Epic Mormonism Live on Rosebud Accusations

[honorentheos]

Rosebud was clearly not voted onto the board until June of 2011. So he backdated her board membership for some reason.

Only he can answer why he did that.

Clearly? Last I checked the only document evidence is the tax filing. What evidence do you possess shows otherwise? Why wouldn't you send it to the IRS instead of arguing about it on a message board?

[jpatterson]

Of course Open Stories Foundation was organized as a non-profit, whose status was confirmed in January 2011. I believe the letter was dated January 27, 2011, to be exact.

Again, not sure where you're getting these dates from. According to the state of Arizona, where Open Stories Foundation is incorporated, the non-profit was approved on March 2 of 2010: https://drive.google.com/file/d/11QHZsS ... sp=sharing

The vision, the parts, the work to make it happen didn't begin with the organization of Open Stories Foundation's board. Rosebud was part of that

No. She. Wasn't. Show your work.

You're saying her vision and involvement post-dated early January 2011 when every one of those features are included in the vision John shared for where Mormon Stories was heading?

Yes, those were features of Open Stories Foundation that John had envisioned, that Rosebud came along and enhanced and eventually, once she became more and more involved, began to actively manage under John's supervision.

You're saying Open Stories Foundation filed false tax information listing Rosebud as a board member in 2010?

I'm not saying that. The documents make very clear that's what happened: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1G_fJP4 ... sp=sharing

It's up to John to explain the blatant discrepancy, not me.

[jpatterson]

Why wouldn't you send it to the IRS instead of arguing about it on a message board?

LOL. When all else fails, criticize someone for merely participating in an open discussion.

John came here to defend himself. In the process of doing so, he exposed two new...lies, discrepancies, call them what you will.

1. He said Rosebud was a founding board member. She clearly was not.

2. It's now clear that Open Stories Foundation's 2010 990 contained false information.

Your suggestion that these two new pieces of information are not germane to this discussion we've been having is silly, frankly.

[honorentheos]

Clearly? Last I checked the only document evidence is the tax filing. What evidence do you possess shows otherwise? Why wouldn't you send it to the IRS instead of arguing about it on a message board?

LOL. When all else fails, criticize someone for merely participating in an open discussion.

John came here to defend himself. In the process of doing so, he exposed two new...lies, discrepancies, call them what you will.

1. He said Rosebud was a founding board member. She clearly was not.

2. It's now clear Open Stories Foundation's 2010 990 contained false information.

Your suggestion that these two new pieces of information are not germane to this discussion we've been having is silly, frankly.

My argument is and remains Rosebud's involvement on the board does not inform the relationship between Rosebud and John that has bearing on her involvement with Open Stories Foundation. If, as she said in some of the material provided, when she first met John and shared her thoughts on local-based Facebook communities and conferences that served as the genesis for their interactions that led to her eventually working as an employee of Open Stories Foundation, then her status as a board member is irrelevant to the sexual harassment argument. Her involvement on the board is noted as uncompensated and unobligated by time commitments.

As to the question of when she became a board member: John said she was a founding member on the forum, you say she wasn't. The Open Stories Foundation tax filing from 2010 show her as a board member, the initial articles of incorporation in 2/2010 in AZ do not list her, only John. Nor is she listed on the amended articles filed shortly thereafter. The 2011 AZ filing to maintain status does list her with a 6/11 date for her title as director, John as 11/10 under the title of CEO which date appears with the other officers, and John is listed again as the only member with a date of 2/10 as a director.

Based on the AZ filings you seem to be right that on incorporating she wasn't listed as a board member.

I apologize for arguing against this in the last two posts given the AZ documents support your claim.

[jpatterson]

As to the question of when she became a board member: John said she was a founding member on the forum, you say she wasn't.

Again, no. This isn't a he said/he said between me and John.

This is John saying one thing and documents saying something completely different.

The question really is why would John misrepresent when Rosebud became a board member? Both here on the board and within a tax document?

[honorentheos]

As to the question of when she became a board member: John said she was a founding member on the forum, you say she wasn't.

Again, no. This isn't a he said/he said between me and John.

This is John saying one thing and documents saying something completely different.

The question really is why would John misrepresent when Rosebud became a board member? Both here on the board and within a tax document?

I see why Rosebud has you as her champion. You hit a sentence that set you off and failed to keep reading.

[jpatterson]

I see why Rosebud has you as her champion. You hit a sentence that set you off and failed to keep reading.

No, I read every word of your post. Perhaps your writing could be more clear.

You also failed to acknowledge the documentation I provided that shows Rosebud was brought onto the board in June 2011.

[honorentheos]

JP, I think what is more relevant than the board membership is when they began interacting. I recall early references to their first meetings. Perhaps you can share the ones you believe lay out that timeline?

[honorentheos]

I see why Rosebud has you as her champion. You hit a sentence that set you off and failed to keep reading.

No, I read every word of your post. Perhaps your writing could be more clear.

You also failed to acknowledge the documentation I provided that shows Rosebud was brought onto the board in June 2011.

Yeah, that's it.

Or, you replied before reading the whole post or you wouldn't have said I was still calling it a he said/he said after acknowledging you appeared to be right based on the Arizona articles of incorporation.

You didn't keep reading before replying.

[jpatterson]

JP, I think what is more relevant than the board membership is when they began interacting. I recall early references to their first meetings. Perhaps you can share the ones you believe lay out that timeline?

Sure.

The earliest stuff I have dates for is a series of emails from Feb 2011 in which Rosebud is helping ideate some stuff around a MSP book club. That's the first "volunteer" type work there is documentation of. It seems to be Rosebud fleshing out an idea John had that he couldn't get around to fleshing out.

Then there was the March 2011 conference. Rosebud says that before this conference, she and her family had met JD and his family in Logan, after having interacted with him on Facebook for a bit. It's not very clear when exactly that meeting took place, I think she maybe mentions that in her interview, but I don't have it off the top of my head.

What she makes clear in her interview, though is that she first shared her expansive views for what Mormon Stories and Open Stories Foundation could eventually become at the NYC conference in March of 2011. That's when they went to Planet Hollywood, etc etc.

That is after John had already outlined a general vision of conferences, online communities, etc in the MSP page you linked earlier. John had outlined a vision. He brought Rosebud on because she knew how to execute the vision (John has been very open about the fact that he's a great visionary but a poor executor. As someone who worked for him, I can also attest to this).

So they interact in person in March, their online relationship continues to heat up between then and the early summer, she's brought on the board and then she was hired full time.

It's clear (to me) from this timeline that characterizing Rosebud as a founding member of Open Stories Foundation is not accurate. She was brought on to help John execute on the vision he and the board had already begun to lay out in late 2010/early 2011.