Mormons and Critical Race Theory

[K Graham]

AtlanticMike is devout to a religion that taught for more than a century that black people were cursed by God because they were disobedient in the preexistence. The Church only denounced this when it became politically correct to do so after BYU was having trouble scheduling games with schools that refused to play with them. His religion's second prophet declared it illegal for white people to mix with black people, and that punishment for such a crime would be death on the spot. For this reason alone, Mormons like him have no voice on this topic. One might as well ask the KKK for their opinion on the matter.

AM also quotes Tucker Carlson religiously, calling him the ultimate truth teller. Carlson praised by David Duke and was busted recently for spreading white supremacist talking points. Carlson's top writer for his show was recently busted for being a racist when his racist emails were exposed.

Just this week, the writer, Blake Neff, responded to a thread started by another user in 2018 with the subject line, "Would u let a JET BLACK congo n****er do lasik eye surgery on u for 50% off?" Neff wrote, "I wouldn't get LASIK from an Asian for free, so no." (The subject line was not censored on the forum.) On June 5, Neff wrote, "Black doods staying inside playing Call of Duty is probably one of the biggest factors keeping crime down." On June 24, Neff commented, "Honestly given how tired black people always claim to be, maybe the real crisis is their lack of sleep." On June 26, Neff wrote that the only people who care about changing the name of the NFL's Washington Redskins are "white libs and their university-'educated' pets."

These are the kinds of deplorable humans running Right Wing propaganda these days. The only hilarity is that they expect us to believe they're not really racist.

[sock puppet]

AtlanticMike,

Sadlly, your take on this is rife with cynicism. You see evil motives, as if the world were an old John Wayne western movie, with black hats and white hats. Sure, there have been evil people in human history and even evil political movements such as Nazis. But you do not see the good in generosity--maybe its motives but you deny its efficacy. For every evil doer, there are at least a couple of dozen good people. Fox News would make it seem like all those that disagree with their ultra conservative views have evil motives. Really? Ol' Joe Biden is certainly at a bumbling age, but do you really think he is pernicious?

I am not a believer in any kind of divinity of Jesus, but I find most of the teachings attributed to Jesus in the Gospels to be valuable insights and encouragements.

Lincoln (once the prototypical Republican) concluded his first inaugural address by saying--

I am loath to close. We are not enemies, but friends. We must not be enemies. Though passion may have strained it must not break our bonds of affection. The mystic chords of memory, stretching from every battlefield and patriot grave to every living heart and hearthstone all over this broad land, will yet swell the chorus of the Union, when again touched, as surely they will be, by the better angels of our nature.

Fox News (and now Newsmax, OAN, etc) are the antithesis. Are they evil? No, just profiteers at the expense of American society, profiting off of the divisiveness they continually sow. Their business model can't thrive if their listeners are touched by the better angels of their nature. I say to you, AtlanticMike, be touched by the better angel of your nature. Open your heart, and your cynicism will wither away.

[malkie]

AtlanticMike is devout to a religion that taught for more than a century that black people were cursed by God because they were disobedient in the preexistence. The Church only denounced this when it became politically correct to do so after BYU was having trouble scheduling games with schools that refused to play with them. His religion's second prophet declared it illegal for white people to mix with black people, and that punishment for such a crime would be death on the spot. For this reason alone, Mormons like him have no voice on this topic. One might as well ask the KKK for their opinion on the matter.

AM also quotes Tucker Carlson religiously, calling him the ultimate truth teller. Carlson praised by David Duke and was busted recently for spreading white supremacist talking points. Carlson's top writer for his show was recently busted for being a racist when his racist emails were exposed.

Just this week, the writer, Blake Neff, responded to a thread started by another user in 2018 with the subject line, "Would u let a JET BLACK congo n****er do lasik eye surgery on u for 50% off?" Neff wrote, "I wouldn't get LASIK from an Asian for free, so no." (The subject line was not censored on the forum.) On June 5, Neff wrote, "Black doods staying inside playing Call of Duty is probably one of the biggest factors keeping crime down." On June 24, Neff commented, "Honestly given how tired black people always claim to be, maybe the real crisis is their lack of sleep." On June 26, Neff wrote that the only people who care about changing the name of the NFL's Washington Redskins are "white libs and their university-'educated' pets."

These are the kinds of deplorable humans running Right Wing propaganda these days. The only hilarity is that they expect us to believe they're not really racist.

It's not just that the punishment for the crime of white people mixing with black people would be death on the spot, but that this would never change:

Shall I tell you the law of God in regard to the African race? If the white man who belongs to the chosen seed mixes his blood with the seed of Cain, the penalty, under the law of God, is death on the spot. This will always be so.

https://www.fairlatterdaysaints.org/ans ... e_by_death
quoting from https://www.fairlatterdaysaints.org/ans ... /10/25#110

[edited to add source]

[Atlanticmike]

AtlanticMike is devout to a religion that taught for more than a century that black people were cursed by God because they were disobedient in the preexistence. The Church only denounced this when it became politically correct to do so after BYU was having trouble scheduling games with schools that refused to play with them. His religion's second prophet declared it illegal for white people to mix with black people, and that punishment for such a crime would be death on the spot. For this reason alone, Mormons like him have no voice on this topic. One might as well ask the KKK for their opinion on the matter.

AM also quotes Tucker Carlson religiously, calling him the ultimate truth teller. Carlson praised by David Duke and was busted recently for spreading white supremacist talking points. Carlson's top writer for his show was recently busted for being a racist when his racist emails were exposed.

Just this week, the writer, Blake Neff, responded to a thread started by another user in 2018 with the subject line, "Would u let a JET BLACK congo n****er do lasik eye surgery on u for 50% off?" Neff wrote, "I wouldn't get LASIK from an Asian for free, so no." (The subject line was not censored on the forum.) On June 5, Neff wrote, "Black doods staying inside playing Call of Duty is probably one of the biggest factors keeping crime down." On June 24, Neff commented, "Honestly given how tired black people always claim to be, maybe the real crisis is their lack of sleep." On June 26, Neff wrote that the only people who care about changing the name of the NFL's Washington Redskins are "white libs and their university-'educated' pets."

These are the kinds of deplorable humans running Right Wing propaganda these days. The only hilarity is that they expect us to believe they're not really racist.

!!! Apparently you've never read my views on Mormonism. I love Mormonism! But I'm definitely not what you would call devout. Maybe, I don't know.

[drumdude]

It’s interesting seeing the lukewarm defenses of critical race theory once it’s exposed. The arguments shift a lot, “you don’t understand critical race theory,” goes to “That’s not how critical race theory is defined it’s just how the founders and textbook of critical race theory defines it” goes to “yes we admit it’s biased but all social science is.” I completely agree it’s not the devil that Atlantic Mike or Fox News makes it out to be, but that doesn’t mean it can’t be criticized.

I’m fine with college students taking a course on critical race theory once they have the ability to put it in context with competing theories. The entire point of this thread is to discuss if critical race theory should be taught in public schools.

Since critical race theory is essentially a politically biased diatribe, similar to creationism, it has no place in K-12 public school systems. Keep it in universities, please. Even there it’s very dangerous because critical race theory claims that anyone who criticizes critical race theory must be racist. College professors and administrators risk their entire careers criticizing it.

[K Graham]

It’s interesting seeing the lukewarm defenses of critical race theory once it’s exposed. The arguments shift a lot, “you don’t understand critical race theory,” goes to “That’s not how critical race theory is defined it’s just how the founders and textbook of critical race theory defines it” goes to “yes we admit it’s biased but all social science is.” I completely agree it’s not the devil that Atlantic Mike or Fox News makes it out to be, but that doesn’t mean it can’t be criticized.

I’m fine with college students taking a course on critical race theory once they have the ability to put it in context with competing theories. The entire point of this thread is to discuss if critical race theory should be taught in public schools.

Since critical race theory is essentially a politically biased diatribe, similar to creationism, it has no place in K-12 public school systems. Keep it in universities, please. Even there it’s very dangerous because critical race theory claims that anyone who criticizes critical race theory must be racist. College professors and administrators risk their entire careers criticizing it.

What's critical race theory?

Which K-12 schools are teaching it?

[drumdude]

It’s interesting seeing the lukewarm defenses of critical race theory once it’s exposed. The arguments shift a lot, “you don’t understand critical race theory,” goes to “That’s not how critical race theory is defined it’s just how the founders and textbook of critical race theory defines it” goes to “yes we admit it’s biased but all social science is.” I completely agree it’s not the devil that Atlantic Mike or Fox News makes it out to be, but that doesn’t mean it can’t be criticized.

I’m fine with college students taking a course on critical race theory once they have the ability to put it in context with competing theories. The entire point of this thread is to discuss if critical race theory should be taught in public schools.

Since critical race theory is essentially a politically biased diatribe, similar to creationism, it has no place in K-12 public school systems. Keep it in universities, please. Even there it’s very dangerous because critical race theory claims that anyone who criticizes critical race theory must be racist. College professors and administrators risk their entire careers criticizing it.

What's critical race theory?

Which K-12 schools are teaching it?

A. What Is Critical Race Theory?
The critical race theory (critical race theory) movement is a collection of
activists and scholars engaged in studying and transforming the relationship among race, racism, and power. The
movement considers many of the same issues that conventional civil rights and ethnic studies discourses take up
but places them in a broader perspective that includes economics, history, setting, group and self-interest, and emotions and the unconscious.

Unlike traditional civil rights
discourse, which stresses incrementalism and step-by-step
progress, critical race theory questions the very foundations of the liberal order, including equality theory, legal
reasoning, Enlightenment rationalism, and neutral principles of constitutional law.

The Eaton Rapids school district recently purchased a new ELA curriculum for grades K-5 from a company which includes in its teacher training materials a recommendation that teachers decenter the tears of White children. This curriculum company refers to itself as an aspiring antiracist organization that claims the ideas from the book "How To Be An Anti-Racist" form the core of their curriculum. This curriculum also avoids the use of books from the literary canon, because they consider classics to be biased in favor of White people.

Screenshot 2021-12-29 110813.jpg

Screenshot 2021-12-29 110948.jpg

[Morley]

It’s interesting seeing the lukewarm defenses of critical race theory once it’s exposed. The arguments shift a lot, “you don’t understand critical race theory,” goes to “That’s not how critical race theory is defined it’s just how the founders and textbook of critical race theory defines it” goes to “yes we admit it’s biased but all social science is.” I completely agree it’s not the devil that Atlantic Mike or Fox News makes it out to be, but that doesn’t mean it can’t be criticized.

It's only your arguments that are shifting. That you quote what you think is "the definition" in a book, that someone is trying to sell as a textbook, doesn't mean that it is (how did you put it?) "Here's how critical race theory defines itself." And that any scientific theory (either hard science or social science) has a bias should not be a surprise to you. I'm not sure why it seems to be.

I’m fine with college students taking a course on critical race theory once they have the ability to put it in context with competing theories. The entire point of this thread is to discuss if critical race theory should be taught in public schools.

Good. I've never seen anyone give a legitimate example of where critical race theory is being taught in K-12 public schools.

Since critical race theory is essentially a politically biased diatribe, similar to creationism, it has no place in K-12 public school systems. Keep it in universities, please. Even there it’s very dangerous because critical race theory claims that anyone who criticizes critical race theory must be racist. College professors and administrators risk their entire careers criticizing it.

Of course critical race theory is politically based. Race is a politically-based construct. I'm not sure how it's a diatribe.

critical race theory doesn't claim anything. Some people, who want to write about what they think CTR means, may claim things. You know, kind of like you're doing.

[drumdude]

Good. I've never seen anyone give a legitimate example of where critical race theory is being taught in K-12 public schools.

I'm sorry but this is clearly gaslighting. There are many clear examples of critical race theory directly influencing "anti-racism" K-12 curriculum. Are K-12 getting the full critical race theory college course? Of course not and no one is arguing that.

This would be like saying K-12 isn't teaching astronomy because it's bundled into a broader natural sciences 9th grade class. The name critical race theory is not there but the IDEAS are.

[sock puppet]

If you are interested in just how unnecessary legislation prohibiting the teaching of critical race theory is, take 20 minutes and listen to this interview by Marc Lamont Hill of Steve Christiansen, the Utah legislator who sponsored the legislation.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NzYNRFQ2R7s Although pressed repeatedly over 20 minutes for examples, Christiansen offered one that does not even hold any water. He talked about an exercise at a high school in his legislative district where a teacher had the students line up laterally and for each question answered right, the students took a step forward, for each answered wrong, the students took a step back. Christiansen did not say what the questions were, but said there was a black student that got answers wrong and was thus after the steps were taken, standing behind the other students. That black student reportedly felt inferior because standing behind the others. That was the only specific, concrete example that in 20 minutes of questioning Christiansen offered up in the interview as justification for needing critical race theory-blocking legislation. Quite the straw man set up, so that the valiant legislature could vanquish it. Very Quixotic.

Bump for drumdude. What need is there for legislation where the sponsoring Utah representative could only cite the one step forward, one step back based on answers to questions (not identified) as the basis for such? Do you not see that this is just a legislator preening to those worked up by biased media that set up a strawman?