Believing members: If it weren't true, would u want to know?

[_The Dude]

Honestly I probably don't want to know. It's pretty disappointing. in my opinion Christianity and every other religion has just as many problems with it as Mormonism does.

No way. Mormonism has a short recent history, a peculiar founder who claimed to speak for god, and numerous factual difficulties that other mainstream religions do not have. Go ahead and compare it to Scientology or the Jehovah's Witnesses, but when you say it has the same problems as Protestantism, Catholicism, Islam, etc. I think you are expressing a wishful desire. Mormonism may well last 500 or 1000 years, but by then it won't look much like it does today.

Many of the problems are similar. So no, turning to Protestantism, Catholicism, Islam....

Oh yeah, many of the problems are similar. And then Mormonism has tons of extra problems. Boy does it ever.

Now whether the Church is still the way Joseph would have wanted it, maybe not. How to deal with evil that comes from within it and from the leadership is what I struggle to deal with now.

Huh? What do you mean by this?

[_harmony]

9. I still see plural marriage as potentially the most happy state a man can achieve in eternity.

"A man". Not a woman, though.

[_ajax18]

No way. Mormonism has a short recent history, a peculiar founder who claimed to speak for god, and numerous factual difficulties that other mainstream religions do not have. Go ahead and compare it to Scientology or the Jehovah's Witnesses, but when you say it has the same problems as Protestantism, Catholicism, Islam, etc. I think you are expressing a wishful desire. Mormonism may well last 500 or 1000 years, but by then it won't look much like it does today.

How do you figure? I see tons of problems with Islam. Islam allows polygamy, although we don't get on their case about as much as we do Mormons. Islam has a peculiar founder that claims to have spoken with God and for all practical purposes the people follow his words as if it were God's words. Lastly I don't really see Islam as being organized enough to pin it down on anything.

I see lots of problems with Catholicism. Catholicism had the idea of an infallible pope, indulgences, witchhunts, and all sorts of crazy stuff in their history. I understand that they've been around longer and thus accumulated a lot of problems, but I see a lot of problems in their faith. I don't think it would take long to tear either one of these down. I thought Talmage did a pretty good job of it in his book, "The Great Apostasy."

Then we have the protestants and once again I don't see where they're really organized enough to pin them down on anything. From what I've seen these people church and preacher shop just like you would shop for other essentials. They don't have a ward they go to. They just go to whatever preacher they like best.

And then Mormonism has tons of extra problems.

I'll concede your point because honestly I don't know all the details, but what does it matter? If they both have problems, that still leads to atheism. I don't really see that as a solution to the original problem of death or finding meaning in life and suffering. My point being that I don't think people who leave the LDS church because they've found problems in the religion are going to find a different religion that is problem free.

[_ajax18]

9. I still see plural marriage as potentially the most happy state a man can achieve in eternity.

"A man". Not a woman, though.

And whatever you view as your happiest state in the next life Harmony, I'm sure God will grant you that as well. I don't necessarily think that we can limit the possibilities of eternity with earthly limitations, e.g. # of men vs. women, resources, how we even view fairness.

[_harmony]

9. I still see plural marriage as potentially the most happy state a man can achieve in eternity.

"A man". Not a woman, though.

And whatever you view as your happiest state in the next life Harmony, I'm sure God will grant you that as well. I don't necessarily think that we can limit the possibilities of eternity with earthly limitations, e.g. # of men vs. women, resources, how we even view fairness.

Your words betray how you view half of God's children, ajax. If women are less, and deserve less from eternity, then no doubt plural marriage would be the most happy state a man could achieve. Only if one values each person to the fullest of their potential could one understand why women would generally not agree with your assessment.

[_Ray A]

Ray does not count, he obviously does not believe it enough to be a member again.

This reminds me of Henry Eyring's statement: "[In the Church] I don't have to believe anything that isn't true."

Eyring, by the way, is the father of Apostle Henry Eyring.

[_ajax18]

9. I still see plural marriage as potentially the most happy state a man can achieve in eternity.

"A man". Not a woman, though.

And whatever you view as your happiest state in the next life Harmony, I'm sure God will grant you that as well. I don't necessarily think that we can limit the possibilities of eternity with earthly limitations, e.g. # of men vs. women, resources, how we even view fairness.

Your words betray how you view half of God's children, ajax. If women are less, and deserve less from eternity, then no doubt plural marriage would be the most happy state a man could achieve. Only if one values each person to the fullest of their potential could one understand why women would generally not agree with your assessment.

That's your opinion. I can see how it could work out for everyones best interest. If that is seeing that women deserve less than men in your eyes, than so be it, but in my opinion it doesn't have to be so.

[_harmony]

That's your opinion. I can see how it could work out for everyones best interest. If that is seeing that women deserve less than men in your eyes, than so be it, but in my opinion it doesn't have to be so.

How is being treated like chattel for eternity in women's best interest?

[_ajax18]

That's your opinion. I can see how it could work out for everyones best interest. If that is seeing that women deserve less than men in your eyes, than so be it, but in my opinion it doesn't have to be so.

How is being treated like chattel for eternity in women's best interest?

I don't really see it as being treated like chattel for eternity. With our earthly understanding and necessary conclusions I see your point and recognize that polygamy poses a problem for women. I'm just saying that we don't know enough yet to make a conclusion that women could not find their ultimate happiness in this type of arrangement. If you're convinced that you wouldn't and no subsequent knowledge would change your mind, then I guess that's your belief and you have a right to it. For that reason I said that God would probably grant you what you desired. If you get to the next life and find that only monogamy exists, perhaps you'll have made it to heavan as you see it should be.

[_Mercury]

Well s***chya Bro. Hey I'M ON THE BOARD NOW!!

[MODERATOR NOTE: Please do not use the "S" word, or any of its variants, in the Terrestrial Forum. Thanks!]

Welcome to the Octagon!

Be prepared to get called into cage matches by the UN of Mormon/antimormons.

Polyg, u know what i mean.