.

[clbruno]

The catalyst theory is what I call "Joseph and God dumb and dumber theory".

OK, but what do you think of Ed1’s defense of it in his paper? It’s new, it throws a different light on the subject, and, I think, deserves to be engaged. If you don’t like it, fine, but at least tell why it doesn’t work...

[Physics Guy]

Ed blew a lot of credibility when he tried to blow off some serious criticisms by Shulem as “quibbles”. The Egyptian sign that Ed wanted to mean “planet Earth” really means “village”, and it’s not just “cranked” 45 degrees with respect to the standard astrological and astronomical symbol for Earth, which Smith claimed was Egyptian. It has double lines that don’t cross; it differs more from Smith’s astrological Earth sign than # differs from X.

Ed’s reaction was like that of a kid who claims to have finished a jigsaw puzzle, and when someone points out that the pieces are mushed here and the pictures don’t match up, the kid just says that that doesn’t matter. The kid may be smart but after that you can’t go on discussing the puzzle.

[Shulem]

The catalyst theory is what I call "Joseph and God dumb and dumber theory".

OK, but what do you think of Ed1’s defense of it in his paper? It’s new, it throws a different light on the subject, and, I think, deserves to be engaged. If you don’t like it, fine, but at least tell why it doesn’t work...

How do you reason with someone when you can't logically get past square one? I gave him an example that was literally black and white and based on pure logic and his response was again, "quibbles". He failed to accept the concept that a black sun cannot depict the miniature circle that punctuates the center of an Egyptian solar disk. Hence, Smith's black sun in his Grammar is NOT Egyptian, and poor Ed couldn't come to terms. Ed couldn't come to terms with the problems associated with his representation of the earth sign and refused to see the flaws in the moon sign.

So what's the point? If Ed is unable to count to 3, he's not going to count to 100. It's as simple as A,B,C, and Ed can't spell. So it's really rather useless trying to reason with him. His mind is made up. (1) The Church is true. (2) Smith's Grammar is true. (3) Period.

He's gonna die believing it because that's his dream. I wish him every happiness.

RIP

[Shulem]

Ed blew a lot of credibility when he tried to blow off some serious criticisms by Shulem as “quibbles”. The Egyptian sign that Ed wanted to mean “planet Earth” really means “village”, and it’s not just “cranked” 45 degrees with respect to the standard astrological and astronomical symbol for Earth, which Smith claimed was Egyptian. It has double lines that don’t cross; it differs more from Smith’s astrological Earth sign than # differs from X.

You are correct. Other variations of the same sign don't employ an X but use notches. The sign doesn't represent earth or land. It's not given to represent soil or depict the planet. It's a determinative given to represent a specific location and the identity of that location is spelled out by other signs that accompany the word. The bottom line, it's not a sign used to represent the astronomical or physical quality of planet earth. Other Egyptian signs are used for that purpose. But Ed won't hear any of it. His mind is closed.

[Physics Guy]

The sign doesn't represent earth or land. It's not given to represent soil or depict the planet. It's a determinative given to represent a specific location and the identity of that location is spelled out by other signs that accompany the word. The bottom line, it's not a sign used to represent the astronomical or physical quality of planet earth. Other Egyptian signs are used for that purpose.

Yes, the crossroads hieroglyph is explained exactly this way in Karl-Theodor Zauzich’s beautiful little book Hieroglyphs without Mystery which I have on my shelf and just checked now.

[Shulem]

The sign doesn't represent earth or land. It's not given to represent soil or depict the planet. It's a determinative given to represent a specific location and the identity of that location is spelled out by other signs that accompany the word. The bottom line, it's not a sign used to represent the astronomical or physical quality of planet earth. Other Egyptian signs are used for that purpose.

Yes, the crossroads hieroglyph is explained exactly this way in Karl-Theodor Zauzich’s beautiful little book Hieroglyphs without Mystery which I have on my shelf and just checked now.

I acquired that pretty little book back in April of 1996. An example is given on p. 29, using the sign in the word for "Hermopolis" and defines the sign as a determinative : a city with crossed roads. Its also listed in his appendix (p. 113).

[Physics Guy]

Yep, that’s the book. So far my only real use of it was on a birthday card for my brother once, to wish him “thousands of beer” in hieroglyphics. I understand the ancient Egyptians loved both beer and birthdays so I figure it was an authentic inscription at least in spirit.

[Fence Sitter]

Yes, the crossroads hieroglyph is explained exactly this way in Karl-Theodor Zauzich’s beautiful little book Hieroglyphs without Mystery which I have on my shelf and just checked now.

For anyone interested, Amazon sells good used hardbound copies of this delivered for only $8.00 here

[Chap]

May I also recommend:

How to read Egyptian hieroglyphs : a step-by-step guide to teach yourself / Mark Collier and Bill Manley ; new illustrations by Richard Parkinson.
Revised edition. Berkeley; Los Angeles : University of California Press, [2003]

The teaching strategy of this text is clear and effective. It got me as far as being able to read a standard offering inscription, plus some simple narrative texts, including names of deities and so on, even to do a bit of writing. Of course it all fades away if you don't use it regularly.

And yes, the 'circle with central dot' (determinative for 'sun, light, time') and the circle with a diagonal cross (determinative for 'village, town' are entirely distinct from one another (that was a point of contention earlier, If I recall correctly).

[Shulem]

For anyone interested, Amazon sells good used hardbound copies of this delivered for only $8.00 here

You'll learn a lot about the Egyptian language from that little book.

Or, you can opt for Ed's crazy paper about Smith's crazy ideas.



Couldn't resist that little swipe. The thread is ruined anyway. So what the hell.