A MA&D Poster Links to this Board

[_Dr. Shades]

Pahoran! Good to see you again!

[_Pahoran]

As for "glasnost," I fail to see that this forum lacks openness in any meaningful way. It is certainly no less open than Shades' board.

??? So "openness" is what you call banning anyone who disagrees with you or makes your prized apologists look bad?

No.

You disappoint me, Shades, when you repeat the lie that people have been banned for disagreeing with anyone or "making prized apologists look bad." That's what happens on Concerned Christians, Inc. but it never happened on the FAIRboards, with which your maniacal obsession continues, and it has not happened on MA&D.

No, openness is what I call openness. Just so you know.

Someone should ask Pahoran how many posters on FAIR/MAD have been banned from this bb (I would ask, but I'm banned from even viewing FAIR/MAD), and then compare that figure (which I'm sure is ZERO) to the number of posters here who have been banned from FAIR/MAD (which is SEVERAL). That should answer quite easily which forum is "less open" than the other.

Indeed. I have an entire weblog devoted to that very subject.

(by the way, you're right. We've banned a grand total of 0 people so far. Unless you count spam-bots, of course, but no actual humans have been banned.)

Funny you should mention your blog. It is your blog--which is the where all the most permanent stuff goes, and over which the most heavy-handed editorial control is exercised--that causes me to challenge your "free speech" propaganda. (That, and the fact that you have spent inordinate amounts of time trying to censor the rest of the Internet.)

You see Shades, it is fairly safe for vicious haters to engage in uncensored debate when all of their opponents have far more scruples than they. It is as if a street gang were to set up a series of fights against boxers trained in the Marquess of Queensberry rules. It isn't fear of your magnificent debate skills that keeps LDS posters away from this sty, it's disgust at the kind of swill we have to wade in when we come here.

So you have the "no-holds-barred" section, in which LDS posters are free to operate at the great disadvantage of being the only civilised participants, and you have the controlled section in which, AFAICT, editorial power can only be gained by comprehensively failing a lie detector test.

So you go right on persisting in the wonderful lie that this place fosters a more open exchange of ideas than MA&D does.

But please know that I see through it.

Regards,
Pahoran

[_beastie]

Oh, look, Karnak the Great is visiting us.

Hey, the great thing is that none of us even need to post anything now. Karnak will read all our minds and provide our posts for us. Why I bet he could easily fill ten pages with his rebuttals to our arguments he read from our minds. No need to verbalize your own thoughts as YOU understand them. You puny human!!! Karnak can do a far superior job!!!

Now that's open debate, all right. :D

[_Jersey Girl]

OK, I found something else on one of the Threads that was Posted by the former Moderator Dunamis there on the "FAIR"MA&D Board. Here it is:

Dunamis:

I decided it was better to be up front and direct about a new situation that is developing. We are having more incidents of cross-posting by a few from Dr. Shades message board and recruitment ads are being put into posts on this board.

This presents two problems for our board:

1. This message board is a staging area for a few disgruntled critics of FAIR, apparently with most of the content dedicated to extreme and vulgar attacks on FAIR and FAIR posters with posts and emails being copied wholesale.
2. This message board contains temple content, obscenity, profanity and soft porn graphics so we cannot link to the posts--which makes it a one-sided squabble that does not benefit or interest FAIR in the least.

We would like critics who are angry with this board to know about Dr. Shades' message board. It can easily be found with a search engine. We encourage you to use it! We hope you will have a more satisfactory experience there. But we are not going to allow further cross-posting that will develop into board wars or bring more disgruntled and angry posters loaded for bear here. We hold the same philosophy on attacks that Dr. Shades does so I think we should be able to respect each other on this point at least. Dr. Shades on his message board [In Defense of Ray A, Posted: Tue May 09, 2006 5:39 pm] defended a poster's attacks because he was only "retaliating" which was permissible because "he does so only as a counterattack, never as a pre-emptive attack." We have no disagreement with that and only ask that Dr. Shades and his posters have the courtesy to not bring "pre-emptive attacks" to our board. I do not think many (if any!) of our Mormon posters will show you that discourtesy, Dr. Shades. It is a recipe for a nonstop brawl if we disrespect one another's boundaries.

( http://www.mormonapologetics.org/index. ... opic=15448 , Bold Emphasis Mine. )

Brackite,

I think that's the one I mentioned to maklelan. Could you date it for us?

Jersey Girl

[_Jersey Girl]

Pahoran: You disappoint me, Shades, when you repeat the lie that people have been banned for disagreeing with anyone or "making prized apologists look bad." That's what happens on Concerned Christians, Inc. but it never happened on the FAIRboards, with which your maniacal obsession continues, and it has not happened on MA&D.


Jersey Girl: What about banning posters without cause? Did that ever happen on FAIR?

[_Brackite]

[Brackite,

I think that's the one I mentioned to maklelan. Could you date it for us?

Jersey Girl

Hi Jersey Girl,

That Post was dated by Dunamis on May 21 2006, at 12:35 PM.

And here is another Post there from the former moderator Dunamis on that Thread there:

Dunamis, May 21 2006, 06:41 PM:

We want alternatives to this board. There is an expectation that this board should allow just about anything but our purpose has never been anything other than to serve LDS. Dr. Shades has done a good thing for those who do not like our policies. I am giving warning that further cross-posting is not going to be allowed. Those who want to use this board can use this board, those who want to use another board may use that board obviously. But we are not going to serve as a go-between because we have never allowed board wars and because we can't support the content of some boards.

( http://www.mormonapologetics.org/index. ... opic=15448 )

[_beastie]

When Juliann began cross-posting to my critiques of her use of Bromley's text on ZLMB, this objection was raised. Either Juliann or the mods (they're often conflated in my memory) stated that they were now going to try to allow cross posting on a case by case evaluation.

In other words, if it's a believer attacking someone else on another board, it will be A-OK, most likely. ;)

[_Jersey Girl]

[Brackite,

I think that's the one I mentioned to maklelan. Could you date it for us?

Jersey Girl

Hi Jersey Girl,

That Post was dated by Dunamis on May 21 2006, at 12:35 PM.

And here is another Post there from the former moderator Dunamis on that Thread there:

Dunamis, May 21 2006, 06:41 PM:

We want alternatives to this board. There is an expectation that this board should allow just about anything but our purpose has never been anything other than to serve LDS. Dr. Shades has done a good thing for those who do not like our policies. I am giving warning that further cross-posting is not going to be allowed. Those who want to use this board can use this board, those who want to use another board may use that board obviously. But we are not going to serve as a go-between because we have never allowed board wars and because we can't support the content of some boards.

( http://www.mormonapologetics.org/index. ... opic=15448 )

That's it, Brackite! I hope maklelan sees it.

Jersey Girl

[_Jersey Girl]

Pahoran: You disappoint me, Shades, when you repeat the lie that people have been banned for disagreeing with anyone or "making prized apologists look bad." That's what happens on Concerned Christians, Inc. but it never happened on the FAIRboards, with which your maniacal obsession continues, and it has not happened on MA&D.


Jersey Girl: What about banning posters without cause? Did that ever happen on FAIR?

Pahoran,

At the outside chance you show up again, I'd like to rephrase my question, since you seem to be "in the know". Specifically, why was Lady Sundancer banned from FAIR?

Jersey Girl

[_Pahoran]

Pahoran: You disappoint me, Shades, when you repeat the lie that people have been banned for disagreeing with anyone or "making prized apologists look bad." That's what happens on Concerned Christians, Inc. but it never happened on the FAIRboards, with which your maniacal obsession continues, and it has not happened on MA&D.

Jersey Girl: What about banning posters without cause? Did that ever happen on FAIR?

Probably not. "Banning without cause" is a bit like the concept of a "motiveless crime." Every action is caused by something, even if it's something trivial; as in (in this case) just that the mod's don't like you.

Which, incidentally, I'm not aware of having happened. What has happened is that people have been banned and the reasons haven't been announced. That doesn't mean there was no reason for it.

What also happens is that people misrepresent the reasons for their banning. I'm not able to chase every rabbit down every hole, but I have investigated one such case, namely that of Mister Scratch. I showed the reasons for his banning here in this forum; he was so enraged at having been thus exposed that he started a relentless hate campaign that continued for weeks.

Just so you know, he was banned for misrepresenting himself on FAIR, posting insulting trash talk about FAIR posters elsewhere, denying that it was really him, and boasting about his perfidy.

I've just seen your follow-up question, while previewing this post.

At the outside chance you show up again, I'd like to rephrase my question, since you seem to be "in the know". Specifically, why was Lady Sundancer banned from FAIR?

I really don't know. I can ask around if you like.

Regards,
Pahoran