The LDS Church could point out that admissions of guilt are forbidden in their religion, and this would be akin to having Rabbis and Imams eat ham sandwiches.
Ensign Peak SEC Investigation confirmed
- Moksha
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Re: Ensign Peak SEC Investigation confirmed
Cry Heaven and let loose the Penguins of Peace
- Dr Moore
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Re: Ensign Peak SEC Investigation confirmed
in my opinion the one single thing that stands out in all of this is that the SEC forced the Church - a.k.a., The Savior - to be named as a violator of the law. The fine amount means nothing. Being named and unable to publicly declare innocence is massive. When was the last time such a thing happened - the 1800s?
- The Stig
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Re: Ensign Peak SEC Investigation confirmed
I agree. The SEC specifically states in a footnote to its order that the phrase "senior leadership" means the Presiding Bishopric and the First Presidency. The fines can be waved away as the cost of doing business. The First Presidency knowingly seeking to hide assets from regulators is tough to wave away.Dr Moore wrote: ↑Tue Feb 21, 2023 9:03 pmin my opinion the one single thing that stands out in all of this is that the SEC forced the Church - a.k.a., The Savior - to be named as a violator of the law. The fine amount means nothing. Being named and unable to publicly declare innocence is massive. When was the last time such a thing happened - the 1800s?
https://www.sec.gov/litigation/admin/2023/34-96951.pdf
- Tom
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Re: Ensign Peak SEC Investigation confirmed
A friend drew my attention to a possible sneak preview of a prominent apologist’s forthcoming defense of the church’s actions. Responding about 11 days ago to the WSJ’s February 10 report of the SEC investigation, this apologist wrote:
We'll see what, if anything, comes of it. I would be (to put it very mildly) positively astounded if it were to turn out that the Church was deliberately trying to flout federal tax laws. But those laws are so complex and arcane that I wouldn't be at all surprised if an investigation identifies arguable violations. I've been told that even experts at the Internal Revenue Service give conflicting responses to inquiries. And we've all seen cases of special prosecutors appointed to investigate x who, in the course of their work, may or may not find any real evidence for x but who do discover previously unsuspected offenses y and z along the way.
“But if you are told by your leader to do a thing, do it. None of your business whether it is right or wrong.” Heber C. Kimball, 8 Nov. 1857
- Doctor Steuss
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Re: Ensign Peak SEC Investigation confirmed
Wowza.The Stig wrote: ↑Tue Feb 21, 2023 9:29 pmI agree. The SEC specifically states in a footnote to its order that the phrase "senior leadership" means the Presiding Bishopric and the First Presidency. The fines can be waved away as the cost of doing business. The First Presidency knowingly seeking to hide assets from regulators is tough to wave away.
https://www.sec.gov/litigation/admin/2023/34-96951.pdf
SEC wrote:13. Several years later, in 2011, Ensign Peak became concerned that its portfolio had become so large that the Form 13F filings it made using the name of the second LLC might attract unwanted attention and sought the Church’s approval to form additional LLCs to file Forms 13F. On May 19, 2011, the Church’s senior leadership approved Ensign Peak’s recommendation to “clone” the second LLC to create new Form 13F filers.
14. After obtaining Church approval, Ensign Peak formed new Clone LLCs for the purposes of filing Forms 13F. Five new entities were formed and given Delaware addresses, although none conducted business in Delaware.
15. In 2015, Ensign Peak became aware that a third party appeared to have connected the holdings of various LLCs back to Ensign Peak. Ensign Peak brought this issue to the attention of the Church. The senior leadership of the Church approved Ensign Peak’s recommendation to “gradually and carefully adapt Ensign Peak’s corporate structure to strengthen the portfolio’s confidentiality.”
16. On November 6, 2015, the senior leadership of the Church approved Ensign Peak’s plan for the creation of additional Clone LLCs to further prevent disclosure of the Church’s holdings managed by Ensign Peak. Ensign Peak formed six additional Clone LLCs, bringing the total to twelve.
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Re: Ensign Peak SEC Investigation confirmed
Looks like they settled with the SEC and agreed to pay $5 Million to the US Treasury.
https://www.sltrib.com/religion/2023/02 ... irm-agree/
https://www.sltrib.com/religion/2023/02 ... irm-agree/
Myth is misused by the powerful to subjugate the masses all too often.
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Re: Ensign Peak SEC Investigation confirmed
Wow what a slap on the wrist, that’s like half of one of the golden calves holding up a temple baptismal font.
- The Stig
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Re: Ensign Peak SEC Investigation confirmed
These ones are especially difficult to defend.Doctor Steuss wrote: ↑Tue Feb 21, 2023 9:47 pmWowza.The Stig wrote: ↑Tue Feb 21, 2023 9:29 pmI agree. The SEC specifically states in a footnote to its order that the phrase "senior leadership" means the Presiding Bishopric and the First Presidency. The fines can be waved away as the cost of doing business. The First Presidency knowingly seeking to hide assets from regulators is tough to wave away.
https://www.sec.gov/litigation/admin/2023/34-96951.pdf
SEC wrote:13. Several years later, in 2011, Ensign Peak became concerned that its portfolio had become so large that the Form 13F filings it made using the name of the second LLC might attract unwanted attention and sought the Church’s approval to form additional LLCs to file Forms 13F. On May 19, 2011, the Church’s senior leadership approved Ensign Peak’s recommendation to “clone” the second LLC to create new Form 13F filers.
14. After obtaining Church approval, Ensign Peak formed new Clone LLCs for the purposes of filing Forms 13F. Five new entities were formed and given Delaware addresses, although none conducted business in Delaware.
15. In 2015, Ensign Peak became aware that a third party appeared to have connected the holdings of various LLCs back to Ensign Peak. Ensign Peak brought this issue to the attention of the Church. The senior leadership of the Church approved Ensign Peak’s recommendation to “gradually and carefully adapt Ensign Peak’s corporate structure to strengthen the portfolio’s confidentiality.”
16. On November 6, 2015, the senior leadership of the Church approved Ensign Peak’s plan for the creation of additional Clone LLCs to further prevent disclosure of the Church’s holdings managed by Ensign Peak. Ensign Peak formed six additional Clone LLCs, bringing the total to twelve.
21. Each Clone LLC was set up with a “Business Manager,” who, according to the terms of the LLC agreements, had responsibility for “the preparation and filing of the Company’s governmental reports, returns, notices and the like, including reports required by law of investment managers or entities exercising investment discretion.” However, the Business Managers performed no functions for the Clone LLCs outside of signing the Form 13F signature pages each quarter.
22. Ensign Peak was responsible for designating the Clone LLCs’ Business Managers, many of whom were Church employees. Business Managers were selected because they had common names and a limited presence on social media, and were therefore less likely to be publicly connected to Ensign Peak or the Church. Ensign Peak provided the Business Managers very limited information about the Clone LLCs or why they were created.
23. Each Clone LLC was given an address outside of Utah although none of them conducted any business at those locations other than the receipt of mail. Ensign Peak chose multiple locations across the country for these purported offices to create the impression that the Clone LLCs conducted business operations throughout the U.S., making it more difficult to trace the Clone LLCs back to Ensign Peak or the Church.
24. Each Clone LLC was also assigned a local phone number that would go directly to voicemail. An Ensign Peak senior manager instructed a Business Manager of one of the Clone LLCs to notify him of all voicemails from regulatory agencies to any of the Clone LLCs, but to delete all others.
- malkie
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Re: Ensign Peak SEC Investigation confirmed
These all sound to me like the actions of innocent people.
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Re: Ensign Peak SEC Investigation confirmed
These turns of events make me scratch my head when I think back on a talk given by Dallin Oaks on 9.12.1993--
In the matter of lying, the essential question is not whether we have a duty to tell the truth and nothing but the truth. We clearly have that duty. We must not lie. I know of no category of justified lies.
The difficult question is whether we are morally responsible to tell the whole truth. When we have a duty to disclose, we are morally responsible to do so.
My, my, my. Dallin's a tool.The lies of public officials, like the lies of religious leaders, are also extremely damaging in the way they degrade the moral tone of the entire community. Officials’ lies and clergymen’s lies are especially damaging to impressionable young people.
Dishonest business practices are also widespread. From time to time, someone speaks out on that subject. A recent Wall Street Journal opinion piece gives this harsh assessment:
Deception and dishonesty in business surround us. We find them in the half-truths and distortions of fact in advertising, in package labeling, and in merchandise markdowns. We find them in shoddy goods that fail when still new. Is there any wonder that business has garnered a reputation for being less than honest? ["Do the Right Thing in Business," Wall Street Journal, June 21, 1993, p. A10]
A petroleum industry publication responded to this editorial by predicting that global competition will compel more honesty in the practices of both industry and service companies:
Companies are discovering that when they do the right thing, their integrity is beneficial in subtle ways. . . . Employees feel proud of their company simply because they can feel proud of themselves. An honest company is one you can depend upon. While it may keep some doors closed to new business, your current customers will give repeat business, and your client list will grow.
Half-truths, distortions of fact in advertising, package mislabeling, merchandise markdowns, and shoddy merchandise are no longer acceptable business practices. In the new world of globalized markets, only those companies which incorporate integrity and honesty as a by-product of their goods and services will survive. ["World Energy Update," June 30, 1993, p. 12]
"Apologists try to shill an explanation to questioning members as though science and reason really explain and buttress their professed faith. It [sic] does not. ...faith is the antithesis of science and reason." Critic as quoted by Peterson, Daniel C. (2010) FARMS Review, Intro., v22:2,2.