Congratulations DCP

[_Rollo Tomasi]

I'm drawn to the bad guys ....

Now I'm a "bad guy"?

... because one of my principal reasons for coming here is my fascination with extraordinarily bad behavior over religious issues.

Since when did open discussion and debate equate with "extraordinarily bad behavior over religious issues"?

I don't come to places like this for substantive discussion.

That's been obvious for a very long time.

I am, in fact, not dismissive and condescending ....

You absolutely are with folks with whom you disagree.

I have many, many flaws, but elitism isn't among those flaws. It never has been.

Many of your posts sure come across that way.

I never respond in a sneering or condescending way to serious people with serious questions.

A pile of manure.

It strikes me as truly bizarre that you write to fault me for responding, but fail to notice the continuous and consistently juvenile attacks to which I'm responding.

Your responses, by far, are more juvenile. That's what you are known for.

[_Mister Scratch]

Bill did his doctorate at the University of Michigan, but he's lived in both Egypt and Israel, for probably around three or four years altogether. Completely surrounded by Semites. He reads Hebrew, and he reads and speaks Arabic -- Semitic languages, both. His professional field of study is focused on Semitic history, ancient and medieval.

More importantly, I've known Bill Hamblin for roughly twenty-five years. He's no anti-Semite. The charge would be laughable if it weren't so patently evil and irresponsible. If, in other words, it weren't vintage Scratch. Hiding securely behind his cowardly pseudonym, Scratch spews slander the way Linda Blair spewed projectile vomit. What a repulsive piece of work.

I think folks can judge for themselves. Here is the passage once again:

Bigotry
All one needs to do to see the bigotry on this board is replace the ubiquitous terms Morg and Morgbot with Kike. Try the following on for size: "I get mad every time I think about those Kikes. The Kikes are so clannish; and they wear funny cloths. Those stupid Kikes always do what their Rabbis tell them. They think they should be obedient to God. What mindless Kikebots. They actually have 613 commandments; count ‘em--six hundred and thirteen. This proves they're a mind-control cult. You know, Kikes have committed murder and embezzled money. In fact, when a Kike commits murder, it's because he's a Kike. There is something about those Kikes that makes them violent. The Kikes are all rich, too. They control the money and politics of New York. Not just New York, they control Hollywood too, and want to control the politics of the entire country. Indeed, they are a threat to freedom and democracy. And their kosher rules are so-ooo stupid. They make me want to gag. Why shouldn't I eat a cheeseburger if I want to? You can't get a good ham sandwich in a Kike deli. I want a ham sandwich, and I'm not going to let those Kikes stop me from eating it. I sure hate those Kikes! They drive me nuts." It simply won't do to insist that you're not really a bigot because what you believe about Mormonism is really true. Anti-Semites honestly think their not bigots either--what they believe about Jews is really true: "I'm not bigoted! There really is an international Jewish banking conspiracy."

I found this to be utterly vile, irresponsible, and full of hate. Why, I ask you, was this degree of nastiness really necessary? Would Prof. Hamblin feel okay about saying this same long list of things in the company of all those "semites" he hung out with? If you'd like, we can post this rant up on a Jewish blog, and see what they think about this---i.e., if they find it to be totally kosher. I personally thought this rant from Prof. Hamblin to be quite sick and offensive. I would feel the same if he had replaced the "K-word" with any other racial or ethnic epithet. His repeated use of this term was just plain irresponsible.

[_Mister Scratch]

And if I ever meet Mr. Scratch on the street, I'll knock him on his ass, pin him to the ground, and stick blades of grass up his nose until he cries.

Ah, lovely. More threats of physical violence from TBMs. Gee, did Ray A happen to see this I wonder?

[_Some Schmo]

I found this to be utterly vile, irresponsible, and full of hate. Why, I ask you, was this degree of nastiness really necessary? Would Prof. Hamblin feel okay about saying this same long list of things in the company of all those "semites" he hung out with? If you'd like, we can post this rant up on a Jewish blog, and see what they think about this---I.e., if they find it to be totally kosher. I personally thought this rant from Prof. Hamblin to be quite sick and offensive. I would feel the same if he had replaced the "K-word" with any other racial or ethnic epithet. His repeated use of this term was just plain irresponsible.

He did seem to go to town with his "example." It's obvious that he didn't just take some random exmo post and replace all instances of "Morgbot" with "Kike." He was naming specific anti-Semitic stereotypes, and was doing it seemingly with enthusiasm. The guy might as well be a nazi.

Can't really blame the Mormons, though. Prejudice and racism are built into the religion.

[_Mister Scratch]

I found this to be utterly vile, irresponsible, and full of hate. Why, I ask you, was this degree of nastiness really necessary? Would Prof. Hamblin feel okay about saying this same long list of things in the company of all those "semites" he hung out with? If you'd like, we can post this rant up on a Jewish blog, and see what they think about this---I.e., if they find it to be totally kosher. I personally thought this rant from Prof. Hamblin to be quite sick and offensive. I would feel the same if he had replaced the "K-word" with any other racial or ethnic epithet. His repeated use of this term was just plain irresponsible.

He did seem to go to town with his "example." It's obvious that he didn't just take some random exmo post and replace all instances of "Morgbot" with "Kike." He was naming specific anti-Semitic stereotypes, and was doing it seemingly with enthusiasm. The guy might as well be a nazi.

Can't really blame the Mormons, though. Prejudice and racism are built into the religion.

Yes, you're absolutely right. The extensive nature of his post made it all the more appalling, imho.

[_Rollo Tomasi]

He did seem to go to town with his "example." It's obvious that he didn't just take some random exmo post and replace all instances of "Morgbot" with "Kike." He was naming specific anti-Semitic stereotypes, and was doing it seemingly with enthusiasm. The guy might as well be a nazi.

Agreed. Whatever Hamblin's intent, he went way over the line.

[_Scottie]

Bill did his doctorate at the University of Michigan, but he's lived in both Egypt and Israel, for probably around three or four years altogether. Completely surrounded by Semites. He reads Hebrew, and he reads and speaks Arabic -- Semitic languages, both. His professional field of study is focused on Semitic history, ancient and medieval.

More importantly, I've known Bill Hamblin for roughly twenty-five years. He's no anti-Semite. The charge would be laughable if it weren't so patently evil and irresponsible. If, in other words, it weren't vintage Scratch. Hiding securely behind his cowardly pseudonym, Scratch spews slander the way Linda Blair spewed projectile vomit. What a repulsive piece of work.

I think folks can judge for themselves. Here is the passage once again:

Bigotry
All one needs to do to see the bigotry on this board is replace the ubiquitous terms Morg and Morgbot with Kike. Try the following on for size: "I get mad every time I think about those Kikes. The Kikes are so clannish; and they wear funny cloths. Those stupid Kikes always do what their Rabbis tell them. They think they should be obedient to God. What mindless Kikebots. They actually have 613 commandments; count ‘em--six hundred and thirteen. This proves they're a mind-control cult. You know, Kikes have committed murder and embezzled money. In fact, when a Kike commits murder, it's because he's a Kike. There is something about those Kikes that makes them violent. The Kikes are all rich, too. They control the money and politics of New York. Not just New York, they control Hollywood too, and want to control the politics of the entire country. Indeed, they are a threat to freedom and democracy. And their kosher rules are so-ooo stupid. They make me want to gag. Why shouldn't I eat a cheeseburger if I want to? You can't get a good ham sandwich in a Kike deli. I want a ham sandwich, and I'm not going to let those Kikes stop me from eating it. I sure hate those Kikes! They drive me nuts." It simply won't do to insist that you're not really a bigot because what you believe about Mormonism is really true. Anti-Semites honestly think their not bigots either--what they believe about Jews is really true: "I'm not bigoted! There really is an international Jewish banking conspiracy."

I found this to be utterly vile, irresponsible, and full of hate. Why, I ask you, was this degree of nastiness really necessary? Would Prof. Hamblin feel okay about saying this same long list of things in the company of all those "semites" he hung out with? If you'd like, we can post this rant up on a Jewish blog, and see what they think about this---I.e., if they find it to be totally kosher. I personally thought this rant from Prof. Hamblin to be quite sick and offensive. I would feel the same if he had replaced the "K-word" with any other racial or ethnic epithet. His repeated use of this term was just plain irresponsible.

Scratch, I gotta disagree with you here.

He wasn't actually saying these things. He was illustrating a point that anti-Mormons feel like they can spew any and all manner of name calling they want and get away with it, but if a similar line of hatred and name calling were spewed toward the Jews, it would be a hate crime. The post was made as if he were an angry anti-Mormon, except replacing Morg with Kike.

He actually has a good point, and I've thought that for years. I'm not sure why Mormons aren't umbrellaed under the hate laws. Why is it socially acceptable for street preachers to defile sacred Mormon items, but would be considered the lowest form of scum if they did the same thing to Jewish or Muslim holy items?

Edited: I just read the most recent posts. I don't think that any 1 post has said all those things about Mormonism, but they have all been said.

So, since you think it's over the line when it's said about Jews, do you think it's bad when an exmo actually says those things about the LDS church? Do you approve of the term Morg?

[_beastie]

He actually has a good point, and I've thought that for years. I'm not sure why Mormons aren't umbrellaed under the hate laws. Why is it socially acceptable for street preachers to defile sacred Mormon items, but would be considered the lowest form of scum if they did the same thing to Jewish or Muslim holy items?

Uh, scottie? Have you ever been in an evangelical book store? They are against all sorts of religious groups, not just Mormons. You definitely have the wrong impression if you think they're targeting Mormons alone. They can't stand catholicism, for example, or just about any "new religious movement".

The reason they pay negative attention to these groups is because they literally believe these groups are influencing people to go to hell to burn for all eternity. If a person really, truly, believes that, then I guess they do have a moral responsibility to warn people.

[_William Schryver]

And if I ever meet Mr. Scratch on the street, I'll knock him on his ass, pin him to the ground, and stick blades of grass up his nose until he cries.

Ah, lovely. More threats of physical violence from TBMs. Gee, did Ray A happen to see this I wonder?

I'm sure blades of grass up the nose is right next to adultery and murder in the list of serious transgressions. I knew you were a cry baby.

Whaaaaaa!

[_Mister Scratch]

He wasn't actually saying these things.

Wha..? He was "actually" saying the words which are right there---in print---for all to see?

He was illustrating a point that anti-Mormons feel like they can spew any and all manner of name calling they want and get away with it, but if a similar line of hatred and name calling were spewed toward the Jews, it would be a hate crime. The post was made as if he were an angry anti-Mormon, except replacing Morg with Kike.

A couple of thoughts. 1) Was it really necessary for him to "illustrate" this point in the manner he did? 2) Isn't his entire diatribe a false analogy? I.e., what are the analogs in Mormonism for the various Jewish stereotypes that Prof. H. is exploiting in his rant? Can you name them? I rather doubt it. Mormons have long been envious of the suffering which Jews have endured throughout history, and Hamblin's popping off is just yet another instance of this.

He actually has a good point, and I've thought that for years. I'm not sure why Mormons aren't umbrellaed under the hate laws. Why is it socially acceptable for street preachers to defile sacred Mormon items, but would be considered the lowest form of scum if they did the same thing to Jewish or Muslim holy items?

He does not have a good point. For one thing, it is not "socially acceptable" for street preachers to "defile sacred Mormon items." (Another side point: how is this even relevant? Hamblin's rant was directed towards ex-Mormons, not "preachers" from other denominations.) Second, it makes very little sense for Hamblin to try and make a point about offensiveness by being extraordinarily offensive himself.