What do the Brethren think of FAIR?

[_Trevor]

I would be very interested in specific instances of which you are aware in which somebody was disciplined for posting internet criticisms against the Church. "YOU BET" implies that you have the information. I think it would be hard for you to actually offer a bet to support your assertion because (1) you don't have particularly examples and (2) you are a cowardly anonymous poster, probably active on Sundays, and there is no way I can collect.

Nice to meet you too, rcrocket! Do you always act like such a tool when you respond to people?

First, if you put your glasses back on, or what ever it is you need to read properly, you will note that I did not mention anyone was being disciplined for posting on the internet in connection with the monitoring of the over 6000 websites. Get it straight, guy. Ergo, there is no need for me to provide you information I never even alluded too.

Second, as anyone who has been paying the least attention to my posts knows, Trevor is my real name. So, go hurl your pointless guilt trips in some other direction. I happen to see nothing wrong with using a pseudonym, but I no longer do.

Finally, I quit attending the LDS Church roughly a year ago, and I do not plan to return to activity.

If you do reread my post, or rather read it for the first time, since you got it all wrong, you will see that all I was claiming was along the same lines of what you discuss below:

Your supposition that the Church keeps track of anti-Mormon attacks is correct. I have worked in the archives and know archivists there. Somewhere in my library (I have looked for it and couldn't quite find it) Hugh Nibley writes about gaining access to these particular archives. He remarked that the collection was huge, but unused. The Church apparently deposits information there but has no mechanism to do anything about it. The collection is available to private scholars.

The only thing I am really adding to this is that they are watching internet sites as well.

On a final note, unless I egregiously insult you or your religion, you ought to at least try to be civil. Coming out with guns blazing when you haven't read my post carefully, and haven't the least clue what I am talking about, is not the way to have a worthwhile exchange with me.

[_capt jack]

Chris Tolworthy was excommunicated because of his internet postings.

[_Trevor]

Chris Tolworthy was excommunicated because of his internet postings.

He was summoned to a church court, but, according to him, he resigned before they could ex him.

A year later, in 2004, the church became aware of this site and local chuch leaders asked me to take the site down. I refused. So they scheduled a church court for September 11th 2004. It would have been an open and shut case, because I openly opposed church teachings and had no intention of changing. To save my family the embarassment of having a excommunicated member, I resigned from the church. Had I attended the court, I would have been in the interesting position of being excommunicated for the crime of telling people to choose the right.

[_capt jack]

Chris Tolworthy was excommunicated because of his internet postings.

He was summoned to a church court, but, according to him, he resigned before they could ex him.

A year later, in 2004, the church became aware of this site and local chuch leaders asked me to take the site down. I refused. So they scheduled a church court for September 11th 2004. It would have been an open and shut case, because I openly opposed church teachings and had no intention of changing. To save my family the embarassment of having a excommunicated member, I resigned from the church. Had I attended the court, I would have been in the interesting position of being excommunicated for the crime of telling people to choose the right.

Good catch, I'd forgotten he'd beaten them to the punch. Either way, someone was monitoring his websites and became upset at the content, upset enough to take action.

[_Trevor]

Good catch, I'd forgotten he'd beaten them to the punch. Either way, someone was monitoring his websites and became upset at the content, upset enough to take action.

I suppose the real question is whether the action was motivated by local leaders or church headquarters. It could very well have been entirely a local thing, but headquarters has been known to motivate local leaders to take action on information hq supplies. There has been enough of this for me to question this instance, but I do not have the details.

My only point in the first place was that the LDS Church does monitor web activity that concerns the Church in some way, and that the motive to do it is scriptural.

[_beastie]

I asked my boyfriend to refresh my memory on the details, and they are as follows.

This occurred a bit over ten years ago. My bf, at that time, was living in Seattle. He had never been active since moving to Seattle, although he did not completely lose his faith until years after the move. As I said, he would occasionally be visited by hometeachers, but that was the extent of his contact with the church.

After losing his faith, he created a website about his loss of faith, using his real name. He was contacted by his stake president and asked to come in for an interview, which he did. The SP told him that he had been contacted by "Salt Lake" (no details on who contacted him) and instructed to inform my bf that either he remove the website or face excommunication. He told my bf that he could hold whatever PRIVATE beliefs he wanted to without church intervention, but once he shared those beliefs in some public forum (which the internet counts as) then he risks excommunication.

As I said, due to not wanting to further upset his family, he took the site down.

[_Trevor]

He was contacted by his stake president and asked to come in for an interview, which he did. The SP told him that he had been contacted by "Salt Lake" (no details on who contacted him) and instructed to inform my bf that either he remove the website or face excommunication.

I am not surprised by this. I suppose that the SP could have been using "Salt Lake" like my mother used to say "wait until your father gets home," but, really, if they have the information, why wouldn't they use it? I would be surprised if, having the information, they just sat on it and waited for local authorities to take notice.

[_Dr. Shades]

After losing his faith, he created a website about his loss of faith, using his real name. . . As I said, due to not wanting to further upset his family, he took the site down.

Did you see this, rcrocket? Do you now see the advantages of posting anonymously?

If beastie's boyfriend had only used a pseudonym, he wouldn't have needed to undergo such hassle.

[_Trevor]

Did you see this, rcrocket? Do you now see the advantages of posting anonymously?

If beastie's boyfriend had only used a pseudonym, he wouldn't have needed to undergo such hassle.

Shhhh! Be vewy, vewy quiet! He's hunting cwitics!