What is a spiritual experience?

[Gadianton]

I do claim to believe in dualism. And I don’t think there is something beyond matter.

Then you need to educate yourself on what the word "dualism" means.

[MG 2.0]

No MG, you can try to be careful with words in order to reach a better understanding of things, not just to support a pre-defined conclusion the way apologetics does. I'm not interested in a pre-defined conclusion. Was Joseph Smith a materialist or not? If he wasn't, then I have no interest in believing that he was. I'm not trying to reach the conclusion that Joseph Smith was a materialist. I'm trying to reach the conclusion that reflects the reality of what Joseph Smith was.

I'm also trying to help you learn about what the church you fight for so valiantly believes. Wouldn't you want to understand your doctrine at some point before the end?

I think I lost the point of what you’re saying that has a disagreement with what I’ve said or that LDS theology teaches.

Would you consider yourself to be a ‘hard materialist’ according to the Pi A.I. definition posted upthread ? If not, are you then open to the possibility of a God composed of matter/energy?

I’m REALLY not sure what the point is you’re trying to make.

Regards,
MG

[Gadianton]

I’m REALLY not sure what the point is you’re trying to make.

I wouldn't worry about me. What do you think the point Joseph Smith was making when he said there is no such things as immaterial matter?

[MG 2.0]

I do claim to believe in dualism. And I don’t think there is something beyond matter.

Then you need to educate yourself on what the word "dualism" means.

I don’t think that substance dualism or property dualism dovetail exactly with LDS teachings although property dualism seems to come close. But I’m not the philosopher you are…or whatever you call yourself.

I believe that the soul is the uniting of body and spirit. That’s LDS belief in a nutshell.

I don’t see any point getting lost in the weeds to the point that there’s no way out.

I appreciate your thoughts, but all I was attempting to do was answer a question. What is a spiritual experience?

I’m not sure that I have anything much to add beyond what I initially said. Even at that, folks were out to twist what I was saying around to make it look like I was actually saying something else.

I’m not going to play that game or go off and get lost in the weeds that you find yourself wandering around in.

Regards,
MG

[Marcus]

I do claim to believe in dualism. And I don’t think there is something beyond matter.

Then you need to educate yourself on what the word "dualism" means.

Clearly.

[Gadianton]

I don’t think that substance dualism or property dualism dovetail exactly with LDS teachings although property dualism seems to come close

I agree they don't and so you might just as well call it materialism.

Is your urge to use this word because of your belief in a spirit and a body, rather than just a body? If so, are you okay with the implication that you haven't always existed? I know some Mormons are adamant that they have existed for eternity in the past. As a dualist (coopting the term to describe the situation of a spirit + body) you are denying them this possibility.

[Jersey Girl]

Thank you, Jersey Girl. That was simply stunning.

Thank you. I realized after I posted it that I must have posted the rough draft. I hurried to fix all the typos and needed edits! I hope you didn't grade me on the rough draft! Isn't that photo just amazing?

[Jersey Girl]

Thank you, Jersey Girl. That was simply stunning.

That was beautiful, Jersey Girl. Thanks for sharing your thoughts.

- Doc

You're very welcome. Seems like the only time I get positive comments around here is when I share my inner life. I originally wrote that without a break in probably 5 minutes time which isn't hard for me to do when I'm "there". Guess I should do that more often but I'm reluctant to share that. Anyway...you know what it's like to "look up" so you can probably relate to what I said there. Thank you for your comment!

[Jersey Girl]

Jersey Girl takes us from the wonder of living in this world and universe to the wonder of sharing life with others and the growth of a child. I think that connection is the heart of the matter. If being spiritually alive is letting wonder turn into love of others then spiritual experiences are moments that remind us alert and teach us these basic facts of being human.

Wow you really read me right, huck. The girl with the sparkling blue eyes is real and so are those experiences real. I've even had her out the back porch at night to show her the Big Dipper that you can clearly see framed by trees at night. Showed her how to get her night vision, sat in total darkness with her, she put on a pair of sunglasses and used a small flashlight then she drew a picture of what she saw and put our names on it. I've put her in the car and drove down the road late at night where you can actually see other constellations and planets. When we go driving in fall we look for trees that have lost their leaves because that's when you can see the bird's nests inside. It's what I do with children and it's hard for me to explain why because how do you explain an intuitive act? I tried in that post. I guess I want them to feel connected to something larger than themselves, that everything in the natural world has a reason for being, and that there is a reason for them, too. Other girls with sparkling eyes came before her as well.

The photo is lovely even though I puzzle a bit over the abandoned mine works. Just as an aesthetic thing they somehow include well.

Thanks Jersey Girl.

I think the local photographers like to frame something like the mines and other structures when they shoot the night sky here because it gives the viewer something to compare to the expanse of the galaxy and lends perspective to the composition. It gives you that sense of how utterly awesome it is as well as how small we really are. Thanks for your comment and for "getting it".

p.s. Look up!

[Jersey Girl]

Jersey Girl takes us from the wonder of living in this world and universe to the wonder of sharing life with others and the growth of a child. I think that connection is the heart of the matter. If being spiritually alive is letting wonder turn into love of others then spiritual experiences are moments that remind us alert and teach us these basic facts of being human.

The photo is lovely even though I puzzle a bit over the abandoned mine works. Just as an aesthetic thing they somehow include well.

Thanks Jersey Girl.

I think that's just pretty standard roadside fare in the state she resides in. I agree, what a lovely picture!

Yes it is! We are fortunate to have a number of local photographers who take the most incredible shots. They go everywhere to capture storms, the country side (barns, cows, wild flowers, etc.) and venture out in the wee hours to get photos of the night sky...just all kinds of things! I can see the Milky Way on a clear winter night right down the road...that's the best time for night sky viewing around here. When it snows at night I've been known to get out on the less traveled roads and drive without lights...you can see everything then it's amazing!

I know...I do crazy stuff.