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So as not to derail the thread on the Book of Mormon I'm starting this thread to address a question:

What do believers do with conflicting testimony?

On the Book of Mormon thread, Hope of Zion stated that he had a powerful spiritual witness that the Book of Mormon lands were in North America.

Of course this conflicts with many other believers who currently go with the LGT.

Do believers discount the HG witness of those like HoZ who believe in the HGT?

There are those with a strong testimony of the HTG and I'm assuming there are those with a testimony of the LGT?

Have believers in the LGT ever prayed about their theory? Did anyone get a witness from the HG that it was true?

(It seems that a witness may be a good thing to do before wasting time and effort supporting a theory that is not true..no)?

Charity seemed to discount HoZ's testimony suggesting it was speculation... however I'm guessing that believers in the HGT also discount the attempts of those who are trying to support the LGT.

I'm not interested in the idea that it doesn't matter where the Book of Mormon lands were... this is not the point of the thread.

I'm wondering how believers deal with conflicting testimony?

Is the HG inaccurate? Do humans mistake truth from the HG? Does the HG give conflicting messages?

~dancer~

TD,

I think there are some that are more spiritually sensitive than others. They come from all backgrounds including some from the Mormon church.

I don't think there is just one ghost or a "holy" ghost.

Even the Book of Mormon referres to other ghosts: those crying from the dust for various things from vengeance toward their murderers to testifying of various truths.

Just because someone is "spiritual" doesn't necessarilly mean they understand who the spirit is and what they are testifying of. Who said that just because a person dies means they will tell the truth or even know the truth?

Are Mormons and even our relatives that have passed on far from us? Some say they are not. Are they any closer to the truth of things or do we only assume so? Why do some claim to feel peace in a Mormon temple compared to other places? Perhaps there are decent folk that pass on that still think they are doing temple work.

Anyways, my take is that there is quite a bit of static that comes from the other side - regardless of whether they come in the form of dreams, visions or impressions.

Physical evidence ought to confirm what we think has been testified to us. Otherwise, what we think we know or have faith in bears little significance.

Kind of a round-a-bout way of answering your question but I think it bears some relevance.

truth dancer wrote:So as not to derail the thread on the Book of Mormon I'm starting this thread to address a question:

What do believers do with conflicting testimony?

We do not confront anyone or tell them their experience is not valid.

truth dancer wrote:On the Book of Mormon thread, Hope of Zion stated that he had a powerful spiritual witness that the Book of Mormon lands were in North America.

Of course this conflicts with many other believers who currently go with the LGT.

Do believers discount the HG witness of those like HoZ who believe in the HGT?

There are those with a strong testimony of the HTG and I'm assuming there are those with a testimony of the LGT?

I would hope that no one bothers the Holy Ghost to gain a testimony of something that doesn't matter. If you know the Book of Mormon is true from a witness of the Spirit, that is all you need. You don't need to find the name Zarahemla carved on a stone ruin in Central America. Or upper Michigan. Or anywhere else.

truth dancer wrote:Have believers in the LGT ever prayed about their theory? Did anyone get a witness from the HG that it was true?

I hope not.

truth dancer wrote:(It seems that a witness may be a good thing to do before wasting time and effort supporting a theory that is not true..no)?

Charity seemed to discount HoZ's testimony suggesting it was speculation... however I'm guessing that believers in the HGT also discount the attempts of those who are trying to support the LGT.

I said I would not dispute HOZ's testimony. And I don't think this is worth aruging over. Dr. Sorenson published his work and repeatedly said this is what he thinks. Wayne May can publish his work, give lectures, etc. all he wants. IT DOESN'T MATTER.

truth dancer wrote:I'm not interested in the idea that it doesn't matter where the Book of Mormon lands were... this is not the point of the thread.

I'm wondering how believers deal with conflicting testimony?

Is the HG inaccurate? Do humans mistake truth from the HG? Does the HG give conflicting messages?

I have never heard anyone, before HOZ, who said they had a testimony of any geographical, archeological, anthropological facts.

The Holy Ghost is always accurate. The Holy Ghost does not give witnsses to conflicting truths. We mortal fallible humans may misunderstand what the Holy Ghost sends.

I think it is possible that HOZ received a testimony that the Book of Mormon lands were on the North American Continent. I believe that. After all , the Mes-American area IS in North America.

ch#%$ty wrote:The Holy Ghost is always accurate. The Holy Ghost does not give witnsses to conflicting truths. We mortal fallible humans may misunderstand what the Holy Ghost sends.

The the Holy Ghost is always accurate yet misunderstood?

Who confirmed that to you, the Holy Ghost or a confused mortal? Are you sure you didn't misunderstand?

I'm 45 years old. Who has better command of my language to convey a message that can be accurately understood? Where ought the burden lie? A perfect being or a mortal?

Is it my fault he slurs his words and leaves out vowels? Perhaps God gives the Holy Ghost weakness to make him humble? At who's expense?

Accurate: precise, to the point, dead on, unwaivering, clear, misunderstood, exact, without question, infallable, correct...

Inconceivable wrote:

ch#%$ty wrote:The Holy Ghost is always accurate. The Holy Ghost does not give witnsses to conflicting truths. We mortal fallible humans may misunderstand what the Holy Ghost sends.

The the Holy Ghost is always accurate yet misunderstood?

Who confirmed that to you, the Holy Ghost or a confused mortal? Are you sure you didn't misunderstand?

I'm 45 years old. Who has better command of my language to convey a message that can be accurately understood? Where ought the burden lie? A perfect being or a mortal?

Is it my fault he slurs his words and leaves out vowels? Perhaps God gives the Holy Ghost weakness to make him humble? At who's expense?

Accurate: precise, to the point, dead on, unwaivering, clear, misunderstood, exact, without question, infallable, correct...

Have you ever given a child very precise instructions and had him get it wrong?

charity wrote:Have you ever given a child very precise instructions and had him get it wrong?

We are not children.

Until you admit that it's possible you have misunderstood, misinterpreted, mistook the message the Holy Ghost has delivered to you, you cannot claim that anyone whose testimony conflicts with yours is wrong.

harmony wrote:

charity wrote:Have you ever given a child very precise instructions and had him get it wrong?

We are not children.

When you think of all there is to learn and know, and how little of that great mass of knkowledge you actually know, doesn't it make you feel like a little child?

harmony wrote:[
Until you admit that it's possible you have misunderstood, misinterpreted, mistook the message the Holy Ghost has delivered to you, you cannot claim that anyone whose testimony conflicts with yours is wrong.

I very often mistake, misinterpret, etc. what the Holy Ghost sends to me. So far, my errors are all on the "fail to" side. I brush off something, thinking it is my own thoughts but subsequent events show that I was actually being given a message. But there are a few things that I KNOW. God will judge if I am right or not.

ch$&%ty wrote:Have you ever given a child very precise instructions and had him get it wrong?

No. Never.

Misunderstood instructions are only precise to a self proclaimed mentor in denial.

Truly the burden is upon the so called instructor.



Did something just occur to you, Ch$#@ty - or are you as smart as you'll ever be?

TD,

I would like to cite a precedent from the scriptures on how God solved such a problem to clarify one particular misunderstanding. Had not God intervened, there would be hundreds of churches that teach false doctrine concerning these very points.

Please read carefully as there is little to no room for private interpretation:

36 ¶ And as they thus spake, Jesus himself stood in the midst of them, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you.
37 But they were terrified and affrighted, and supposed that they had seen a spirit.
38 And he said unto them, Why are ye troubled? and why do thoughts arise in your hearts?
39 Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.
40 And when he had thus spoken, he shewed them his hands and his feet.
41 And while they yet believed not for joy, and wondered, he said unto them, Have ye here any meat?
42 And they gave him a piece of a broiled fish, and of an honeycomb.
43 And he took it, and did eat before them.
44 And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.
45 Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures,
46 And said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day:

(New Testament | Luke 24:36 - 46)


Till this day comes again, I suppose I will continue to wait for the further light and knowledge the Lord promised to send me.

(I may even be commended for my integrity)

Inconceivable wrote:

ch$&%ty wrote:Have you ever given a child very precise instructions and had him get it wrong?

No. Never.

Misunderstood instructions are only precise to a self proclaimed mentor in denial.

Truly the burden is upon the so called instructor.



Did something just occur to you, Ch$#@ty - or are you as smart as you'll ever be?

I can tell you have never been a school teacher. It is the responsibility of the student to learn. You know that old saw about leading a horse to water, but you can't make him drink.