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Hi All,

Instead of trek, our stake recently had a tabernacle tour for the youth. They had a company bring a tabernacle replica, an an olive press etc. Later they did a two part fireside with Bruce Porter who is an LDS Apologist and student of Hugh Nibley. Here are some notes from the presentation by Bruce Porter.

Bruce Porter claims:

1. The Three Facsimiles represent an endowment. The lion couch represents "The Death of God", the circle one represents the resurrection and Ascension, and the Throne one represent enthronement. These facsimiles represent the endowment process.
2. Joseph Smith never used the word "Translation" about the papyrus, he only said he was telling us the meaning of them, not translating them.
3. Joseph Smith filled in the writings around the outside edge of circle one without having the original source, which was miraculous.
4. He then stammers through a translation which speaks, allegedly of exaltation and temples.
5. Osiris means "The Redeemed"
6. Abraham is telling us that God is locatable
7. Abraham names a bunch of planets including Kolob, but says God doesn't actually live on Kolob, just near it.
8. All religions diffuse from one original religion, but are changed through apostasy
9. He quotes E.A. Wallis Budge - curator of the Egyptian museum as saying "There was never a people more ready to accept Christianity than the Egyptians" Porter suggests this is because they were originally part of the Adamic religion before theirs branched off after the tower of Babel.
10. He says "Osiris is Christ" "Horus is Peter" "Patah (?) is the father God"
11. The brass plates were written in Egyptian.
12. Laman and Lemuel are Phoenician names, Nephi and Sam are Egyptian Names
13. Joseph Smith received the book of Joseph at the same time as the Book of Abraham
14. Egyptian for Pharaoh means Great House Abraham 1:20 says "Pharaoh signifies royal blood" great house = royal blood, Joseph Smith could not gotten this by accident.
15. Min is Ham, Hathor is Egyptus so the Book of Abraham is correct here too Min is the only one depicted with dark skin in the Egyptian glyphs
16. Egypt was a Matrilineal Patriarchy just like Abraham was.
17. Egyptian religion imitated the Melchizedek priesthood, just like it says in the book of Abraham
18. The pyramids were just attempts to imitate temples and do work for the dead.
19. The Shabaka Stone was the first written document and was basically the endowment
20. Christ gives the keys to sealings to peter
21. He shows several stone reliefs are a depiction of the "ritual embrace" that are basically the veil ceremony, including hands on shoulders, and whispering into the ear of the the embraced. This was done to enter the holy part of the Egyptian temple, this according to Porter is proof that the endowment is ancient.
22. The things in the Book of Joseph are so sacred they cannot be published
23. The book of Joseph led to the restoration of the endowment at Nauvoo, he then shows some example from the papyrus and explains the veil ceremony by "translating" the Egyptian on the spot.
24. There is no way Joseph Smith could know these things, and no way he could make them up
25. Bruce Porter considers himself a "Scholar"
26. He mentions some text that was "found" in 1979 that says Abraham was on the lion couch and that proves Joseph Smith was right.

Who is Bruce Porter and why have I not heard of him before?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F19d5ClZMWo

Writes books with Meldrum. Is sufficient to deduce that facts to support his claims are not important to him.

slavereeno wrote:Hi All,

Instead of trek, our stake recently had a tabernacle tour for the youth. They had a company bring a tabernacle replica, an an olive press etc. Later they did a two part fireside with Bruce Porter who is an LDS Apologist and student of Hugh Nibley. Here are some notes from the presentation by Bruce Porter.

Bruce Porter claims:

1. The Three Facsimiles represent an endowment. The lion couch represents "The Death of God", the circle one represents the resurrection and Ascension, and the Throne one represent enthronement. These facsimiles represent the endowment process.
2. Joseph Smith never used the word "Translation" about the papyrus, he only said he was telling us the meaning of them, not translating them.
3. Joseph Smith filled in the writings around the outside edge of circle one without having the original source, which was miraculous.
4. He then stammers through a translation which speaks, allegedly of exaltation and temples.
5. Osiris means "The Redeemed"
6. Abraham is telling us that God is locatable
7. Abraham names a bunch of planets including Kolob, but says God doesn't actually live on Kolob, just near it.
8. All religions diffuse from one original religion, but are changed through apostasy
9. He quotes E.A. Wallis Budge - curator of the Egyptian museum as saying "There was never a people more ready to accept Christianity than the Egyptians" Porter suggests this is because they were originally part of the Adamic religion before theirs branched off after the tower of Babel.
10. He says "Osiris is Christ" "Horus is Peter" "Patah (?) is the father God"
11. The brass plates were written in Egyptian.
12. Laman and Lemuel are Phoenician names, Nephi and Sam are Egyptian Names
13. Joseph Smith received the book of Joseph at the same time as the Book of Abraham
14. Egyptian for Pharaoh means Great House Abraham 1:20 says "Pharaoh signifies royal blood" great house = royal blood, Joseph Smith could not gotten this by accident.
15. Min is Ham, Hathor is Egyptus so the Book of Abraham is correct here too Min is the only one depicted with dark skin in the Egyptian glyphs
16. Egypt was a Matrilineal Patriarchy just like Abraham was.
17. Egyptian religion imitated the Melchizedek priesthood, just like it says in the book of Abraham
18. The pyramids were just attempts to imitate temples and do work for the dead.
19. The Shabaka Stone was the first written document and was basically the endowment
20. Christ gives the keys to sealings to peter
21. He shows several stone reliefs are a depiction of the "ritual embrace" that are basically the veil ceremony, including hands on shoulders, and whispering into the ear of the the embraced. This was done to enter the holy part of the Egyptian temple, this according to Porter is proof that the endowment is ancient.
22. The things in the Book of Joseph are so sacred they cannot be published
23. The book of Joseph led to the restoration of the endowment at Nauvoo, he then shows some example from the papyrus and explains the veil ceremony by "translating" the Egyptian on the spot.
24. There is no way Joseph Smith could know these things, and no way he could make them up
25. Bruce Porter considers himself a "Scholar"
26. He mentions some text that was "found" in 1979 that says Abraham was on the lion couch and that proves Joseph Smith was right.

Given that this was taught in a Church setting (a fireside) Porter and the local leaders should be censured for teaching personal opinion (I’m being charitable) as if it was Church doctrine.

CFR on 26

RockSlider wrote:Who is Bruce Porter and why have I not heard of him before?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F19d5ClZMWo

He's been around Arizona for a while. I have heard of him here and there for over a decade. He is a big student of Nibley, and has a lot of "interesting" views on stuff. In the fireside he was "translating" things from the facsimiles and "Book of Joseph" papyri, and using words and phrases from the modern endowment so it seemed to the audience that the endowment was basically written down by the Egyptians some odd thousands of years ago.

I tried listening to the one I linked on the way to work this morning. I did not make it much past, Joseph Smith never claimed to translate the facsimiles, he never claimed to know what they actually said, only what they meant. Where some Egyptian expert claimed that he could tell you what they said but not what they meant.

Joseph Smith only meant the facsimiles to be an explanation not a translation. Poor Paul has worried unnecessarily all these years about the kings name!

The kids at these firesides are the ones who will be pissed off at the lack of honesty and transparency in a few years.

Res Ipsa wrote:The kids at these firesides are the ones who will be pissed off at the lack of honesty and transparency in a few years.

Pure priestcraft, right up there with Ken Ham and Kent Hovind.

slavereeno wrote:2. Joseph Smith never used the word "Translation" about the papyrus, he only said he was telling us the meaning of them, not translating them.

This is absolutely false. This statement is all that is needed to show how this apologist hasn't a leg to stand on and is misrepresenting Joseph Smith and those who assisted him in creating the Book of Abraham.

RockSlider wrote:Joseph Smith only meant the facsimiles to be an explanation not a translation. Poor Paul has worried unnecessarily all these years about the kings name!

The apologist is a liar. He's scum.

Here is a great thread on this board which quotes what Joseph Smith really said and those who knew him:

Joseph Smith & a LITERAL 3500 Year Old Abraham Autograph