John Dehlin Stake President update 8/23/14

[_Jesse Pinkman]

Sexism? From the Mormon church?

Unpossible.

I know. I'm preaching to the choir here.

But it is disheartening nonetheless.

[_Jason Bourne]

I have to agree with Mayan Elephant here. It sounds to me like Dehlin has managed a free pass. There is no foreseeable Church court and his current membership in good standing is intact.

I am happy for John, but frustrated at the blatant difference between how he was treated as opposed to how Kate Kelly was treated. Before Kelly was excommunicated, she was placed on a probation that was more strict than most disfellowshipments.

John has received nothing but a couple of threats and a slap on the wrist. He was even given the option to resign his membership before a Church court was to be considered convening. At the end of it all, they are taking a wait and see approach and Dehlin is free to carry on with his broadcast with good standing membership well intact.

Blatant sexism, anyone ?

Well then lay the blame on his SP. Based on my read of the list of demands the SP made and John's responses it does not seem John conceded to much of the list and he out rightly stated he would continue to support Ordain Women and well as support LBGT issues.

I was surprised based on the SPs demands and John's response that the SP did not instigate DC to excommunicate Dehiln. Seems like for some reason he back peddled.

[_mcjathan]

A near-perfect description of what's really happening from a poster over at RFM:

"John Dehlin update - his SP is taking a wait and see approach"

Translation: We took a much bigger hit in the media with Kate Kelley than previously anticipated, even with Ally Isom at the helm. Therefore, we are waiting for the dust to settle and while we do so, we will look for every reason to give John the axe. Hopefully, he'll give him self enough rope to hang him with to convince the fence sitting crowd and nevermos that he really deserved it.

http://tinyurl.com/orwv2wm

[_Willy Law]

I have to agree with Mayan Elephant here. It sounds to me like Dehlin has managed a free pass. There is no foreseeable Church court and his current membership in good standing is intact.

I am happy for John, but frustrated at the blatant difference between how he was treated as opposed to how Kate Kelly was treated. Before Kelly was excommunicated, she was placed on a probation that was more strict than most disfellowshipments.

John has received nothing but a couple of threats and a slap on the wrist. He was even given the option to resign his membership before a Church court was to be considered convening. At the end of it all, they are taking a wait and see approach and Dehlin is free to carry on with his broadcast with good standing membership well intact.

Blatant sexism, anyone ?

Well then lay the blame on his SP. Based on my read of the list of demands the SP made and John's responses it does not seem John conceded to much of the list and he out rightly stated he would continue to support Ordain Women and well as support LBGT issues.

I was surprised based on the SPs demands and John's response that the SP did not instigate DC to excommunicate Dehiln. Seems like for some reason he back peddled.

Kate Kelly does not comply with church's demands = Instant Excommunication
John Dehlin does not comely with church's demands = Nothing

Not sure why everyone just doesn't have a penis, makes life so much easier.

[_Mayan Elephant]

he out rightly stated he would continue to support Ordain Women and well as support LBGT issues.

that is one side of the story.

[Guest]

Kate Kelly does not comply with church's demands = Instant Excommunication
[mormonstories] does not comely with church's demands = Nothing

Not sure why everyone just doesn't have a penis, makes life so much easier.

this is a rather simplistic and uninteresting narrative, no?

there is so much that is different about these two people it is insane to simplify it like this. the biggest and most obvious difference is that [mormonstories] does not have an original thought, idea or piece of research, or movement. [mormonstories] has more in common with kirby and peggy stack than he has in common with kelley. like kirby and stack, he makes a living giving lip service and publishing other people's original information about Mormonism. [mormonstories] is not like any of the people he compares himself to. not like the september 6. not like george smith. not like his guests on the podcasts. he is just a publisher who is also embarking on a new path of selling mental health services to his customers.

we have no idea what he really said or promised to his stake president. as his business partner has said on here, he is a liar and will say completely opposite things to different audiences. i suspect, with some pressure, he will finally reveal any and all written correspondences, but we will never have recordings of what was said.

i think it is a huge disservice to kelley and others, especially the lgbt allies within the church, to make these simplistic comparisons.

[_Mayan Elephant]

...

didn't he back off the gay marriage and lgbt stuff when he carved out circling the wagons? ...

Hmmm? What do you mean? What do you mean by "carved out?"

Ps...ME, I am very happy and willing to have this discussion here. Nothing personal from the NOM thread.

nothing personal mate. just goddamn strange that you would go over there and blow smoke up the same skirts as the rest of the sycophants.

carved out. maybe not the best cliché. when he got sideways with his business partner, she took the lgbt conferences and websites with her. they were removed from the open stories foundation.

i bet that at some point there will be a split within the Mormon mental health association too.

[_Themis]

At this point I think the Stake President would be foolish to take any official sanction against John. Now when believers hear of John Dehlin they'll know that he is basically no longer "a member in good standing" and that his Stake President has asked him to remove content from Mormon Stories. I think that's enough. The well has been poisoned whether justified or unjustified.

I suspect that since John is not willing to back down on some issues, taking a look and see attitude may be the best way to influence John as much as they can hope for. It's obvious they can't take away his platform.

But even if he did, it has probably been long enough since Kate Kelly that it wouldn't be a national story.

That also could be a good strategy to wait for the dust to settle. John has shown he has connections and can make things very public.

[_Themis]

I have to agree with Mayan Elephant here. It sounds to me like Dehlin has managed a free pass. There is no foreseeable Church court and his current membership in good standing is intact.

I am happy for John, but frustrated at the blatant difference between how he was treated as opposed to how Kate Kelly was treated. Before Kelly was excommunicated, she was placed on a probation that was more strict than most disfellowshipments.

John has received nothing but a couple of threats and a slap on the wrist. He was even given the option to resign his membership before a Church court was to be considered convening. At the end of it all, they are taking a wait and see approach and Dehlin is free to carry on with his broadcast with good standing membership well intact.

Blatant sexism, anyone ?

While I think sexism is alive and well in the church, the problem here is that they have different leaders. John is also known to have good connections in the church. We know church discipline is not consistent because it is done by local leaders, so we cannot eliminate this as a factor between John and Kates treatment. I also think her leaders may have thought the best way to take away her platform is through excommunication. John's leaders probably already know this is not something that would work with John. I just hope she can get a much larger number of women, and men in support of OW, to show up to conference.

[_cwald]

Hmmm? What do you mean? What do you mean by "carved out?"

Ps...ME, I am very happy and willing to have this discussion here. Nothing personal from the NOM thread.

nothing personal mate. just goddamn strange that you would go over there and blow smoke up the same skirts as the rest of the sycophants.

carved out. maybe not the best cliché. when he got sideways with his business partner, she took the lgbt conferences and websites with her. they were removed from the open stories foundation.

i bet that at some point there will be a split within the Mormon mental health association too.

NOM...mostly was pointing out that you (and those other new posters who showed up) need to stop claiming that you don't have a grudge to settle with Dehlin. Its obvious to everyone.

That is all.

I see what you are saying about the CTW conference.