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Our Relationship with the Lord

BRUCE R. MCCONKIE

Now, it is no secret that many false and vain and foolish things are being taught in the sectarian world and even among us about our need to gain a special relationship with the Lord Jesus. I shall summarize the true doctrine in this field and invite erring teachers and beguiled students to repent and believe the accepted gospel verities as I shall set them forth.
We worship the Father and him only and no one else. We do not worship the Son, and we do not worship the Holy Ghost. I know perfectly well what the scriptures say about worshipping Christ and Jehovah, but they are speaking in an entirely different sense--the sense of standing in awe and being reverentially grateful to him who has redeemed us.
Worship in the true and saving sense is reserved for God the first, the Creator.

https://speeches.BYU.edu/talks/bruce...tionship-lord/

https://www.LDS.org/topics/worship?lang=eng

To worship God is to give Him our love, reverence, service, and devotion. The Lord commanded Moses, "Worship God, for him only shalt thou serve" (Moses 1:15). He has also commanded, "Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, with all thy might, mind, and strength; and in the name of Jesus Christ thou shalt serve him" (D&C 59:5). Worship not only shows our love for God and commitment to Him, it gives us strength to keep His commandments. Through worship we grow in knowledge and faithfulness. If we place any person or thing above the love of God, we worship that thing or person. This is called idolatry (see Exodus 20:3–6).

Prayer is one way to worship Heavenly Father. Alma taught his son Helaman, "Cry unto God for all thy support; yea, let all thy doings be unto the Lord, and whithersoever thou goest let it be in the Lord; yea, let all thy thoughts be directed unto the Lord; yea, let the affections of thy heart be placed upon the Lord forever" (Alma 37:36).
Another way to worship Heavenly Father is to join in fellowship with others who worship Him. The Book of Mormon reveals, "The children of God were commanded that they should gather themselves together oft, and join in fasting and mighty prayer in behalf of the welfare of the souls of those who knew not God" (Alma 6:6) In more recent revelation, the Lord commanded: "That thou mayest more fully keep thyself unspotted from the world, thou shalt go to the house of prayer and offer up thy sacraments upon my holy day; for verily this is a day appointed unto you to rest from your labors, and to pay thy devotions unto the Most High" (D&C 59:9–10).

Participation in priesthood ordinances is also part of worship. As we reverently partake of the sacrament and attend the temple, we remember and worship our Heavenly Father and express our gratitude for His Son, Jesus Christ.
In addition to worshipping outwardly, we should have a worshipful attitude wherever we go and in everything we do. Alma taught this principle to a group of people who had been kept from entering their place of worship. He helped them see that true worship is not limited to one day of the week (see Alma 32:11). Speaking to the same group of people, Alma's companion Amulek encouraged them to "worship God, in whatsoever place ye may be in, in spirit and in truth" (Alma 34:38).

What's interesting they never cite the passages in the Book of Mormon that commands the Worship of Jesus, nor produce Book of Mormon verses that tell us to worship only The Father. But when does The Book of Mormon ever agree with Mormonism

2 Nephi 11: 24 And after he had said these words, he said unto me: Look! And I looked, and I beheld the Son of God going forth among the children of men; and I saw many fall down at his feet and worship him.


3 Nephi 11:17

3 Nephi 11:

13 And it came to pass that the Lord spake unto them saying:

14 Arise and come forth unto me, that ye may thrust your hands into my side, and also that ye may feel the prints of the nails in my hands and in my feet, that ye may know that I am the God of Israel, and the God of the whole earth, and have been slain for the sins of the world.

17 Hosanna! Blessed be the name of the Most High God! And they did fall down at the feet of Jesus, and did worship him.

Part of the problem is there are some LDS, who, though they would never admit it, worship Joseph Smith. There were some some LDS who worshiped Bruce McConkie- they believed he, or at least his books, were without error. I believe that a great number of LDS whorship (oops, Freudian slip ) the church.

Part of the problem is there are some LDS, who, though they would never admit it, worship Joseph Smith. There were some some LDS who worshiped Bruce McConkie- they believed he, or at least his books, were without error. I believe that a great number of LDS whorship (oops, Freudian slip ) the church.

deacon blues wrote:Part of the problem is there are some LDS, who, though they would never admit it, worship Joseph Smith. There were some some LDS who worshiped Bruce McConkie- they believed he, or at least his books, were without error. I believe that a great number of LDS whorship (oops, Freudian slip ) the church.

Very true Joseph Smith takes top position even over Jesus.

Mittens wrote:

deacon blues wrote:Part of the problem is there are some LDS, who, though they would never admit it, worship Joseph Smith. There were some some LDS who worshiped Bruce McConkie- they believed he, or at least his books, were without error. I believe that a great number of LDS whorship (oops, Freudian slip ) the church.

Very true Joseph Smith takes top position even over Jesus.

I have more to boast of than any man had. I am the only man that has ever been able to keep a whole church together since the days of Adam. A large majority of the whole have stood by me. Neither Paul, John, Peter, nor Jesus ever did it. I boast that no man ever did such work as I (History of the Church, Vol.6, pp. 408-09).

Mormons, Christians, religious adherents in general, mistakenly worship imaginary gods or leaders. There isn't much proof, if any at all, for a god as religion envisions. Their gods all seem to support the culture where they came from. Joseph Smith's god seems to be an america first guy because Joseph Smith comes from america. Judaism's god calls jews the chosen people. Muhammad says muslims are the ones, etc. I am waiting for a god who calls the enemy the chosen people. If god really wanted peace, maybe he would command christians to start worshiping the muslim leader and muslims to worship a christian leader and for jews to worship a hindu leader and vice versa. I think that would do more to promote peace, that is, if god wanted it, or if there was a god as religion imagines.

Exiled wrote:Mormons, Christians, religious adherents in general, mistakenly worship imaginary gods or leaders. There isn't much proof, if any at all, for a god as religion envisions. Their gods all seem to support the culture where they came from. Joseph Smith's god seems to be an america first guy because Joseph Smith comes from america. Judaism's god calls jews the chosen people. Muhammad says muslims are the ones, etc. I am waiting for a god who calls the enemy the chosen people. If god really wanted peace, maybe he would command christians to start worshiping the muslim leader and muslims to worship a christian leader and for jews to worship a hindu leader and vice versa. I think that would do more to promote peace, that is, if god wanted it, or if there was a god as religion imagines.

It seems to me that Gods are like extending the primate hierarchy of the tribe--the monkey tree--into the invisible (the heavens) and back into the past (myths). The tall tales about heroes and villains become more sophisticated and have theological pretensions over time when they gain cultural heft and through improvisation by the generations.

Maksutov wrote:

Exiled wrote:Mormons, Christians, religious adherents in general, mistakenly worship imaginary gods or leaders. There isn't much proof, if any at all, for a god as religion envisions. Their gods all seem to support the culture where they came from. Joseph Smith's god seems to be an america first guy because Joseph Smith comes from america. Judaism's god calls jews the chosen people. Muhammad says muslims are the ones, etc. I am waiting for a god who calls the enemy the chosen people. If god really wanted peace, maybe he would command christians to start worshiping the muslim leader and muslims to worship a christian leader and for jews to worship a hindu leader and vice versa. I think that would do more to promote peace, that is, if god wanted it, or if there was a god as religion imagines.

It seems to me that Gods are like extending the primate hierarchy of the tribe--the monkey tree--into the invisible (the heavens) and back into the past (myths). The tall tales about heroes and villains become more sophisticated and have theological pretensions over time when they gain cultural heft and through improvisation by the generations.

I remember learning about these concepts for the first time back in junior high. It seemed to make sense back then, that religion is an extension of the primate tribe, but my young TBM mind couldn't quite grasp that reality. I was more interested in whether or not I could see an angel or god and Jesus, like Joseph Smith claimed, and I was sure all the apostles spoke with Jesus at least monthly. Star wars was really cool and the force was close to how the priesthood should be.

On this point, Elder McConkie was wrong. Jesus never once rebuked those who feel at his feet to worship him.

For example:

And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last:I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death. Write the things which thou hast seen, and the things which are, and the things which shall be hereafter.

(Rev. 1:17-20)

But then later we see an angel rebuke John:

And I John saw these things, and heard them. And when I had heard and seen, I fell down to worship before the feet of the angel which shewed me these things. Then saith he unto me, See thou do it not: for I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren the prophets, and of them which keep the sayings of this book: worship God.

(Rev. 22:8-9)

This angel, though he spoke for Jesus, made a distinction the first personage didn't. And he specifically commanded John: “Worship God!" Even as Moroni was a fellow prophet to Joseph Smith, so this angel had once been a prophet in mortality and was a fellow-servant to John. But though he spoke for Jesus, he did not suffer that John should worship him.

Often because of the way he said things, people were afraid to contradict Elder McConkie, but this time he was wrong. When Jesus introduced himself to the Nephites, he told them he was the “God of Israel." And the angel told John, “Worship God!"

Thus, Elder McConkie was mistaken.

..

Mittens wrote:Our Relationship with the Lord

BRUCE R. MCCONKIE

Now, it is no secret that many false and vain and foolish things are being taught in the sectarian world and even among us about our need to gain a special relationship with the Lord Jesus. I shall summarize the true doctrine in this field and invite erring teachers and beguiled students to repent and believe the accepted gospel verities as I shall set them forth.
We worship the Father and him only and no one else. We do not worship the Son, and we do not worship the Holy Ghost. I know perfectly well what the scriptures say about worshipping Christ and Jehovah, but they are speaking in an entirely different sense--the sense of standing in awe and being reverentially grateful to him who has redeemed us.
Worship in the true and saving sense is reserved for God the first, the Creator.

https://speeches.BYU.edu/talks/bruce...tionship-lord/

https://www.LDS.org/topics/worship?lang=eng

To worship God is to give Him our love, reverence, service, and devotion. The Lord commanded Moses, "Worship God, for him only shalt thou serve" (Moses 1:15). He has also commanded, "Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, with all thy might, mind, and strength; and in the name of Jesus Christ thou shalt serve him" (D&C 59:5). Worship not only shows our love for God and commitment to Him, it gives us strength to keep His commandments. Through worship we grow in knowledge and faithfulness. If we place any person or thing above the love of God, we worship that thing or person. This is called idolatry (see Exodus 20:3–6).

Prayer is one way to worship Heavenly Father. Alma taught his son Helaman, "Cry unto God for all thy support; yea, let all thy doings be unto the Lord, and whithersoever thou goest let it be in the Lord; yea, let all thy thoughts be directed unto the Lord; yea, let the affections of thy heart be placed upon the Lord forever" (Alma 37:36).
Another way to worship Heavenly Father is to join in fellowship with others who worship Him. The Book of Mormon reveals, "The children of God were commanded that they should gather themselves together oft, and join in fasting and mighty prayer in behalf of the welfare of the souls of those who knew not God" (Alma 6:6) In more recent revelation, the Lord commanded: "That thou mayest more fully keep thyself unspotted from the world, thou shalt go to the house of prayer and offer up thy sacraments upon my holy day; for verily this is a day appointed unto you to rest from your labors, and to pay thy devotions unto the Most High" (D&C 59:9–10).

Participation in priesthood ordinances is also part of worship. As we reverently partake of the sacrament and attend the temple, we remember and worship our Heavenly Father and express our gratitude for His Son, Jesus Christ.
In addition to worshipping outwardly, we should have a worshipful attitude wherever we go and in everything we do. Alma taught this principle to a group of people who had been kept from entering their place of worship. He helped them see that true worship is not limited to one day of the week (see Alma 32:11). Speaking to the same group of people, Alma's companion Amulek encouraged them to "worship God, in whatsoever place ye may be in, in spirit and in truth" (Alma 34:38).

What's interesting they never cite the passages in the Book of Mormon that commands the Worship of Jesus, nor produce Book of Mormon verses that tell us to worship only The Father. But when does The Book of Mormon ever agree with Mormonism

2 Nephi 11: 24 And after he had said these words, he said unto me: Look! And I looked, and I beheld the Son of God going forth among the children of men; and I saw many fall down at his feet and worship him.


3 Nephi 11:17

3 Nephi 11:

13 And it came to pass that the Lord spake unto them saying:

14 Arise and come forth unto me, that ye may thrust your hands into my side, and also that ye may feel the prints of the nails in my hands and in my feet, that ye may know that I am the God of Israel, and the God of the whole earth, and have been slain for the sins of the world.

17 Hosanna! Blessed be the name of the Most High God! And they did fall down at the feet of Jesus, and did worship him.

Mittens, over the years I've kind of learned to just ignore Bruce R. McConkie.