Please give financial reports in Conference again

The catch-all forum for general topics and debates. Minimal moderation. Rated PG to PG-13.
_Tom
_Emeritus
Posts: 1023
Joined: Mon Jun 11, 2007 5:45 pm

Re: Please give financial reports in Conference again

Post by _Tom »

harmony wrote:So... what happened to him? (I have no doubt of his gender; women would never be trusted with the financials.) Are there any newspaper articles about his trial? Any followup on his sentencing? Anything about him being excommunicated?

Or was it all covered up?


I don't know about his church membership, but he was sentenced to twenty years in prison. Quinn notes that the New York Times covered the story. A bank investigation led to his downfall.
“A scholar said he could not read the Book of Mormon, so we shouldn’t be shocked that scholars say the papyri don’t translate and/or relate to the Book of Abraham. Doesn’t change anything. It’s ancient and historical.” ~ Hanna Seariac
_Gadianton
_Emeritus
Posts: 9947
Joined: Sat Jul 07, 2007 5:12 am

Re: Please give financial reports in Conference again

Post by _Gadianton »

tom wrote:In Mormon Hierarchy: Extensions of Power, D. Michael Quinn notes that an employee with the Church Auditing Department managed to embezzle $600,000+ in church funds during the late 1960s. Church auditors did not detect fraud for more than a year.


I wonder why. If I had to speculate, I'd say that on the balance, the church knows that its membership and most certainly its underpaid employees are very devoted. What I'm thinking, is that in general they'd hope that any deviation from a true and accurate summary of the books would come out in the church's favor. If a "mistake" is never detected, they benefit, and if the mistake is caught, they could claim ignorance and let the employee take the fall. I would imagine this example is overshadowed by far larger sums that they have gained over the years by employees with loyalties in their favor.
Lou Midgley 08/20/2020: "...meat wad," and "cockroach" are pithy descriptions of human beings used by gemli? They were not fashioned by Professor Peterson.

LM 11/23/2018: one can explain away the soul of human beings...as...a Meat Unit, to use Professor Peterson's clever derogatory description of gemli's ideology.
_Jason Bourne
_Emeritus
Posts: 9207
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2006 8:00 pm

Re: Please give financial reports in Conference again

Post by _Jason Bourne »

But what if some office workers in the Corporation of the Presiding Bisopric did decide to embezzle. They could get away with it forever, because they audit themselves. Could this happen? Could human nature happen?
That's why they use independent auditors.



The Church does not use independent auditors. It uses internal auditors that are church employess. And while these auditors may find some rank and file employee stealing money they are not there to make sure those in control are doing the right thing.
_Jason Bourne
_Emeritus
Posts: 9207
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2006 8:00 pm

Re: Please give financial reports in Conference again

Post by _Jason Bourne »

They're part of the organization but they're kept independent so that anyone who wanted to embezzle funds would have to embezzle the funds and hope another department didn't notice or bribe/form a conspiracy of at least two. The people spending the money are not the same ones auditing the books.



Internal auditors are never totally independent. To qualify as independent the audit is preformed by an outside CPA firm.
_harmony
_Emeritus
Posts: 18195
Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2006 1:35 am

Re: Please give financial reports in Conference again

Post by _harmony »

Tom wrote:I don't know about his church membership, but he was sentenced to twenty years in prison. Quinn notes that the New York Times covered the story. A bank investigation led to his downfall.


A bank investigation? As in... outside auditors being given access to church financials?
(Nevo, Jan 23) And the Melchizedek Priesthood may not have been restored until the summer of 1830, several months after the organization of the Church.
_Jason Bourne
_Emeritus
Posts: 9207
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2006 8:00 pm

Re: Please give financial reports in Conference again

Post by _Jason Bourne »


Jason,

"..over $100k". I always paid my tithing first each and every month - always.

What's the matter with you, man?

Add 10% of time each damn day working for the invisible man. Do the math and try not to be such a nitwit. I didn't work 8 hour days, I worked between 10-16 hour days when I wasn't part/full time in college. There were years we fell well below the earned income credit - we didn't make enough to use charitable contributions as a writeoff. It was 10% for a number of years - not 7-8%.

It's not just about the money. I did not see my family for several years. They got the worst of what was left of me at the end of the day. I gave the damn church their 10% of time.

Perhaps I should have gone on church welfare and done as well as my out of work home teachees, renting to own TV's etc. It's never been my nature. Besides, I exercized faith in the Mormon God that He would provide. It was a test of faith. But He didn't, I did.

And yes, you toss $150 a month into a mutual fund for 20 years and you will be quite well off - one of those expenditures that was out of the question till about 10 years ago.

You're smarter than your last comments, Jason.


Sorry man. I deal with money and finances all the time. I help people with money issues and budgeting. I know what I speak of. Yes 10% invested over 20 years would grow well. But would you have done it? 10% of your budget just did not cause all the money and work time woes you are talking about. Just could not have been the sole cause. Part of it maybe but not all. If you were were at an income level that you qualified for the earned income credit for whatever reason you did not have a large enough income shovel or you were in the early years of earning power. Tithing could no way have been the sole cause of your money issues.

You are smarter than to claim as such.
_Jason Bourne
_Emeritus
Posts: 9207
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2006 8:00 pm

Re: Please give financial reports in Conference again

Post by _Jason Bourne »

collegeterrace wrote:
Inconceivable wrote:Jason,

"..over $100k". I always paid my tithing first each and every month - always.

What's the matter with you, man?

You're smarter than your last comments, Jason.
Ignore the jack Mormon. I doubt he is a full tithe payer.



Wrong again PP you dope you. I am a full tither and I pay a very generous fast offering because I strongly believe in the program.
_Yoda

Re: Please give financial reports in Conference again

Post by _Yoda »

Port a.k.a. Collegeterrace a.k.a. Identity Crisis wrote:Ignore the jack Mormon. I doubt he is a full tithe payer.


How is Jason a Jack Mormon?

Besides, I thought I was the resident Jack Mormon of the board according to you. ;)
_harmony
_Emeritus
Posts: 18195
Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2006 1:35 am

Re: Please give financial reports in Conference again

Post by _harmony »

liz3564 wrote:Besides, I thought I was the resident Jack Mormon of the board according to you. ;)


I'm pretty sure you meant "Jackie Mormon".
(Nevo, Jan 23) And the Melchizedek Priesthood may not have been restored until the summer of 1830, several months after the organization of the Church.
_Yoda

Re: Please give financial reports in Conference again

Post by _Yoda »

harmony wrote:
liz3564 wrote:Besides, I thought I was the resident Jack Mormon of the board according to you. ;)


I'm pretty sure you meant "Jackie Mormon".


LOL!
Post Reply