Gadianton wrote:Did it ever matter to the apologists that Nibley was a bit off? No, because it didn't matter if the members ever understood him, only that they knew he was smarter than they are and believed the church.
Nibley--the Patron Saint of Mormon Scholars Testify (the oxymoronic title that MST is)
I have never understood the idea of having "scholars" "testify". Scholars are valued because they can analyze, demonstrate, prove. Any damn fool can--and does--"testify".
sock puppet wrote:Nibley--the Patron Saint of Mormon Scholars Testify (the oxymoronic title that MST is)
I have never understood the idea of having "scholars" "testify". Scholars are valued because they can analyze, demonstrate, prove. Any damn fool can--and does--"testify".
Agreed. Absolutely.
MST is just another bit of apologetic silliness from the mind of DCP. To me it was always a joke, and I am surprised that so many otherwise credible folks stepped up to DCP's plate.
I would imagine with the release of the essays, and the general shift in attitude toward the LDS CHurch that has taken place since DCP started MST, including his ouster from the MI, that at least some of those Mormon Scholars are starting to reconsider their decision to contribute. Some of them are probably reconsidering a lot more than that.
David Hume: "---Mistakes in philosophy are merely ridiculous, those in religion are dangerous."
DrW: "Mistakes in science are learning opportunities and are eventually corrected."
Nightlion wrote:All the believers have to do is pony up ten million dollars for my expedition to South America to prove Book of Mormon historicity.
A round-trip plane ticket, a hotel stay, a rental car, and food don't cost anywhere near ten million dollars. . . especially to South America.
I got to spent possibly ten years down there. I got security, bribing druglords paying scholars to write up findings for top journal. Excavations and paying to get permissions and so on. Probably will do a lot of aerial serveying. Okay?
sock puppet wrote:Nibley--the Patron Saint of Mormon Scholars Testify (the oxymoronic title that MST is)
I have never understood the idea of having "scholars" "testify". Scholars are valued because they can analyze, demonstrate, prove. Any damn fool can--and does--"testify".
DrW wrote:Agreed. Absolutely.
MST is just another bit of apologetic silliness from the mind of DCP. To me it was always a joke, and I am surprised that so many otherwise credible folks stepped up to DCP's plate.
I would imagine with the release of the essays, and the general shift in attitude toward the LDS CHurch that has taken place since DCP started MST, including his ouster from the MI, that at least some of those Mormon Scholars are starting to reconsider their decision to contribute. Some of them are probably reconsidering a lot more than that.
The Essays may have caused some of them to actually suspect there is historical evidence that goes beyond the decades long, Correlated white-wash. It might in fact cause some of them now to wonder if they need to investigate further, to see what other historical facts there are beyond the extent to which the LDS Church has now 'come clean' about. Then again, some might be perfectly content to continue to be misled and wallow in their self-delusion.
Dr. Shades wrote:A round-trip plane ticket, a hotel stay, a rental car, and food don't cost anywhere near ten million dollars. . . especially to South America.
I got to spent possibly ten years down there. I got security, bribing druglords paying scholars to write up findings for top journal. Excavations and paying to get permissions and so on. Probably will do a lot of aerial serveying. Okay?
Why won't god just lead you to the exact spot to find the indisputable evidence? Then $10m that could go towards that could be used to feed his children starving across the face of the globe. Seems that would be a better use of resources.
Nightlion wrote:I got to spent possibly ten years down there. I got security, bribing druglords paying scholars to write up findings for top journal. Excavations and paying to get permissions and so on. Probably will do a lot of aerial serveying. Okay?
Why won't god just lead you to the exact spot to find the indisputable evidence? Then $10m that could go towards that could be used to feed his children starving across the face of the globe. Seems that would be a better use of resources.
Okay, fine, I will be sure to retain one holier than God (lawyer)to finesse the PR. I do know within a square mile the exact spot of the real hill cummorah. How's that?
A devastating critique of Hamblin's neanderthal assessment of Park has been posted on "Faith Promoting Rumor." I just have to point out that it seems very risky, in this time when the Church is seeing record numbers of people leaving the Church, that Hamblin, DCP, Midgley, Schryver and others are actively doing things that seem designed to marginalize other members, and/or portray them as "heretics" or apostates. Do they really think they'll score brownie points with the Brethren for shrinking the membership numbers even more?
Last edited by Guest on Mon Dec 15, 2014 1:35 am, edited 1 time in total.
"[I]f, while hoping that everybody else will be honest and so forth, I can personally prosper through unethical and immoral acts without being detected and without risk, why should I not?." --Daniel Peterson, 6/4/14
Yes, a few Mormon Studies scholars with real heft have told Hamblin he has misread or distorted Ben Park's text. Taylor Petrey and Nate Oman have pointed such things out. Hamblin refuses to give it up, though. Despite the fact that it has been brought to his attention that Ben Park has published his faith in the Book of Mormon's antiquity, Hamblin continues to see a commie in every shadow.
"Petition wasn’t meant to start a witch hunt as I’ve said 6000 times." ~ Hanna Seariac, LDS apologist
Nightlion wrote:I do know within a square mile the exact spot of the real Hill Cummorah. How's that?
Ah, but do you know within a square mile the exact spot where the plates were buried?
The New York cement box was a temporary spiritual containment. I do not believe it is discoverable. Joseph returned the Gold Plates to a different spiritual repository. Things hid up unto the Lord take on a hyperdimensionality sort of like a human translated to such a state of existence.
It may be impossible to uncover the actual treasure of a room filled with gold records. But some residuals of Nephite culture may yet remain near where the crazed Lamanites could not manage to erase.
Yet one cannot or rule out God's condescension unto those who diligently seek. It is a great shame that the tare dominated LDS Church did nothing but facilitate gain for travel agencies
