The Book of Mormon contridicts Mormonism

[_consiglieri]

Brackbite, you don't get credit because you failed to fully quote the verses involved and as a result provided a distorted comparison. That was very naughty of you.

And you failed to phrase your answer in the form of a question.

[_seven7up]

Okay, let's try this a different way.

If an individual is born in this life without knowledge of Mormonism. Does someone, such as a Missionary or other Mormon, teaching them about Mormonism and giving them that knowledge make it easier for them to navigate this life in such a way as to be worthy of exaltation after they are dead? Or does it make it harder?

Clue: It makes it harder.

If God places that particular individual in the position to accept the restored gospel, then it is better for that individual to accept it and live it.

Simple.

-7up

[_Bazooka]

Okay, let's try this a different way.

If an individual is born in this life without knowledge of Mormonism. Does someone, such as a Missionary or other Mormon, teaching them about Mormonism and giving them that knowledge make it easier for them to navigate this life in such a way as to be worthy of exaltation after they are dead? Or does it make it harder?

Clue: It makes it harder.

If God places that particular individual in the position to accept the restored gospel, then it is better for that individual to accept it and live it.

Simple.

-7up

You are doing everything you can to avoid addressing the my actual question.
I know why.
You know why.
People reading the thread know why.

[_seven7up]

You are doing everything you can to avoid addressing the my actual question.
...
People reading the thread know why.

That depends.

If they actually read and understood the answers I gave you, then they understand that I answered your question a long time ago.

For you and the others, I suppose I will have to break it down nice and slow.

- - - - - - - - - - Here we go - - - - - - - - - - - -
When God is dealing with a specific individual, that individual is placed within the specific "bounds" in mortality. This may mean a certain part of the world, or a certain time in history, and even a specific family.

God knows why each spirit was placed specifically when and where they were placed. We can only understand on a basic level that each individual was placed where they were because of different characteristics pertaining to each person.

I should do the best I can and make correct choices within the bounds of my mortal probation. That is what every individual should do. That concept is simple enough.

Now, it appears that you are trying to make the assertion that a certain individual, let's say someone born in China in the year 1656, get's a "free pass" because that person never had the opportunity to accept the restored gospel. And since that person never had the opportunity to accept the restored gospel, they didn't have to deal with all of these "tough rules" that Mormons are supposed to live by.

Before we continue, Am I correct that this is the kind of argument you are attempting here?

-7up

[_Bazooka]

When God is dealing with a specific individual, that individual is placed within the specific "bounds" in mortality. This may mean a certain part of the world, or a certain time in history, and even a specific family.

God knows why each spirit was placed specifically when and where they were placed. We can only understand on a basic level that each individual was placed where they were because of different characteristics pertaining to each person.

I should do the best I can and make correct choices within the bounds of my mortal probation. That is what every individual should do. That concept is simple enough.

Okay, so now all you have to do is attempt to explain the rationale for God placing some spirits for example, into Hermaphrodite bodies. Then explain how Hermaphrodites can make correct choices with regards to sexuality and marriage - a fundamental requirement of God's Gospel.

Now, it appears that you are trying to make the assertion that a certain individual, let's say someone born in China in the year 1656, get's a "free pass" because that person never had the opportunity to accept the restored gospel. And since that person never had the opportunity to accept the restored gospel, they didn't have to deal with all of these "tough rules" that Mormons are supposed to live by.

Before we continue, Am I correct that this is the kind of argument you are attempting here?

-7up

Not a 'free pass' per se.
But at the point they are exposed to the Gospel they have enjoyed a life without limits on behaviour and they have the benefit of knowing for sure there is indeed a next life, because they are in it! But for the example let's use someone born in the USA in 1965 but who never gets exposed to the Gospel during their lifetime.

[_seven7up]

When God is dealing with a specific individual, that individual is placed within the specific "bounds" in mortality. This may mean a certain part of the world, or a certain time in history, and even a specific family.

God knows why each spirit was placed specifically when and where they were placed. We can only understand on a basic level that each individual was placed where they were because of different characteristics pertaining to each person.

I should do the best I can and make correct choices within the bounds of my mortal probation. That is what every individual should do. That concept is simple enough.

Okay, so now all you have to do is attempt to explain the rationale for God placing some spirits for example, into Hermaphrodite bodies.

No. I don't have to explain it. God only knows. Then the subsequent decisions are between that individual and God.

Now, it appears that you are trying to make the assertion that a certain individual, let's say someone born in China in the year 1656, get's a "free pass" because that person never had the opportunity to accept the restored gospel. And since that person never had the opportunity to accept the restored gospel, they didn't have to deal with all of these "tough rules" that Mormons are supposed to live by.

Before we continue, Am I correct that this is the kind of argument you are attempting here?

Not a 'free pass' per se.
But at the point they are exposed to the Gospel they have enjoyed a life without limits on behaviour ....

For starters, your assumption that those not exposed to the gospel are "without limits on behavior" is nonsense. Of course they have limits on behavior from a variety of sources, including the culture and society in which they live. Then there is the Apostle Paul's teaching:

"Even Gentiles, who do not have God's written law, show that they know his law when they instinctively obey it, even without having heard it." (Rom 2:14)

Now, LDS interpret this as meaning that people, in general, have a conscious. People, in general, know that they should not lie, for example.

... and they have the benefit of knowing for sure there is indeed a next life, because they are in it!

If people reject spiritual truths in this life, what makes you think they will accept them in the next? Perhaps even in the spiritual world there is are ways to misinterpret truth or reject it , or even temptation and spiritual opposition.

But for the example let's use someone born in the USA in 1965 but who never gets exposed to the Gospel during their lifetime.

O.K. let's use that example. Go ahead and present your case.

-7up

[_ludwigm]

I don't have to explain it. God only knows. Then the subsequent decisions are between that individual and God.

Did You read this: ?

Go ahead and present your case.
-7up

This is.
Please don't read the wikipedia entry about that book! It was written by an illiterate...

Read THE BOOK instead!

[_Bazooka]

But for the example let's use someone born in the USA in 1965 but who never gets exposed to the Gospel during their lifetime.

O.K. let's use that example. Go ahead and present your case.

-7up

You mean "go ahead and present your case....again".

Man A - born 1965 in Texas, lives his life without coming into contact with the LDS Gospel. Dies.
Man B - born 1965 in Texas, lives his life but rejects the missionaries at his door, out of hand as he isn't interested in religion. Dies.
Man C - born 1965 in Texas, lives his life within the LDS Gospel (baptised at 8 etc) but fails to live up to the standards required. Dies.

Which Man (according to LDS doctrine) is in better standing with God at the point at which he dies?


*please, before you go off on your tangents, just answer this^ simple question. Based solely on what I have told you about them, is it man A, B or C?

[_subgenius]

You mean "go ahead and present your case....again".

Man A - born 1965 in Texas, lives his life without coming into contact with the LDS Gospel. Dies.
Man B - born 1965 in Texas, lives his life but rejects the missionaries at his door, out of hand as he isn't interested in religion. Dies.
Man C - born 1965 in Texas, lives his life within the LDS Gospel (baptised at 8 etc) but fails to live up to the standards required. Dies.

Which Man (according to LDS doctrine) is in better standing with God at the point at which he dies?


*please, before you go off on your tangents, just answer this^ simple question. Based solely on what I have told you about them, is it man A, B or C?

Your question is a trick because it is already answered in Matthew 7:1-3 and 3 Nephi 14:1-3

King James Version:
Matthew 7:1-2

1 Judge not, that ye be not judged.

2 For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.

3 And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?se ... ersion=KJV

Book of Mormon:
3 Nephi 14:1-3

1 And now it came to pass that when Jesus had spoken these words he turned again to the multitude, and did open his mouth unto them again, saying: Verily, verily, I say unto you, Judge not, that ye be not judged.

2 For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged; and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.

3 And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother’s eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?
https://www.LDS.org/scriptures/Book of Mormon/3-ne/14?lang=eng

[_The Erotic Apologist]

Your question is a trick because...blah...blah...blah...blah...

So which is it, Subby? A, B, or C?