The artificial intelligence MEGATHREAD

[MG 2.0]

More information á la Gad is better.

in my opinion, some other varieties, perhaps not so much.

I think it is in the eye of the beholder. Not that the contributions of gadianton are not useful. But he isn't the only source of information on the planet.

Back to reading...

Regards,
MG

[malkie]

More information á la Gad is better.

in my opinion, some other varieties, perhaps not so much.

I think it is in the eye of the beholder. Not that the contributions of gadianton are not useful. But he isn't the only source of information on the planet.

Back to reading...

Regards,
MG

Tell me that you don't understand á la without saying "I don't understand á la."

[MG 2.0]

I think it is in the eye of the beholder. Not that the contributions of gadianton are not useful. But he isn't the only source of information on the planet.

Back to reading...

Regards,
MG

Tell me that you don't understand á la without saying "I don't understand á la."

I went back and looked it up. It means what I thought it meant. And I said what I meant.

Regards,
MG

[MG 2.0]

Why don't you just change your moniker from MG 2.0 to A.I. 1.0?

Because A.I. is only a tool. It's not who I am or what I personally have to say.

But it is useful. It saves time.

And I approve this message.

Regards,
MG

[MG 2.0]

I would add a couple of things. Faith in the LDS Church can fail BECAUSE of a belief in a creator and Jesus.

Oh yes, absolutely. No argument there.

Take for example the recent widespread and systemic financial wrongdoing that the Church was caught doing - If you believe in a creator and in Jesus then surely you believe they cannot be actually at the wheel of an organisation that wilfully lies and cheats? In such a scenario a belief in a creator and Jesus would drive a wedge between the believer's faith and their trust that their Church held a similar faithful belief.

Yes. And it's one thing to make a mistake, but when you realize, as you noted, how 'widespread and systematic' the financial wrongdoing was, and especially how hard they worked to cover it up, it hits even harder.

Also, one can believe in the notion of "spirit" and "conscience" without readily conforming to a belief in a creator and a Jesus. We've demonstrated many times that people who leave the Church and who also leave all faith behind, are in the minority. Most retain a faith and a belief in something bigger than this existence, in whatever form they decide to frame it. At this point there are likely more people who have left active involvement in the LDS Church but retained a faith of some sort, than there are active LDS believers sat in the pews on any given Sunday.

Definitely. Well said.

More to chew on:

Prompt: After hovering around five-year high over the last half of 2024, the immense portfolio of U.S. stocks, bonds and mutual funds managed for The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints took nearly a $4 billion plunge in value. Is this actually the fault of the Presiding Authorities or does any fault lie at the feet of the companies that do investing for the church?

Responsibility for the $4 Billion Decline in LDS Church Investment Portfolio
Overview of the Decline

After reaching a five-year high in the latter half of 2024, the portfolio of U.S. stocks, bonds, and mutual funds managed for The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS Church) experienced an almost $4 billion drop in value. This portfolio is managed primarily by Ensign Peak Advisors, the church’s investment arm.

Who is Responsible for the Loss?
Presiding Authorities' Role
The Presiding Authorities of the LDS Church (such as the First Presidency and Quorum of the Twelve Apostles) set the overall investment policy and approve the selection of professional managers but do not make day-to-day investment decisions themselves.

Their responsibility is to ensure prudent stewardship, transparency, and adherence to the church’s long-term financial goals. They rely on professional staff for execution.

Investment Managers' Role (Ensign Peak Advisors and Others)
Ensign Peak Advisors, staffed by professional money managers, is responsible for the day-to-day management of the portfolio, including stock selection, timing, and rebalancing.

Analysis shows that Ensign Peak’s strategy closely mirrors the S&P 500 index, but with some deviations in stock selection and timing. Over the past several years, the fund has sometimes underperformed the S&P 500, with research suggesting that poor stock selection, market timing, and trading decisions by managers may have contributed to lagging returns.

The managers have also been reallocating assets, selling off billions in stocks since 2023, possibly in anticipation of better returns elsewhere, which can introduce timing risk and potential losses if market moves are unfavorable.

External Market Factors
The value of any large investment portfolio is also subject to broader market conditions. A decline of $4 billion in a portfolio of this size is not unusual during periods of market volatility, especially when the portfolio is heavily invested in equities and bonds, which can fluctuate significantly in value.

No evidence suggests that the loss was due to misconduct or negligence by either the Presiding Authorities or the investment managers; rather, it appears to be a combination of market performance and investment decisions.

Perplexity A.I.

Seems as though there is more to the story and that more information is always better than less. There isn't anything here that would suggest that Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ cannot be "at the wheel" as far as the execution of the Four Fold Mission of the Church.

Oh ye of little faith.

And I mean little.

Regards,
MG

[MG 2.0]

Are you a little off?

Regards,
MG

MG, have you heard about Kirton McConkie's instructions not to blab for reporting bishops and victims?

Yes. And for further information this might be helpful:

Kirton McConkie's Instructions on Reporting Abuse: "Don't Blab" Policies for Bishops and Victims.
Overview

Kirton McConkie, the Salt Lake City law firm representing The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS Church), plays a central role in the Church’s abuse reporting system. Their instructions and the structure of the Church’s abuse helpline have come under scrutiny for prioritizing legal protection and institutional secrecy over transparency and victim support.

How the Abuse Helpline Works

Bishops and other church leaders are instructed to call a confidential "abuse help line"—established by Kirton McConkie in 1995—when they receive reports of abuse.

Calls are initially answered by LDS Family Services staff, but are quickly transferred to Kirton McConkie attorneys, who provide legal counsel on how to proceed.

The helpline is structured so that all information discussed is covered under attorney-client privilege, making it difficult for law enforcement or courts to access these records.

Instructions to Bishops: "Don't Blab"

Bishops are routinely advised not to report abuse to law enforcement unless explicitly required by state law.

In practice, this means:

If state law allows clergy to keep abuse confessions confidential (as in Arizona), bishops are told to maintain secrecy—even if they are legally permitted (but not required) to report.

Bishops are told not to testify in court or speak to police about abuse allegations; this instruction extends to other church leaders and counselors.

In meetings where abuse is discussed, mandatory reporters are sometimes excluded to avoid triggering legal reporting requirements.

The Church’s official position is to "comply with whatever reporting is required by law," but not to go beyond that—even if doing so would better protect victims.

Regards,
MG

[Moksha]

Instructions to Bishops: "Don't Blab"

The Church’s official position is to "comply with whatever reporting is required by law," but not to go beyond that—even if doing so would better protect victims.

Regards,
MG

Can't have this "even if doing so would better protect victims". What a sad indictment of this corporation that refers to itself as a Church. An actual church would strive to do the right thing.

[Morley]

Oh yes, absolutely. No argument there.

Yes. And it's one thing to make a mistake, but when you realize, as you noted, how 'widespread and systematic' the financial wrongdoing was, and especially how hard they worked to cover it up, it hits even harder.
Definitely. Well said.

More to chew on:

Prompt: After hovering around five-year high over the last half of 2024, the immense portfolio of U.S. stocks, bonds and mutual funds managed for The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints took nearly a $4 billion plunge in value. Is this actually the fault of the Presiding Authorities or does any fault lie at the feet of the companies that do investing for the church?

Responsibility for the $4 Billion Decline in LDS Church Investment Portfolio
Overview of the Decline

After reaching a five-year high in the latter half of 2024, the portfolio of U.S. stocks, bonds, and mutual funds managed for The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS Church) experienced an almost $4 billion drop in value. This portfolio is managed primarily by Ensign Peak Advisors, the church’s investment arm.

Who is Responsible for the Loss?
Presiding Authorities' Role
The Presiding Authorities of the LDS Church (such as the First Presidency and Quorum of the Twelve Apostles) set the overall investment policy and approve the selection of professional managers but do not make day-to-day investment decisions themselves.

Their responsibility is to ensure prudent stewardship, transparency, and adherence to the church’s long-term financial goals. They rely on professional staff for execution.

Investment Managers' Role (Ensign Peak Advisors and Others)
Ensign Peak Advisors, staffed by professional money managers, is responsible for the day-to-day management of the portfolio, including stock selection, timing, and rebalancing.

Analysis shows that Ensign Peak’s strategy closely mirrors the S&P 500 index, but with some deviations in stock selection and timing. Over the past several years, the fund has sometimes underperformed the S&P 500, with research suggesting that poor stock selection, market timing, and trading decisions by managers may have contributed to lagging returns.

The managers have also been reallocating assets, selling off billions in stocks since 2023, possibly in anticipation of better returns elsewhere, which can introduce timing risk and potential losses if market moves are unfavorable.

External Market Factors
The value of any large investment portfolio is also subject to broader market conditions. A decline of $4 billion in a portfolio of this size is not unusual during periods of market volatility, especially when the portfolio is heavily invested in equities and bonds, which can fluctuate significantly in value.

No evidence suggests that the loss was due to misconduct or negligence by either the Presiding Authorities or the investment managers; rather, it appears to be a combination of market performance and investment decisions.

Perplexity A.I.

Seems as though there is more to the story and that more information is always better than less. There isn't anything here that would suggest that Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ cannot be "at the wheel" as far as the execution of the Four Fold Mission of the Church.

Oh ye of little faith.

And I mean little.

Regards,
MG

Derail reported. Unless I missed it, no one in this thread is suggesting that the LDS First Presidency is responsible for the Church’s stock market losses. This wall of text argument against something that was never suggested is horribly off topic.

[I Have Questions]

MG, have you heard about Kirton McConkie's instructions not to blab for reporting bishops and victims?

Yes. And for further information this might be helpful:

Kirton McConkie's Instructions on Reporting Abuse: "Don't Blab" Policies for Bishops and Victims.
Overview

Kirton McConkie, the Salt Lake City law firm representing The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS Church), plays a central role in the Church’s abuse reporting system. Their instructions and the structure of the Church’s abuse helpline have come under scrutiny for prioritizing legal protection and institutional secrecy over transparency and victim support.

How the Abuse Helpline Works

Bishops and other church leaders are instructed to call a confidential "abuse help line"—established by Kirton McConkie in 1995—when they receive reports of abuse.

Calls are initially answered by LDS Family Services staff, but are quickly transferred to Kirton McConkie attorneys, who provide legal counsel on how to proceed.

The helpline is structured so that all information discussed is covered under attorney-client privilege, making it difficult for law enforcement or courts to access these records.

Instructions to Bishops: "Don't Blab"

Bishops are routinely advised not to report abuse to law enforcement unless explicitly required by state law.

In practice, this means:

If state law allows clergy to keep abuse confessions confidential (as in Arizona), bishops are told to maintain secrecy—even if they are legally permitted (but not required) to report.

Bishops are told not to testify in court or speak to police about abuse allegations; this instruction extends to other church leaders and counselors.

In meetings where abuse is discussed, mandatory reporters are sometimes excluded to avoid triggering legal reporting requirements.

The Church’s official position is to "comply with whatever reporting is required by law," but not to go beyond that—even if doing so would better protect victims.

Regards,
MG

Hi MG, you’ve provided a lengthy quote without linking to the source. Again. Or you’ve provided a wall of A.I. text without providing the prompt. Again. Please correct whichever error it is or I’ll need to report your post. Again.

[MG 2.0]

Yes. And for further information this might be helpful:

Regards,
MG

Hi MG, you’ve provided a lengthy quote without linking to the source. Again. Or you’ve provided a wall of A.I. text without providing the prompt. Again. Please correct whichever error it is or I’ll need to report your post. Again.

Perplexity A.I.- prompt at the top.

Hope this helps.

Regards,
MG