My body is NOT a temple!

[_Lucretia MacEvil]

Keep up the pose Lucretia. "The Church" has never taught that marital sex is wrong. Individual GAs have taught that it is to be suppressed to some extent (Spencer Kimball counseled a practice of marital celibacy he termed "continence") but this is not Church doctrine. There is no body of teaching that claims what you say it claims and no authorized position on it from the leadership of the Church (the First Presidency and the Twelve). You are very, very close to intellectual dishonesty here, but no matter. That has never stopped committed critics of the Church in the past.

You know, all you good time rock n' roll, plastic banana, maggot infested, dope smoking FM type secular humanist atheist liberals really do need to get over your forty or so year obsession with sex.

Its really gotten to be such a drag.

You are the poser, Cog. I never said the church ever taught that marital sex is wrong, but true to the first rule of intellectual dishonesty as practiced by Mormons, you find it necessary to blow my statement out of proportion and attack me personally on the basis of your allegation. It's really gotten to be such a drag.

I'm not obsessed with sex myself, but I'd rather be obsessed with having sex than obsessed by not having sex. I'll go with Krishnamurti on that subject, "do it or don't do it, just get on with it."

[_Casslanpepci]

The concept of my body as a temple had a limiting effect on my life. From a young girl until the time I left the church, I was subjected to the teaching that my body was sacred, like a temple, and was not to be defiled. .

My body is not a temple and that realization has allowed me to finally, truly honor it.

KA

I take it you no longer accept the Bible, as the Apostle Paul said:

"Know ye not that YE ARE THE TEMPLE OF GOD, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?
If any man defile the temple of God, him shall god destroy; for the temple of God is holy, WHICH TEMPLE YE ARE." (1CORINTHIANS 3:16-17)

and:

"What? know ye not that your body IS THE TEMPLE OF THE HOLY GHOST WHICH IS IN YOU, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?
for ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's." (1CORINTHIANS 6:19-20)

[_truth dancer]

Hi Coggins...

You know, all you good time rock n' roll, plastic banana, maggot infested, dope smoking FM type secular humanist atheist liberals really do need to get over your forty or so year obsession with sex.

I'm betting money you were the best name caller on the whole playground!

(smile)

~dancer~

[_barrelomonkeys]

I wish I'd been told (and believed) my body was a temple.

I don't know how the message of respect yourself turns into the distortion that so many claim they had from the teachings.

How does something seemingly so straightforward get warped in people's minds? On the face of it respecting self seems like a no brainer for girls... what is it that twists this message into something else?

[_Scottie]

I wish I'd been told (and believed) my body was a temple.

I don't know how the message of respect yourself turns into the distortion that so many claim they had from the teachings.

How does something seemingly so straightforward get warped in people's minds? On the face of it respecting self seems like a no brainer for girls... what is it that twists this message into something else?

I don't think that this message in a vaccum gets distorted. When it is couple with lots of other teachings, the combination of them cause a person to have mindsets that are twisted.

The church does hold some blame for this. I know that many of you will pounce on me for saying so, but there is a definate mindset to take what the leaders say as gospel truth. Mixed with the impressionableness of adolescence and you have a problem.

[_barrelomonkeys]

I wish I'd been told (and believed) my body was a temple.

I don't know how the message of respect yourself turns into the distortion that so many claim they had from the teachings.

How does something seemingly so straightforward get warped in people's minds? On the face of it respecting self seems like a no brainer for girls... what is it that twists this message into something else?

I don't think that this message in a vaccum gets distorted. When it is couple with lots of other teachings, the combination of them cause a person to have mindsets that are twisted.

The church does hold some blame for this. I know that many of you will pounce on me for saying so, but there is a definate mindset to take what the leaders say as gospel truth. Mixed with the impressionableness of adolescence and you have a problem.

Well that was my question Scottie. What is it (the other things or messages) that twists this simple message into something other than a simple message of self respect? As an outsider looking in it's really hard to understand...

[_Scottie]

I wish I'd been told (and believed) my body was a temple.

I don't know how the message of respect yourself turns into the distortion that so many claim they had from the teachings.

How does something seemingly so straightforward get warped in people's minds? On the face of it respecting self seems like a no brainer for girls... what is it that twists this message into something else?

I don't think that this message in a vaccum gets distorted. When it is couple with lots of other teachings, the combination of them cause a person to have mindsets that are twisted.

The church does hold some blame for this. I know that many of you will pounce on me for saying so, but there is a definate mindset to take what the leaders say as gospel truth. Mixed with the impressionableness of adolescence and you have a problem.

Well that was my question Scottie. What is it (the other things or messages) that twists this simple message into something other than a simple message of self respect? As an outsider looking in it's really hard to understand...

It's really impossible to say. Each individual learns a million things in church. Depending on the upbringing of that individual, they will take certain teachings to heart. Each person internalized these teachings and makes up a "gospel according to them" sort of mindset. KA had heard numerous teaching. "Treat your body as a temple" and "licked cupcakes" were 2 that obviously struck her as very important, and these very deeply shaped her personal belief system. These helped to create a "gospel according to KA", which she took very seriously. Right or wrong, it was what she believed to her core.

Now that she knows the truth, she is looking back at these teachings, and questioning the validity of the combination of them.

[_truth dancer]

Hi Barrel of Monkeys...

How does something seemingly so straightforward get warped in people's minds? On the face of it respecting self seems like a no brainer for girls... what is it that twists this message into something else?

I think it is complex and I understand why it is difficult for outsiders to understand. :-)

My experience is that the church constantly gave the message to girls that sex outside marriage is the sin next to murder, that it is better to die than to be raped. I know three cases of girls who were raped and concequently exed. (I think this is changing today but it was certainly an element of the past). Over and over, the lessons were about the dangers of sex outside marriage, the responsibility of girls to not tempt boys, how to be pure in the eyes of God, how horrible you were if you made a mistake with a boy, how God looks upon those who sin sexually, how Satan uses sexual desire, etc. etc.

In other words, it is not a specific lesson but an overall picture that in my opinion, is unhealthy for girls. Guilt and fear were associated with sex in ways that create, (for some), a difficulty with sex in general.

Using the example of Oaks telling girls they are becoming porn.... so, if a guy has sexual thoughts about a girl, she is porn... so what if it is her husband thinking sexual thoughts? Is she still porn? Or is she not porn so long as it is her husband thinking sexual thoughts? If she dressed provocatively for her husband, is she porn? Or is it something else? Should she encourage sexual thoughts in her husband or is that wrong too? Should she make sure she does NOT contribute to her husband's sexual thoughts so she is not considered porn? Does Oaks consider his wife porn if he thinks sexual thoughts? Or does a woman become porn only if the guy thinking sexual thoughts about her is NOT her husband?

Do you see? Does this help at all?

~dancer~

[_barrelomonkeys]

Hi Barrel of Monkeys...

How does something seemingly so straightforward get warped in people's minds? On the face of it respecting self seems like a no brainer for girls... what is it that twists this message into something else?

I think it is complex and I understand why it is difficult for outsiders to understand. :-)

My experience is that the church constantly gave the message to girls that sex outside marriage is the sin next to murder, that it is better to die than to be raped. I know three cases of girls who were raped and concequently exed. (I think this is changing today but it was certainly an element of the past). Over and over, the lessons were about the dangers of sex outside marriage, the responsibility of girls to not tempt boys, how to be pure in the eyes of God, how horrible you were if you made a mistake with a boy, how God looks upon those who sin sexually, how Satan uses sexual desire, etc. etc.

In other words, it is not a specific lesson but an overall picture that in my opinion, is unhealthy for girls. Guilt and fear were associated with sex in ways that create, (for some), a difficulty with sex in general.

Using the example of Oaks telling girls they are becoming porn.... so, if a guy has sexual thoughts about a girl, she is porn... so what if it is her husband thinking sexual thoughts? Is she still porn? Or is she not porn so long as it is her husband thinking sexual thoughts? If she dressed provocatively for her husband, is she porn? Or is it something else? Should she encourage sexual thoughts in her husband or is that wrong too? Should she make sure she does NOT contribute to her husband's sexual thoughts so she is not considered porn? Does Oaks consider his wife porn if he thinks sexual thoughts? Or does a woman become porn only if the guy thinking sexual thoughts about her is NOT her husband?

Do you see? Does this help at all?

~dancer~

Oh, yes that helps!

I was shocked (I think you know) to think that young girls are blamed for men feeling lust. It's a shame that a message that has the potential to help so many girls and women avoid the pitfalls of sexual promiscuity gets so warped by the idea that women are creatures that cause men to think sinful thoughts.

[_Gazelam]

There is a balance that is meant to be achieved.

Think of it this way, how does God the Father view your body?

How do you view your childrens bodies? How do you as a parent want your children to care for their bodies?

Of coarce when your children grow up and are married they are going to have sex. What will you teach them about sex?

Viewing your body as a temple gets much easier when you view it from Gods perspective instead of the philosophers perspective.