RFM on Kamp in Court

[drumdude]

I noticed someone posted Jenn’s court filings on the Rosebud website. They’re available here for anyone interested in sifting through her claims.

http://mormonrosebud.wikidot.com/jenn-kamp-files

They seem to me to fit the pattern of John Dehlin. Not a pattern of abuse and harassment, but a pattern of him being a clueless jackass around women.

I see some of this that you describe in the documents, but I feel like I can drive a coach and horses through many/most of her arguments. A lot of the stuff just feels a bit petty… or handbags, but nothing really substantive. Rosebud had a much more compelling claim.

What really gets my goat is when Jenn Kamp complains about John Dehlin providing incorrect, manipulated or incomplete evidence, however Jenn Kamp is still not managing to submit evidence, which the court itself ordered she submit in full… months ago. And it was found that she destroyed some of it. It’s stinking hypocrisy on her part. Absolutely disgraceful behaviour.

The only conclusion I can come to is that John Dehlin is a bit of a douche at times. Jenn Kamp on the other hand…. As for posting those documents, fascinating, but also against what the judge ordered.

From RFM’s latest podcast it appears the Judge’s authority only extends towards those who are a party to the lawsuit. Any language suggesting otherwise was too broad and was stricken from the order.

[pistolero]

I noticed someone posted Jenn’s court filings on the Rosebud website. They’re available here for anyone interested in sifting through her claims.

http://mormonrosebud.wikidot.com/jenn-kamp-files

They seem to me to fit the pattern of John Dehlin. Not a pattern of abuse and harassment, but a pattern of him being a clueless jackass around women.

Just this minute finished reading through them all. It was tough. But I will say, if gossip, juice or whatever is your kink, then there is a rather personal but salacious revelation in one of the documents unrelated to John Dehlin or Jenn Kamp that might make it worth your while.

Again, this feels like Jenn Kamp hypocrisy, she claims that John Dehlin violated her confidence on a very personal matter. She has done the very same type of thing to two people who aren’t even litigants in this case. And defied a court order at the same time. No moral victory for Jenn Kamp can ever be possible after all.

[drumdude]

I noticed someone posted Jenn’s court filings on the Rosebud website. They’re available here for anyone interested in sifting through her claims.

http://mormonrosebud.wikidot.com/jenn-kamp-files

They seem to me to fit the pattern of John Dehlin. Not a pattern of abuse and harassment, but a pattern of him being a clueless jackass around women.

Just this minute finished reading through them all. It was tough. But I will say, if gossip, juice or whatever is your kink, then there is a rather personal but salacious revelation in one of the documents unrelated to John Dehlin or Jenn Kamp that might make it worth your while.

Again, this feels like Jenn Kamp hypocrisy, she claims that John Dehlin violated her confidence on a very personal matter. She has done the very same type of thing to two people who aren’t even litigants in this case. And defied a court order at the same time. No moral victory for Jenn Kamp can ever be possible after all.

I completely agree. In hindsight she handled this all extremely poorly.

I can empathize with it, though. When I went through my divorce I also handled it extremely poorly. It’s hard to think rationally when you’re going through trauma.

I hope Jenn gets the therapy she needs to be able to be a little bit stronger. The things John did sucked, but she needs to learn that people will do that to you in life. It’s not fair, it hurts, but it’s something you have to handle appropriately. And nothing about how she has handled this in the legal system has been appropriate.

[drumdude]

RFM mentioned his ability to keep reporting on the case may be hampered by the judge appearing to classify the entire case as protected and private. The relevant law:

Rule 4-202.04. Request to access a record associated with a case; request to classify a record associated with a case.

6) Factors and findings. In deciding whether to allow access to a court record or whether to classify a court record as private, protected, or sealed, safeguarded, juvenile court legal, or juvenile court social, or to redact information from the record, the court may consider any relevant factor, interest, or policy, including but not limited to the interests described in Rule 4-202. In ruling on a motion or petition under this rule the court shall:

(6)(A) make findings and conclusions about specific records;

(6)(B) identify and balance the interests favoring opening and closing the record; and

(6)(C) if the record is ordered closed, determine there are no reasonable alternatives to closure sufficient to protect the interests favoring closure.

(7) Appellate briefs. If an appellate brief is sealed, the clerk of the court shall seal the brief under Rule 4-205. If an appellate brief is classified as private, protected, safeguarded, juvenile court legal, or juvenile court social, the clerk of the court shall allow access only to persons authorized by Rule 4-202.03. If the court orders information redacted from the brief, the clerk of the court shall remove the information and allow public access to the edited brief.

(8) State Law Library. If the petitioner serves the order on the director of the State Law Library, the director shall comply with the order in the same manner as the clerk of the court under paragraph (7).

(9) Compliance. Unless otherwise ordered by the court, the order is binding only on the court, the parties to the motion or petition, and the state law library. Compliance with the order by any other person is voluntary.

It seems a blanket order to just throw a cloak over the entire case doesn’t fit the language that I’m seeing here:

“make findings and conclusions about specific records”

Emphasis on the word specific…

[Bond]

After trying to read through all those emails and texts and blurry photos it appears everyone who works for Open Stories Foundation is as soft as a marshmallow emotionally while simultaneously walking on eggshells to create safe space for everyone's emotions. I don't know how anything gets done in that company. Someone might offend someone by asking them to actually work.

[bill4long]

RFM mentioned his ability to keep reporting on the case may be hampered by the judge appearing to classify the entire case as protected and private. The relevant law:

Rule 4-202.04. Request to access a record associated with a case; request to classify a record associated with a case.

6) Factors and findings. In deciding whether to allow access to a court record or whether to classify a court record as private, protected, or sealed, safeguarded, juvenile court legal, or juvenile court social, or to redact information from the record, the court may consider any relevant factor, interest, or policy, including but not limited to the interests described in Rule 4-202. In ruling on a motion or petition under this rule the court shall:

(6)(A) make findings and conclusions about specific records;

(6)(B) identify and balance the interests favoring opening and closing the record; and

(6)(C) if the record is ordered closed, determine there are no reasonable alternatives to closure sufficient to protect the interests favoring closure.

(7) Appellate briefs. If an appellate brief is sealed, the clerk of the court shall seal the brief under Rule 4-205. If an appellate brief is classified as private, protected, safeguarded, juvenile court legal, or juvenile court social, the clerk of the court shall allow access only to persons authorized by Rule 4-202.03. If the court orders information redacted from the brief, the clerk of the court shall remove the information and allow public access to the edited brief.

(8) State Law Library. If the petitioner serves the order on the director of the State Law Library, the director shall comply with the order in the same manner as the clerk of the court under paragraph (7).

(9) Compliance. Unless otherwise ordered by the court, the order is binding only on the court, the parties to the motion or petition, and the state law library. Compliance with the order by any other person is voluntary.

It seems a blanket order to just throw a cloak over the entire case doesn’t fit the language that I’m seeing here:

“make findings and conclusions about specific records”

Emphasis on the word specific…

A motion can be filed but the judge will only grant the motion based on the criteria specified in paragraph (5):

5) Classify – Redact. The court may classify the record as private, protected, sealed, safeguarded, juvenile court legal, or juvenile court social, or redact information from the record if the record or information:

(5)(A) is classified as private, protected, sealed, safeguarded, juvenile court legal, or juvenile court social under Rule 4-202.02;

(5)(B) is classified as private, controlled, or protected by a governmental entity and shared with the court under the Government Records Access and Management Act;

(5)(C) is a record regarding the character or competence of an individual; or

(5)(D) is a record containing information the disclosure of which constitutes an unwarranted invasion of personal privacy.

(A) and (B) are not presumably not relevant. Kamp would have to convincingly argue that (C) and/or (D) applies.

[Dr Exiled]

After trying to read through all those emails and texts and blurry photos it appears everyone who works for Open Stories Foundation is as soft as a marshmallow emotionally while simultaneously walking on eggshells to create safe space for everyone's emotions. I don't know how anything gets done in that company. Someone might offend someone by asking them to actually work.

This victim first attitude definitely comes out in the podcast. I haven't paid much attention to it since Ms. Kamp and the other one that thought she was funny left, but the constant parade of hammed up, exaggerated victim after victim turned me off.

[Fifth Columnist]

After trying to read through all those emails and texts and blurry photos it appears everyone who works for Open Stories Foundation is as soft as a marshmallow emotionally while simultaneously walking on eggshells to create safe space for everyone's emotions. I don't know how anything gets done in that company. Someone might offend someone by asking them to actually work.

OMG, yes. As far as bosses go, John Dehlin seems to fall on the nicer/easier side of the scale.

All this "evidence" confirmed that this is a minor, run-of-the-mill employment related grievance that Jenn Kamp tried to turn into a claim of sexual harassment, etc. for which she was rightly found to have defamed Dehlin.

[Bond]

After trying to read through all those emails and texts and blurry photos it appears everyone who works for Open Stories Foundation is as soft as a marshmallow emotionally while simultaneously walking on eggshells to create safe space for everyone's emotions. I don't know how anything gets done in that company. Someone might offend someone by asking them to actually work.

OMG, yes. As far as bosses go, John Dehlin seems to fall on the nicer/easier side of the scale.

All this "evidence" confirmed that this is a minor, run-of-the-mill employment related grievance that Jenn Kamp tried to turn into a claim of sexual harassment, etc. for which she was rightly found to have defamed Dehlin.

I can't imagine Jenn Kamp existing in any mainstream business setting. "Hey watch this clip on Twitter/Youtube" leading to some PG13 or R rated joke/content is the life blood of my job when we have a moment of downtime.

[Bond]

After trying to read through all those emails and texts and blurry photos it appears everyone who works for Open Stories Foundation is as soft as a marshmallow emotionally while simultaneously walking on eggshells to create safe space for everyone's emotions. I don't know how anything gets done in that company. Someone might offend someone by asking them to actually work.

This victim first attitude definitely comes out in the podcast. I haven't paid much attention to it since Ms. Kamp and the other one that thought she was funny left, but the constant parade of hammed up, exaggerated victim after victim turned me off.

I honestly can't believe no one at Mormon Stories developed a snarky "this is BS let's laugh and be righteously indignant rather than cry" on Mormonism. Cara Burrell seemed to be there a bit but not consistently. If I was in a room with Rod Meldrum I'd be laughing in his face or saying "that's the dumbest crap I've ever heard. You're talking out your ass bro." But I guess Dehlin wants the content and access to continue fence sitting and he'll placate people who are clearly bat crap morons.

Edit: I didn't use crap in this post lol