Jesus Apostles juxtopse Joseph's
Posted: Sun Jan 26, 2014 7:00 am
http://www.utlm.org/onlinebooks/mclaims7.htm#original
Today at Church we learned about the death's of the original 12 Apostles and how this was a witness to the fact Jesus was who he said he was . All but John the beloved were killed and tortured for their witness of their testimony of Jesus. While Joseph Smith's 12 Apostles all were excommunicated or lived sorted lives. Parley Pratt was killed but only for taking a man's wife who killed him. Yet Jesus said even marrying a divorced women was adultery something Joseph and Parley were both guilty of, not marrying divorced women but married women.
LDS claim that the true church must be built upon the foundation of apostles and prophets. But, the LDS church did not have twelve apostles until five years after their church was organized! Do builders build a building for five years before laying the foundation? The LDS began ordaining their first twelve apostles on February 14, 1835 (D.H.C. Vol. II, pp. 180-200). The "three witnesses" of the B. of M. (who later apostatized) were elders and high priests in the LDS Church when they ordained the "twelve" to the higher office of "apostle." Mormons today cannot ordain someone to a higher office than what they themselves hold. The three witnesses of the B. of M. conferred the office of apostle on the twelve by "the laying on of hands" as they prayed prophetic prayers over each man separately. The apostleship they conferred is just as valid as their prophetic prayers given as they ordained the first LDS apostles. The following are some of those prophecies recorded in the D.H.C., Vol. II, pp. 188-191.
1. Lyman E. Johnson: "no power of the enemy shall prevent him from going forth and doing the work of the Lord and that he shall live until the gathering is accomplished... and he shall be like unto Enoch; ...Satan shall tremble before him and he shall see the Savior come and stand upon the earth with power and great glory." But, three years later, he apostatized and "was cut off (excommunicated) from the church" (D.H.C., Vol. III, p. 20). Furthermore, the "gathering" to Missouri (D.&C. 84:1-5), still has not taken place, and he was not like Enoch who never died (Gen. 5:24), because Johnson died in 1856 (Deseret News Church Almanac, 1989-1990, p. 49).
2. Heber C. Kimball: "many millions may be converted by his instrumentality; that angels may waft him from place to place, and that he may stand unto the coming of our Lord." But, there weren't even 85,000 Mormons when "Pres. Heber C. Kimball, first counselor to Pres. Brigham Young, died in Salt Lake City, June 22, 1868" (Essentials in Church History, p. 540). The LDS Church finally reached 1,000,000 members in 1947 which was 79 years after Kimball died. There is no record of angels "wafting" Kimball anywhere even once, and the Lord did not come before Kimball died!
3. Orson Hyde: "he 'may' (original Millennial Star, Vol. 15, p. 206 says 'shall') stand on the earth and bring souls till Christ comes... And may he be (original: 'he shall be') like one of the three Nephites." The three Nephites did not die, according to B. of M. III Nephi 28, but Orson Hyde died on November 28, 1878, in Spring City, Utah (Church Chronology by Andrew Jensen, p. 103). Thus, Hyde did not stand on the earth till Christ came.
4. David W. Patten: "May he continue till the Lord comes." But he was shot and killed on October 25, 1838 (D.H.C., Vol. III, pp. 170-171). So, he did not continue till the Lord came.
5. Luke S. Johnson: "The nations shall tremble before him... He shall bear testimony to the kings of the earth... The Ancient of Days shall pronounce this blessing, that he has been faithful and [he shall] speak all their tongues where he shall go." But, Joseph Smith recorded, "I returned to Kirtland on or about the tenth of December (1837). During my absence in Missouri, Warren Parrish, John F. Boynton, Luke S. Johnson, Joseph Coe and some others united together for the overthrow of the church. Soon after my return this dissenting band openly and publicly renounced the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (D.H.C., Vol. II, p. 528). If the prophecy was true, Luke Johnson was "faithful" when he renounced the LDS Church! There is no record of any nation trembling before him or of him bearing testimony to the kings of the earth or speaking many foreign languages.
6. William E. M'Lellin: "He may be spared until the Saints are gathered; ... the tempter shall not overcome him... his days may be prolonged until the coming of the Son of Man." But M'Lellin died April 24, 1883 (Deseret News Church Almanac 1995-1996, p. 51), and the Saints still haven't gathered (to Missouri) more than 100 years after his death. Thus, his days were not prolonged until the Son of Man came. It also sounds like the tempter overcame him because Joseph Smith said, "William E. M'Lellin was finally excommunicated from the church at Far West. Thence forward he took an active part in the persecution of the Saints in Missouri" (D.H.C., Vol. III, pp. 31-32).
7. John F. Boynton: "Thou shalt overcome all evils that are in the world... and in the flesh." But, Boynton was excommunicated from the LDS Church just two and a half years after this prophecy, in the fall of 1837 (Deseret New Church Almanac, 1995-1996, p. 51) See Luke S. Johnson prophecy (#5) for more about Boynton. Why did the LDS Church excommunicate Boynton if he overcame all evils in the world?
8. William Smith: "He shall be preserved and remain on earth until Christ shall come to take vengeance on the wicked." But he was excommunicated on October 19, 1845. He died November 13, 1893, at the age of 82 (Deseret News Church Almanac, 1995-1996, p. 51). The Lord still has not come to take vengeance on the wicked.
It does not take a theologian to see that all these are false prophecies. Heber C. Kimball said, "after we had been ordained by these brethren (the three witnesses), the First Presidency (including Joseph Smith) laid their hands on us and confirmed these blessings and ordinations, and likewise predicted many things which should come to pass" (Times and Seasons, Vol. VI, p. 868).
Can a true prophet of God "confirm" false prophecies? Or can "true apostles" be ordained by men giving false prophecies as they ordain them apostles? Yet, that is how the LDS ordained their first "Twelve Apostles." And, every LDS Apostle today was ordained by another LDS Apostle who ultimately was ordained by one of the original twelve LDS Apostles!
Today when a Mormon apostle dies, the remaining apostles select a successor who must be accepted by a vote of the membership at their annual or semi-annual conference. But, the apostles Christ chose were apostles whether or not anyone recognized them as such! Furthermore, Christ's apostles were not excommunicated as were half of the original LDS apostles!
Since Mormonism began, the LDS have had around ninety "twelve apostles." Today they have twelve apostles plus three men in the First Presidency who were apostles when they were chosen to be in the First Presidency. That makes fifteen apostles - not twelve. Their scripture also says that the Apostle John and the three Nephite apostles never died (B. of M. III Nephi 28; D. & C. 7:1-8). That makes four more apostles to count! Because the three Nephites are called "disciples" in the B. of M., some LDS claim that they were not apostles. But, if they were not apostles, Jesus established His church in America without "apostles and prophets." Therefore the B. of M. is a record of an apostate church or it is not necessary to build the church upon "apostles and prophets" as the LDS now teach! On the other hand, if the twelve B. of M. disciples were apostles, Jesus had twelve in Palestine and twelve in America at the same time. Therefore, the "true church" had 24 apostles, not twelve!
II Cor. 11:13 warns of "false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ." Jesus also commended the Church at Ephesus, saying, "thou hast tried them which say they are apostles, and are not, and hast found them liars" (Rev. 2:2). Since the Bible warns about false apostles, those who claim to be apostles should be "tried" even as the church at Ephesus tried them!
"I think no more of taking another wife than I do of buying a cow." - Apostle Heber C. Kimball, The Twenty Seventh Wife, Irving Wallace, p. 101.
and Orson Pratt was condemned for writing the Seer .
Not sure the total number of the Mormon religion's Apostles in total but haven't heard of any killed for their faith . Can a Mormon tell a story of any killed for the Joseph Smith's teachings ?
http://youtu.be/vrYVTpsAGYk
Today at Church we learned about the death's of the original 12 Apostles and how this was a witness to the fact Jesus was who he said he was . All but John the beloved were killed and tortured for their witness of their testimony of Jesus. While Joseph Smith's 12 Apostles all were excommunicated or lived sorted lives. Parley Pratt was killed but only for taking a man's wife who killed him. Yet Jesus said even marrying a divorced women was adultery something Joseph and Parley were both guilty of, not marrying divorced women but married women.
LDS claim that the true church must be built upon the foundation of apostles and prophets. But, the LDS church did not have twelve apostles until five years after their church was organized! Do builders build a building for five years before laying the foundation? The LDS began ordaining their first twelve apostles on February 14, 1835 (D.H.C. Vol. II, pp. 180-200). The "three witnesses" of the B. of M. (who later apostatized) were elders and high priests in the LDS Church when they ordained the "twelve" to the higher office of "apostle." Mormons today cannot ordain someone to a higher office than what they themselves hold. The three witnesses of the B. of M. conferred the office of apostle on the twelve by "the laying on of hands" as they prayed prophetic prayers over each man separately. The apostleship they conferred is just as valid as their prophetic prayers given as they ordained the first LDS apostles. The following are some of those prophecies recorded in the D.H.C., Vol. II, pp. 188-191.
1. Lyman E. Johnson: "no power of the enemy shall prevent him from going forth and doing the work of the Lord and that he shall live until the gathering is accomplished... and he shall be like unto Enoch; ...Satan shall tremble before him and he shall see the Savior come and stand upon the earth with power and great glory." But, three years later, he apostatized and "was cut off (excommunicated) from the church" (D.H.C., Vol. III, p. 20). Furthermore, the "gathering" to Missouri (D.&C. 84:1-5), still has not taken place, and he was not like Enoch who never died (Gen. 5:24), because Johnson died in 1856 (Deseret News Church Almanac, 1989-1990, p. 49).
2. Heber C. Kimball: "many millions may be converted by his instrumentality; that angels may waft him from place to place, and that he may stand unto the coming of our Lord." But, there weren't even 85,000 Mormons when "Pres. Heber C. Kimball, first counselor to Pres. Brigham Young, died in Salt Lake City, June 22, 1868" (Essentials in Church History, p. 540). The LDS Church finally reached 1,000,000 members in 1947 which was 79 years after Kimball died. There is no record of angels "wafting" Kimball anywhere even once, and the Lord did not come before Kimball died!
3. Orson Hyde: "he 'may' (original Millennial Star, Vol. 15, p. 206 says 'shall') stand on the earth and bring souls till Christ comes... And may he be (original: 'he shall be') like one of the three Nephites." The three Nephites did not die, according to B. of M. III Nephi 28, but Orson Hyde died on November 28, 1878, in Spring City, Utah (Church Chronology by Andrew Jensen, p. 103). Thus, Hyde did not stand on the earth till Christ came.
4. David W. Patten: "May he continue till the Lord comes." But he was shot and killed on October 25, 1838 (D.H.C., Vol. III, pp. 170-171). So, he did not continue till the Lord came.
5. Luke S. Johnson: "The nations shall tremble before him... He shall bear testimony to the kings of the earth... The Ancient of Days shall pronounce this blessing, that he has been faithful and [he shall] speak all their tongues where he shall go." But, Joseph Smith recorded, "I returned to Kirtland on or about the tenth of December (1837). During my absence in Missouri, Warren Parrish, John F. Boynton, Luke S. Johnson, Joseph Coe and some others united together for the overthrow of the church. Soon after my return this dissenting band openly and publicly renounced the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (D.H.C., Vol. II, p. 528). If the prophecy was true, Luke Johnson was "faithful" when he renounced the LDS Church! There is no record of any nation trembling before him or of him bearing testimony to the kings of the earth or speaking many foreign languages.
6. William E. M'Lellin: "He may be spared until the Saints are gathered; ... the tempter shall not overcome him... his days may be prolonged until the coming of the Son of Man." But M'Lellin died April 24, 1883 (Deseret News Church Almanac 1995-1996, p. 51), and the Saints still haven't gathered (to Missouri) more than 100 years after his death. Thus, his days were not prolonged until the Son of Man came. It also sounds like the tempter overcame him because Joseph Smith said, "William E. M'Lellin was finally excommunicated from the church at Far West. Thence forward he took an active part in the persecution of the Saints in Missouri" (D.H.C., Vol. III, pp. 31-32).
7. John F. Boynton: "Thou shalt overcome all evils that are in the world... and in the flesh." But, Boynton was excommunicated from the LDS Church just two and a half years after this prophecy, in the fall of 1837 (Deseret New Church Almanac, 1995-1996, p. 51) See Luke S. Johnson prophecy (#5) for more about Boynton. Why did the LDS Church excommunicate Boynton if he overcame all evils in the world?
8. William Smith: "He shall be preserved and remain on earth until Christ shall come to take vengeance on the wicked." But he was excommunicated on October 19, 1845. He died November 13, 1893, at the age of 82 (Deseret News Church Almanac, 1995-1996, p. 51). The Lord still has not come to take vengeance on the wicked.
It does not take a theologian to see that all these are false prophecies. Heber C. Kimball said, "after we had been ordained by these brethren (the three witnesses), the First Presidency (including Joseph Smith) laid their hands on us and confirmed these blessings and ordinations, and likewise predicted many things which should come to pass" (Times and Seasons, Vol. VI, p. 868).
Can a true prophet of God "confirm" false prophecies? Or can "true apostles" be ordained by men giving false prophecies as they ordain them apostles? Yet, that is how the LDS ordained their first "Twelve Apostles." And, every LDS Apostle today was ordained by another LDS Apostle who ultimately was ordained by one of the original twelve LDS Apostles!
Today when a Mormon apostle dies, the remaining apostles select a successor who must be accepted by a vote of the membership at their annual or semi-annual conference. But, the apostles Christ chose were apostles whether or not anyone recognized them as such! Furthermore, Christ's apostles were not excommunicated as were half of the original LDS apostles!
Since Mormonism began, the LDS have had around ninety "twelve apostles." Today they have twelve apostles plus three men in the First Presidency who were apostles when they were chosen to be in the First Presidency. That makes fifteen apostles - not twelve. Their scripture also says that the Apostle John and the three Nephite apostles never died (B. of M. III Nephi 28; D. & C. 7:1-8). That makes four more apostles to count! Because the three Nephites are called "disciples" in the B. of M., some LDS claim that they were not apostles. But, if they were not apostles, Jesus established His church in America without "apostles and prophets." Therefore the B. of M. is a record of an apostate church or it is not necessary to build the church upon "apostles and prophets" as the LDS now teach! On the other hand, if the twelve B. of M. disciples were apostles, Jesus had twelve in Palestine and twelve in America at the same time. Therefore, the "true church" had 24 apostles, not twelve!
II Cor. 11:13 warns of "false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ." Jesus also commended the Church at Ephesus, saying, "thou hast tried them which say they are apostles, and are not, and hast found them liars" (Rev. 2:2). Since the Bible warns about false apostles, those who claim to be apostles should be "tried" even as the church at Ephesus tried them!
"I think no more of taking another wife than I do of buying a cow." - Apostle Heber C. Kimball, The Twenty Seventh Wife, Irving Wallace, p. 101.
and Orson Pratt was condemned for writing the Seer .
Not sure the total number of the Mormon religion's Apostles in total but haven't heard of any killed for their faith . Can a Mormon tell a story of any killed for the Joseph Smith's teachings ?
http://youtu.be/vrYVTpsAGYk