I'm getting confused

[_TygerFang]

I'm new here and I've been browzing for a while, and I just decided to make a topic on one of the reasons (one of the more important ones) I've joined the site. (I'm 16 and almost 17 just to make things clearer)

I live in Utah and my entire family is a part of the Mormon church, except my sister who left the church to rebel against my mom. I've been having doubts about the church for a long time and I've really wanted to sort of work out what that means. The only problem is that there's really no where for me to do that, my family is political and extremely religous and so is my ward and neighbors, and there's really no where else that I would really want to talk about this personal of thing. So I've just been reading up on the internet and been trying to see all sides instead of just the one.

Lately I've been even more confused, and my mom has really been at the center of it. Apparently she's been having visits with my grandfather (he's been dead since before I was born), other relatives, and just had impressions or something like that. She's told me that she gets the feeling I have been looking at things I shouldn't be and that I'm sort of straying from what's rightous. She's even typed up a very personal note that my grandfather told her during the night. She's said that she's had these sort of religious experiences happen for a long time.

As I've said before I've been having questions and doubts, and I don't know what to make of what's happening recently. On one hand I didn't think my mom would be lying and just creating all this to convince me to be active in the church and find a suitable husband and have kids (I talked to her telling her that I don't want kids) on the other hand -- well I really don't know what's on the other hand. I'm not at the point where I'm thinking there isn't a god, but I don't agree with a lot of what is being said and implied at the church or really any other religions.

[_Mister Scratch]

Dear TygerFang,

First of all, please allow me to extend a warm welcome to you. I believe that you will be able to find the differing perspective you'll need in order to make up your own mind on this issues.

Secondly, would you mind perhaps laying out what it is you "don't agree with" in the Church? Perhaps some of the folks on the board can help you to sort out your thoughts.

[_TygerFang]

Dear TygerFang,

First of all, please allow me to extend a warm welcome to you. I believe that you will be able to find the differing perspective you'll need in order to make up your own mind on this issues.

Secondly, would you mind perhaps laying out what it is you "don't agree with" in the Church? Perhaps some of the folks on the board can help you to sort out your thoughts.

Thank you, and I'll list what I've been having the most problems with.

For one thing the way that they view that people should grow up to get married, have children, and that the woman should be home for the kids. Perfectly fine if the person wants to do so, but first I stated that I didn't want kids, and in response some told me straight out that it's a phase and that I will love my kids and raising them when I'm older and understand more, some in my ward that were talking to me about it wouldn't reply but whenever they were talking about children and family always ask for my imput and talk about how I would have children and care for them. My family still talks about my children and how they'll be and how my husband will be and no matter how many times I say I want to persue a career and not bear children they simply shrug it off.

Next off I'm the kind of person that believes a woman and a man are equal, and that it's wrong to limit what a woman can do or what a man can do. The fact that the man is the head of the family and the women is the supporter of the husband, that the only one that can hold the priesthood is the men, and that women are said equal but aren't allowed to hold many positions of their own but only as a support to the priesthood.

Third is basically that people that are gay are simply people with impulses, that acting on such impulses is a sin that the only things that are worse is murder and denying the holy ghost no matter how you feel, and that it'd be wrong to alow people with 'homosexual tendancy' to enter into marrage or even into a lesser civil union.

another point which isn't preached but practiced is with the young men. Basically they have to go to scouts, have to get their eagle, have to serve their mission unless physically unable, are looked down on if they really don't follow how they should with how the man takes the priesthood is assertive, and sort of act the part on how it's seen a man should act. It seems like this might just be my ward, or actually the entire area of Utah but it's really not healthy as far as I've seen. and before you ask yes I have a younger brother who's seriously struggling with this.

^ just like above except with the female role, and less pressured can also be said.

I understand no sex before marrige and no cheating afterwords, but I really don't get why on top of that there are so many other restrictions to virtually anything else to do with sex, sexual feelings, and well you get the point. I'm sure people can get addicted to or misuse things like masturbation, but that's true for almost everything else as well.

I'm also going to say that I think a religion that is true and concrete shouldn't have to change their policies and practices as the Mormon church really does, it seems to change when political and social pressures forces it to.

[_Jersey Girl]

Tyger,

You're 16? Your evaluations here appear to be far older/advanced than your years. I think your list could be broken down into separate threads for discussion. Just my 2 cents.

Welcome to the board,
Jersey Girl

[_Bond...James Bond]

Lately I've been even more confused, and my mom has really been at the center of it. Apparently she's been having visits with my grandfather (he's been dead since before I was born), other relatives, and just had impressions or something like that. She's told me that she gets the feeling I have been looking at things I shouldn't be and that I'm sort of straying from what's rightous. She's even typed up a very personal note that my grandfather told her during the night. She's said that she's had these sort of religious experiences happen for a long time.

Sounds like a guilt trip. Mormons are really into ancestor worship after a fashion (genealogy and all that jazz) and what better way to persuade you than to say that your dead grandfather told her something.

As I've said before I've been having questions and doubts, and I don't know what to make of what's happening recently. On one hand I didn't think my mom would be lying and just creating all this to convince me to be active in the church and find a suitable husband and have kids (I talked to her telling her that I don't want kids) on the other hand -- well I really don't know what's on the other hand. I'm not at the point where I'm thinking there isn't a god, but I don't agree with a lot of what is being said and implied at the church or really any other religions.

God is a really vague issue...you can believe privately and it won't cost anything or not believe (privately) and not cost anything. You can shelve the issue and worry bout it later.

What will affect you very immensely is having kids if you don't want to and how you live your life. Take it slow on that end. Don't get pressured into some marriage because you feel obliged to. YOu're not obliged to do anything in the land of the Free and the Home of the brave, well except pay some taxes. :)

[_Bond...James Bond]

For one thing the way that they view that people should grow up to get married, have children, and that the woman should be home for the kids. Perfectly fine if the person wants to do so, but first I stated that I didn't want kids, and in response some told me straight out that it's a phase and that I will love my kids and raising them when I'm older and understand more, some in my ward that were talking to me about it wouldn't reply but whenever they were talking about children and family always ask for my input and talk about how I would have children and care for them. My family still talks about my children and how they'll be and how my husband will be and no matter how many times I say I want to persue a career and not bear children they simply shrug it off.

Pursue the career! Do it. You seem like a smart young lady...kids can wait.

Next off I'm the kind of person that believes a woman and a man are equal, and that it's wrong to limit what a woman can do or what a man can do. The fact that the man is the head of the family and the women is the supporter of the husband, that the only one that can hold the priesthood is the men, and that women are said equal but aren't allowed to hold many positions of their own but only as a support to the priesthood.

They are equal! You are smart enough to know that and have already picked out the flaw in Mormon logic where people are "equal" but men are more equal. Kudos for recognizing reality and unfairness within your society.

Third is basically that people that are gay are simply people with impulses, that acting on such impulses is a sin that the only things that are worse is murder and denying the holy ghost no matter how you feel, and that it'd be wrong to alow people with 'homosexual tendancy' to enter into marrage or even into a lesser civil union.

Homophobia was perhaps the #1 reason I left organized religion (non-denominational Christianity)...I couldn't deal with hating people for being themselves (gay).

another point which isn't preached but practiced is with the young men. Basically they have to go to scouts, have to get their eagle, have to serve their mission unless physically unable, are looked down on if they really don't follow how they should with how the man takes the priesthood is assertive, and sort of act the part on how it's seen a man should act. It seems like this might just be my ward, or actually the entire area of Utah but it's really not healthy as far as I've seen. and before you ask yes I have a younger brother who's seriously struggling with this.

Another flaw you've recognized. Free will (to not go on a mission) is submissive to the groupthink of Mormonism where the mission isn't the right way, it's the ONLY way!

I understand no sex before marrige and no cheating afterwords, but I really don't get why on top of that there are so many other restrictions to virtually anything else to do with sex, sexual feelings, and well you get the point. I'm sure people can get addicted to or misuse things like masturbation, but that's true for almost everything else as well.

The reason that the Mormon leaders harp on the sexual issues is so that they can control you. If they can control you're most private actions they surely can control your public behavior. Don't let them.

I'm also going to say that I think a religion that is true and concrete shouldn't have to change their policies and practices as the Mormon church really does, it seems to change when political and social pressures forces it to.

You're a smart cookie. :) Isn't it amazing that God's One True Church is more than willing to compromise eternal principles when it's poltically expedient to do so?

[_karl61]

Welcome to the Board! Count your blessings too as most of us are a lot older and would love to have read things like this board at your age. Go slow! Read and study it out in your mind. You shall find the truth and the truth will set you free....with a little patience.

[_Gazelam]

Welcome Tyger.

I would advise you to find out for yourself if the church is true. Your at the age and mindset now where you can't live on borrowed light and/or a borrowed testimony.

The only way to know if the church is true is by the Holy Ghost. That is the entire purpose of the Holy Ghost, he exists solely to testify to us that God is real and to teach you what is true in regards to him. His names include the titles of Comforter, Sanctifier, Revelator and Spirit of Truth.

The two key words that you can relate to the Holy Ghost are Peace and Joy. He operates in your mind and heart (D&C 8:2-3) and the peaceful feeling that you get will always be associated with the knowledge of heaven.

A good experiment would be to do what the missionaries tell their investigators to do. read the Book of Mormon and then pray and ask your Father in Heaven if it is true. the traditional chapter to read is 3 Nephi chp.11. After this read Moroni 10:3-5.

Ask your question in a yes or no fashion. After you pray remain on your knees and give the Spirit time to answer your prayer.

all the best

Gaz

[_TygerFang]

thanks for all the support, from every point of view. And Gaz, thanks and I agree with you partly. I agree that I should be reading the scriptures and asking missionaries and other church authorities what they think and for advice, but I also think that I need more than just that. I think that I can't really say I believe in the church unless my questions are answered, and if I agree with those answers. You can't really belong to a religion you don't understand or agree with. And part of understanding is looking at it from every point of view, not only from church authorities but people who don't agree with or believe in the church.

[_Bond...James Bond]

Welcome Tyger.

I would advise you to find out for yourself if the church is true. Your at the age and mindset now where you can't live on borrowed light and/or a borrowed testimony.

The only way to know if the church is true is by the Holy Ghost. That is the entire purpose of the Holy Ghost, he exists solely to testify to us that God is real and to teach you what is true in regards to him. His names include the titles of Comforter, Sanctifier, Revelator and Spirit of Truth.

The two key words that you can relate to the Holy Ghost are Peace and Joy. He operates in your mind and heart (D&C 8:2-3) and the peaceful feeling that you get will always be associated with the knowledge of heaven.

A good experiment would be to do what the missionaries tell their investigators to do. read the Book of Mormon and then pray and ask your Father in Heaven if it is true. the traditional chapter to read is 3 Nephi chp.11. After this read Moroni 10:3-5.

Ask your question in a yes or no fashion. After you pray remain on your knees and give the Spirit time to answer your prayer.

all the best

Gaz

How long should she remain on her knees when she gets no answer (the only way you get an answer is if you bend down knowing you'll get one...in which case son-of-a-gun you'll get one [because you make yourself have one])?