Regrets over resigning?

[Guest]

In other words, none of these apostates has had a close encounter of the fifth kind where the alien explained that the person should resign. One wonders if Tobin requires folks who join the Church to also have a close encounter of the fifth kind where an alien visitor explains that they should join. It's a weird expectation since Tobin has admitted that he's never successfully summoned back an alien through prayer or meditation, and it's unknown even within his own internal narrative whether the aliens would ever respond to us, and so what he's really saying is apostates should stay members forever because he knows there's little to no chance they'll ever get an answer for anything. It's even more bizarre since within his own narrative as he's explained it, alien morals do not translate to our morals, an aliens can kill us, lie to us, farm us, or whatever, because we don't matter -- just like if we step on a bug. So why would we care about the opinion of an alien whose motives have nothing to do necessarily with our best interests anyway?

I think Mormons claim to seek to speak with God and to be doing what God wishes. You can characterize these encounters and what the motivations behind these beings may be how ever you wish. You are being silly by denying that if such beings exist that they can really be anything but an advanced life form. And of course I think if you are going to join the LDS Church on the basis that man can really see and speak with beings like this, one should have done so.

[_Tobin]

you have said many times that the LDS church is a man-made religion, so why do you feel regret about other people leaving? Why do you even care? And if the church is man made, as you claim, why should they seek guidance from "the Lord" before leaving it?

These members supposedly joined the LDS Church because God told them to. I think leaving the LDS Church over political correctness seems like a rather silly reason in light of that.

[_Kishkumen]

These members supposedly joined the LDS Church because God told them to. I think leaving the LDS Church over political correctness seems like a rather silly reason in light of that.

Can you stop going out of your way to be an asshole? You don't know why individual members joined the LDS Church, and you have no business telling anyone that their reasons for leaving don't meet your imaginary criteria for legitimacy. If God endowed people with brains, then figuring out the LDS Church is hurtful, false, or what have you, is more than sufficient divine inspiration.

[_sock puppet]

These members supposedly joined the LDS Church because God told them to. I think leaving the LDS Church over political correctness seems like a rather silly reason in light of that.

Can you stop going out of your way to be an asshole?

Now, Kishkumen, you are asking for a divine miracle to take place.

[_Tobin]

These members supposedly joined the LDS Church because God told them to. I think leaving the LDS Church over political correctness seems like a rather silly reason in light of that.

Can you stop going out of your way to be an asshole? You don't know why individual members joined the LDS Church, and you have no business telling anyone that their reasons for leaving don't meet your imaginary criteria for legitimacy. If God endowed people with brains, then figuring out the LDS Church is hurtful, false, or what have you, is more than sufficient divine inspiration.

You are right. I don't know why many of these members joined the LDS Church. However, given how easily they left the LDS Church it seems pretty clear they joined for frivolous reasons since they are leaving over something equally frivolous. The LDS Church has NEVER been a welcoming institution for gay people. The fact that certain members are just waking up to that fact and giving up decades of membership over this is extremely humorous. Now, you might think I'm an asshole for pointing out the obvious. But you have to be joking if you really expect me to take this seriously.

[_Some Schmo]

Tobin's nonsense aside, are there real benefits to resigning? In my case, yes. It has definitely changed the power dynamic in my interactions with local Mormons. My bishop plays dominance games and the resignation really took the wind out of his sails. Now he just ignores me. This is a real benefit to me, even if the resignation was only a thing that exists in his mind.

So when people say that I'm just playing the LDS game in resigning, I see their point but the benefits are real if it affects the toxic relationship dynamics around me.

There has never been a singular moment since leaving that I regretted it. It would be like saying I missed being crucified. And for about 20 or so years, the thought of formally resigning never crossed my mind. In fact, I didn't even know it was a process. And when I finally did find out it was an option, my initial reaction was, "Why fuckin' bother? I don't consider myself lds (if I ever had), and I don't do the church thing; that's all that's important."

But I did resign for my wife because she couldn't stand the periodic, no-invite drop-bys from assorted church types asking if I was coming back to church any time soon. Those visits always amused me; her, not so much.

So I wrote up a nice little manifesto of my beliefs at the time and gave it to the missies the next time they stopped by, asking them to forward it to the bishop or whomever needed to see it to get me off the books. Got a letter a little while later acknowledging my resignation. That was nice. I said, "Oh yeah... good," and tossed it in the trash.

[_Kishkumen]

You are right. I don't know why many of these members joined the LDS Church. However, given how easily they left the LDS Church it seems pretty clear they joined for frivolous reasons since they are leaving over something equally frivolous. The LDS Church has NEVER been a welcoming institution for gay people. The fact that certain members are just waking up to that fact and giving up decades of membership over this is extremely humorous. Now, you might think I'm an asshole for pointing out the obvious. But you have to be joking if you really expect me to take this seriously.

Believe me, Tobin: I don't expect very much from you.

[_pashaman]

You are being silly by denying that if such beings exist that they can really be anything but an advanced life form.

Tobin only gained mad respect for aliens after he arrogantly and inadvertently trolled one.

[_Dr. Shades]

Runtu, I hope you can forgive me for the comments I'm about to make, but here goes:

An American couple who lived in Bolivia when I was a missionary and took care of us when we were sick or needed something; they have a gay son, and they had until now believed that the church could be a loving, welcoming place for their son.

First, what on Earth were they smoking? Second, what hard evidence did they have for that fanciful notion?

And I feel a little stupid for not realizing until now that the church was capable of deliberately hurting people, even targeting children, to further its aims.

I guess this means you'd never heard of Helen Mar Kimball?

[Guest]

How do you know people haven't sought to seek and do what the Lord wishes? I can't speak for anyone else, but my choice to leave was a result of a direct answer to prayer.

Maybe you should stop pretending you know what other people have experienced. Makes you look like a judgmental prick.

Really? I've yet to hear of one of these apostates who has yet seen and actually spoken with the Lord and found out what he has to say about the matter. But you are welcome to your delusions about yourself and about me.

I saw and had a conversation with Jesus Christ. He literally sat down on my couch when I was submitting my resignation letter, and asked me why I was leaving his Church. I explained that the Church wasn't what it claimed to be, and showed him various websites around the Interwebs.

He got a bit of a constipated look on his face, and mumbled something about talking to Elder Packer to straighten this out.

And * poof * he was gone.

You'll note He didn't try to talk me out of it.

- Doc

eta: To answer Runtu's question, no I have never, not once, regretted my decision to resign. At first it was a matter of spiritual integrity. It was the most soul wrenching thing I could have done, but I did it because I thought it was the right thing to do. However, with time, and with more information you realize just how screwed up the COB information peddlers are and it becomes political. Not only do I not regret it, but I feel it necessary to participate online and in person in an anti-COB* stance.

* You'll note I don't say anti-Mormon because I think Mormons are generally good people who are groomed to act in a certain way.