Bond...James Bond wrote:Only behind the Jello Curtain would the phrase "Hey honey, that part about the death oaths was actually true!" be fairly normal. Mormonism, thou art weird.
Maybe I'm crazy but I like living in houses where things like that are said routinely. Keeps down boredom.
Well you could always go around spouting crazy stuff...but why pay 10% for the priviledge?
Because God told me he needs to borrow the money and keeps promising me that he's good for it.
"Surely he knows that DCP, The Nehor, Lamanite, and other key apologists..." -Scratch clarifying my status in apologetics "I admit it; I'm a petty, petty man." -Some Schmo
Gazelam wrote:What doctrine was changed? What lesson was unlearned due to the removal of this element? None.
Perhaps, but that's probably the same thing the early Catholics said when baptism was changed from immersion to sprinkling: What doctrine was changed? What lesson was unlearned due to the removal of this (immersion) element? None.
But for some reason, Mormons like James E. Talmage have a problem with it.
"Finally, for your rather strange idea that miracles are somehow linked to the amount of gay sexual gratification that is taking place would require that primitive Christianity was launched by gay sex, would it not?"
Dr. Shades wrote: He responded by saying, "Well, we were married in 1991, but didn't go through the temple until 1992." At that point I explained that I went through in 1989, and back then (and up 'till April 1990) such oaths were indeed part of the temple ceremony. I said, "Oh, she used the wrong finger and didn't get the intent quite right, but back then each token had its corresponding name, sign, and penalty. So what she was saying was actually the truth."
His eyes got quite wide. Just then his wife walked back into the room, and he said, "Hey honey, that part about the death oaths was actually true!" She was just as surprised as he was.
I thought it was quite a memorable conversation.
Your thoughts?
What strikes me is the short timeline. We are only talking about something as recently as 1990, and already there is denial/lack of knowledge amongst the temple going TBM's.
And we wonder why there is such obfuscation about events just 100 years ago.
Bond...James Bond wrote:Only behind the Jello Curtain would the phrase "Hey honey, that part about the death oaths was actually true!" be fairly normal. Mormonism, thou art weird.
Maybe I'm crazy but I like living in houses where things like that are said routinely. Keeps down boredom.
Mormon households do not normally discuss the temple at all. Talking about the death oaths or any other part of the temple ceremony is not common. Your lack of orthodoxy is showing.
Does no one talk to their elders anymore or read? Within 6 months of getting my endowments people had told me all of this stuff.
I'm confused...where did you read about pre-1990 temple oaths? And what people told you about them?
I thought Mormons were not supposed to discuss this, except perhaps inside the temple. Ditto writing about it.
I had never heard anything about the changes in 1990, changes in wording for women, vow to avenge the blood of Joseph, or the several changes to washings/annointings until the internet. Most TBMs are so afraid to discuss anything regarding the temple, even though they have only covenanted to keep secret very specific things. I am surprised to hear you learned this 6 months after your endowments. Your experience is in the very slim minority.
I have made the point to TBM family that Dr. Shades mentioned. If Mormons are going to proclaim the Catholic church fell into darkness for changing the procedure of baptism, they need to redefine what apostacy is. Temple ordinances have been drastically changed over a very short period of history, and they are held to be the highest of all ordinances.
"Happiness is the object and design of our existence... That which is wrong under one circumstance, may be, and often is, right under another." Joseph Smith
Dr. Shades wrote:Last Wednesday I was at the home of some TBM friends of mine. I asked the husband how he liked the PBS show, and he said it was okay except for one part which was really offensive: The obvious lie by an anti-Mormon woman who claimed that there were death oaths in the temple. He continued by saying something like, "I'm surprised she didn't continue with allegations like dancing naked and sacrificing chickens!"
I sort of sat back and said, "So, when did you go through the temple?"
He responded by saying, "Well, we were married in 1991, but didn't go through the temple until 1992." At that point I explained that I went through in 1989, and back then (and up 'till April 1990) such oaths were indeed part of the temple ceremony. I said, "Oh, she used the wrong finger and didn't get the intent quite right, but back then each token had its corresponding name, sign, and penalty. So what she was saying was actually the truth."
His eyes got quite wide. Just then his wife walked back into the room, and he said, "Hey honey, that part about the death oaths was actually true!" She was just as surprised as he was.
I thought it was quite a memorable conversation.
I imagine most all Chapel Mormons post 1990 will assume it was anti Mormon slander and I wonder how many TBMs that know it was changed will fess up to the truth. I had disucssed with a fanatical TBM how there are members out there pre 1990 that had bad experiences their first time in the temple and were troubled by some of the endowment. I hinted at the changes that were disturbing and she repsonded with "Those were beautiful!!! I had a very spiritual experience my first time."
She can't comprehend how others felt disturbed by the penalty signs.
I am still irritated PBS didn't mention masonry one time during the entire segment on the temple.
"Happiness is the object and design of our existence... That which is wrong under one circumstance, may be, and often is, right under another." Joseph Smith
Bond...James Bond wrote:Only behind the Jello Curtain would the phrase "Hey honey, that part about the death oaths was actually true!" be fairly normal. Mormonism, thou art weird.
Maybe I'm crazy but I like living in houses where things like that are said routinely. Keeps down boredom.
Mormon households do not normally discuss the temple at all. Talking about the death oaths or any other part of the temple ceremony is not common. Your lack of orthodoxy is showing.
It was a joke Harmony. I don't discuss the Temple much either.
I do think comments like that should be heard regularly and often though.
"Surely he knows that DCP, The Nehor, Lamanite, and other key apologists..." -Scratch clarifying my status in apologetics "I admit it; I'm a petty, petty man." -Some Schmo