

sleepyhead wrote:
Hello Moksha,

Your free to view yourself as anything you want. The problem comes in conversing with others. We converse in the English language and it's important that each word has the same meaning to both the person speaking and to the one hearing. When someone claims to be a Christian to other people these people assume that Jesus is there savior. This appears to be pretty much the universal understanding of the word. When your salvation, or in the case of the LDS, exaltation, hinges on taking part in various ceremonies in the temple, and when in order to take part in these "saving ordinances" you need to gain approval from the church (or their representative) then the church is their savior.


Hello sleepyhead,

Yes, You are correct. LDS Members (Especially LDS Men) Need to receive certain ordinances in order to get saved.
According to LDS Theology, A Man must receive six ordinances in order to receive a fulness of salvation.
Here are the six ordinances that a man must receive in order to receive a fulness of salvation.

1. A Man must be Baptized by immersion by one holding the “Proper” Priesthood Authority.
2. A Man must be Confirmed a member of the LDS Church and receive the gift of the Holy Ghost by the laying on of "Authoritative" hands.
3. A Man must be ordained to the Aaronic Priesthood.
4. A Man must be ordained to the Melchizedek Priesthood.
5. A Man must receive his Temple Endowments within an "House of the Lord" (An LDS Temple).
6. A Man must be Married for time and for all of eternity within an "House of the Lord" (An LDS Temple).

As LDS President Ezra Taft Benson once stated to the Single Adult Brethren of the Church:

Understand that temple marriage is essential to your salvation and exaltation.
"And I've said it before, you want to know what Joseph Smith looked like in Nauvoo, just look at Trump." - Fence Sitter
_LittleNipper
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Re: Why do Mormons want to be called Christian?

Post by _LittleNipper »

1. A Man must be Baptized by immersion by one holding the “Proper” Priesthood Authority.


I love this one! :rolleyes: I can only imagine what the temple priests thought of John the Baptist.
_maklelan
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Re: Why do Mormons want to be called Christian?

Post by _maklelan »

sr1030 wrote:LDS were never in the club, they have been fighting to get in it since their inception.


Have they? Please provide some documentation for this.

sr1030 wrote:I never stated or inferred that LDS were being mean to me. That is entirely a notion of your own invention. I will again state the obvious, that LDS are hypocritical to cry foul with this issue.


You commented earlier, "Apparently you think churches should be content with the LDS claim that our creeds are an abomination." Yes, you are whining that the LDS Church is being mean to you.
I like you Betty...

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_sr1030
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Re: Why do Mormons want to be called Christian?

Post by _sr1030 »

sr1030 wrote:LDS were never in the club, they have been fighting to get in it since their inception.


maklelan wrote:Have they? Please provide some documentation for this.


No. You simply want me to take the time to show you something you already know.

sr1030 wrote:I never stated or inferred that LDS were being mean to me. That is entirely a notion of your own invention. I will again state the obvious, that LDS are hypocritical to cry foul with this issue.


maklelan wrote:You commented earlier, "Apparently you think churches should be content with the LDS claim that our creeds are an abomination." Yes, you are whining that the LDS Church is being mean to you.


That's not whining. I really don't care what LDS think of me or my church. I made the point I intended to make. Simple hypocrisy on the part of LDS and the LDS Church.

It is really starting to look as though you have no real substance in your posts. I won't respond to much of this if it continues.

sr
_jordon3
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Re: Why do Mormons want to be called Christian?

Post by _jordon3 »

sr1030 wrote:
sr1030 wrote:LDS were never in the club, they have been fighting to get in it since their inception.


Ha SR1030, does this look like Christians and Mormons are in the same club?

The Mormon God and the Christians God aren't even of the same species....no where no how!

The god of Mormonism is one of many gods.........The Christian God is only ONE
The god of Mormonism is NOT self-existent.........The Christian God IS self-existent..
The god of Mormonism is NOT transcendent .........The Christian God IS transcendent
The god of Mormonism is NOT immutable......... The Christian God IS immutable.
The god of Mormonism is NOT eternally God........... The Christian God IS eternally God
The god of Mormonism is NOT incorporeal......... The Christian God IS incorporeal.
The god of Mormonism is NOT omnipresent.......... The Christian God IS omnipresent.
The god of Mormonism cannot dwell in the believer......The God of Christianity DOES dwell in believers
The god of Mormonism is NOT omnipotent..............The Christian God IS omnipotent
The god of Mormonism does not forgive completely.........The Christian God DOES forgive completely
_Bazooka
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Re: Why do Mormons want to be called Christian?

Post by _Bazooka »

Jason15 wrote:The Mormon God and the Christians God aren't even of the same species....no where no how!

The god of Mormonism is one of many gods.........The Christian God is only ONE
The god of Mormonism is NOT self-existent.........The Christian God IS self-existent..
The god of Mormonism is NOT transcendent .........The Christian God IS transcendent
The god of Mormonism is NOT immutable......... The Christian God IS immutable.
The god of Mormonism is NOT eternally God........... The Christian God IS eternally God
The god of Mormonism is NOT incorporeal......... The Christian God IS incorporeal.
The god of Mormonism is NOT omnipresent.......... The Christian God IS omnipresent.
The god of Mormonism cannot dwell in the believer......The God of Christianity DOES dwell in believers
The god of Mormonism is NOT omnipotent..............The Christian God IS omnipotent
The god of Mormonism does not forgive completely.........The Christian God DOES forgive completely


Isn't the debate about which Jesus people believe in, rather than which Heavenly Father?
That said, with the Book of Mormon, we are not dealing with a civilization with no written record. What we are dealing with is a written record with no civilization. (Runtu, Feb 2015)
_LittleNipper
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Re: Why do Mormons want to be called Christian?

Post by _LittleNipper »

Bazooka wrote:
Jason15 wrote:The Mormon God and the Christians God aren't even of the same species....no where no how!

The god of Mormonism is one of many gods.........The Christian God is only ONE
The god of Mormonism is NOT self-existent.........The Christian God IS self-existent..
The god of Mormonism is NOT transcendent .........The Christian God IS transcendent
The god of Mormonism is NOT immutable......... The Christian God IS immutable.
The god of Mormonism is NOT eternally God........... The Christian God IS eternally God
The god of Mormonism is NOT incorporeal......... The Christian God IS incorporeal.
The god of Mormonism is NOT omnipresent.......... The Christian God IS omnipresent.
The god of Mormonism cannot dwell in the believer......The God of Christianity DOES dwell in believers
The god of Mormonism is NOT omnipotent..............The Christian God IS omnipotent
The god of Mormonism does not forgive completely.........The Christian God DOES forgive completely


Isn't the debate about which Jesus people believe in, rather than which Heavenly Father?

I'm not sure, perhaps we should ask God's wife, "Wisdom" for her opinion... :rolleyes:
_maklelan
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Re: Why do Mormons want to be called Christian?

Post by _maklelan »

Bazooka wrote:Isn't the debate about which Jesus people believe in, rather than which Heavenly Father?


I would argue that it's not "which Jesus," but rather what Jesus' mission was, but your observation highlights an important aspect of the whole question. I have noticed that the less careful and perceptive opponents of the notion that Mormons are Christians tend to craft their definition of Christianity, or their argument against Mormonism, based not on what they actually believe the central tenets of Christianity to be, but rather what they consider the most important differences between Mormonism and mainstream Christianity to be. In other words, they start from the presupposition that Mormons are not Christians and then draw the boundaries of Christianity between those differences. The final definition is thus artificial and inaccurate. Sometimes it even fails to distinguish Christianity from Judaism or Islam, as was the case when James White and I went back on forth on this issue:

His definition of Christianity must be easily contrasted with Mormonism and must focus exclusively on those aspects of his brand of Christianity which distinguish it. It must be crafted with the goal of differentiation in mind. Defining Christianity in preparation for tackling the question of whether or not Mormonism is Christian by explaining how Christianity is distinguished from Mormonism is a textbook example of begging the question. James’ conclusion is assumed in his premise.


He gets to define Christianity and what the Bible says, and the lines he draws have a specific purpose: to exclude a single group. This is why his defining issues don’t actually distinguish Christianity from Judaism or Islam. They only place Mormonism, as far as James understands it, outside of the circle.
I like you Betty...

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_jordon3
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Re: Why do Mormons want to be called Christian?

Post by _jordon3 »

maklelan wrote:
Bazooka wrote:Isn't the debate about which Jesus people believe in, rather than which Heavenly Father?


I would argue that it's not "which Jesus," but rather what Jesus' mission was, but your observation highlights an important aspect of the whole question. I have noticed that the less careful and perceptive opponents of the notion that Mormons are Christians tend to craft their definition of Christianity, or their argument against Mormonism, based not on what they actually believe the central tenets of Christianity to be, but rather what they consider the most important differences between Mormonism and mainstream Christianity to be. In other words, they start from the presupposition that Mormons are not Christians and then draw the boundaries of Christianity between those differences. The final definition is thus artificial and inaccurate. Sometimes it even fails to distinguish Christianity from Judaism or Islam, as was the case when James White and I went back on forth on this issue:

His definition of Christianity must be easily contrasted with Mormonism and must focus exclusively on those aspects of his brand of Christianity which distinguish it. It must be crafted with the goal of differentiation in mind. Defining Christianity in preparation for tackling the question of whether or not Mormonism is Christian by explaining how Christianity is distinguished from Mormonism is a textbook example of begging the question. James’ conclusion is assumed in his premise.


He gets to define Christianity and what the Bible says, and the lines he draws have a specific purpose: to exclude a single group. This is why his defining issues don’t actually distinguish Christianity from Judaism or Islam. They only place Mormonism, as far as James understands it, outside of the circle.


Jason25 wrote: Daddy Maklelan your blabbering away here has nothing to do with the two specificquestions Megacles had asked me. I answered him. I described what Christians believe the nature of God to be and how this directly opposes the Mormon god. Your response is out of line. By the way stop making assumptions. This is not my definition. I merely pointed out the glaring differences.

My God the Mormon Church can't even come up with an sensible ration answer to Joseph Smiths Book of Abraham claims. Joseph Smiths fabrication of the nature of God is the antithesis of the Christian God. This whole concept of the Mormon God came from Joseph Smith's head...it stand and falls on that head. Maklelan you can argue all you want that it's not "which Jesus," but rather what Jesus' mission was. That wasn't Megacles question.
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