Some Mormons Search the Web and Find Doubt - NYT

[_Bazooka]

The Editor of the New York Times misheard his journalist when they phoned the story through.
The title was meant to read "Some Mormons Search The Web And Find Out".

[_beanboots]

The Editor of the New York Times misheard his journalist when they phoned the story through.
The title was meant to read "Some Mormons Search The Web And Find Out".

Then...

[_DarkHelmet]

This is an interesting and sensitive piece. I appreciate Mattsson's candor.

“The Roman Catholic Church has had 2,000 years to work through the hiccups in its history,” said Terryl L. Givens, a professor of English, literature and religion at the University of Richmond and a Mormon believer. “Mormonism is still an adolescent religion.”

Mormons typically believe Mormonism is exceptional as a religion and religious institution-- especially compared with Catholicism. If we're supposed to believe that Mormonism is credible as anything more than just another man-made faith running an expected course, explaining its development by bringing attention to the church's immaturity in relation to the RCC (which Mormons believe to be in full-blown apostasy) seems a very odd move.

I found it odd, too. And then a church spokesman uses the same excuse:

Eric Hawkins, a church spokesman, said that “every church faces this challenge,”

So much for Mormonism being the one true church in all the land. It is really no different than every other church.

[_Bazooka]

I was wondering about this myself. When I read the actual article this really stood out to me:

He organized a discussion group in Sweden, and more than 600 participated, he said. In 2010, the church sent two of its top historians, Elder Marlin K. Jensen and Richard E. Turley Jr. to allay the Swedes’ concerns. They had a remarkably frank and sometimes testy exchange, especially about Smith and polygamy.

After which the attendee's were visited at home and asked to resign or face excommunication.

Christina Hanke
July 21, 2013 at 10:53 am
I attended the meeting 2010. In a way I feel like defending Jensen and Turley. What else could they do and say? We received credit that our questions were valid and not just anti-lies, but there are so answers and they could not fabricate any. In the meeting there were several bishops and SP:s that had never even heard of these questions, together with us dissidents. Some time later Jensen said that they were terrified what those leaders would think when they heard about all these issues for the first time. For me personally the aftermath of the meeting was that I was contaced and asked to resign volountary otherwise I would be excumunicated for apostasy. I resigned.

http://mormonstories.org/hans-mattsson/

[_DrW]

I was wondering about this myself. When I read the actual article this really stood out to me:

He organized a discussion group in Sweden, and more than 600 participated, he said. In 2010, the church sent two of its top historians, Elder Marlin K. Jensen and Richard E. Turley Jr. to allay the Swedes’ concerns. They had a remarkably frank and sometimes testy exchange, especially about Smith and polygamy.

After which the attendee's were visited at home and asked to resign or face excommunication.

Christina Hanke
July 21, 2013 at 10:53 am
I attended the meeting 2010. In a way I feel like defending Jensen and Turley. What else could they do and say? We received credit that our questions were valid and not just anti-lies, but there are so answers and they could not fabricate any. In the meeting there were several bishops and SP:s that had never even heard of these questions, together with us dissidents. Some time later Jensen said that they were terrified what those leaders would think when they heard about all these issues for the first time. For me personally the aftermath of the meeting was that I was contaced and asked to resign volountary otherwise I would be excumunicated for apostasy. I resigned.

http://mormonstories.org/hans-mattsson/

Sister Hanke's experience pretty much says it all.

If Mormons really believe that "by their fruits ye shall know them", they should consider this fruit of Joseph Smith Jr. and many (if not most) the leaders of the Church since, which was bitter even before it became rotten and poisonous.

[_malkie]

Interesting to note that one can so quickly determine which comments are from the tbm brigade bearing testimony. They jump right in with words and phrases only used in the church. A person un familiar with "Mormonisms" must read these posts and wonder........ What strange use of language.

Then Will jumps in with names 99.9999999% of those reading will not recognize. It is light box all over again.

When the defenders start up on a national stage they come across as simply weird.

I've seen the comment from the person who, at the age of 25, joined the church - the best decision he ever made.

I also noticed the comment from the person who, at the age of 30, joined the church - the best decision he ever made.

Has anyone see the comments from those who joined at 35, 40, 45 etc, - the best decisions they ever made?

[_DrW]

Interesting to note that one can so quickly determine which comments are from the tbm brigade bearing testimony. They jump right in with words and phrases only used in the church. A person un familiar with "Mormonisms" must read these posts and wonder........ What strange use of language.

Then Will jumps in with names 99.9999999% of those reading will not recognize. It is light box all over again.

When the defenders start up on a national stage they come across as simply weird.

I've seen the comment from the person who, at the age of 25, joined the church - the best decision he ever made.

I also noticed the comment from the person who, at the age of 30, joined the church - the best decision he ever made.

Has anyone see the comments from those who joined at 35, 40, 45 etc, - the best decisions they ever made?

Nope.

But we can no doubt look forward to those 20 and 30 year-olds leaving the Church in their 40s and 50s and stating that leaving the Church was the best decision they ever made.

[_Bazooka]

Interesting to note that one can so quickly determine which comments are from the tbm brigade bearing testimony. They jump right in with words and phrases only used in the church. A person un familiar with "Mormonisms" must read these posts and wonder........ What strange use of language.

Then Will jumps in with names 99.9999999% of those reading will not recognize. It is light box all over again.

When the defenders start up on a national stage they come across as simply weird.

I've seen the comment from the person who, at the age of 25, joined the church - the best decision he ever made.

I also noticed the comment from the person who, at the age of 30, joined the church - the best decision he ever made.

Has anyone see the comments from those who joined at 35, 40, 45 etc, - the best decisions they ever made?

Generally, joining the Church is the best decision anyone ever makes, right up until the point it becomes the worst decision they've ever made.

[_Rollo Tomasi]

This is a serious problem the LDS Church has though. You can't pretend to have a monopoly on the truth and pretend to be directed by God, and not open yourself up to this. If you are going to make these types of claims, when push comes to shove, you have to take a deep look at whether you are really kidding yourself. And if you are going to continue to maintain these types of claims, then you had better be able to back them up (i.e. you had better be talking to God for real) or abandon them altogether.

For the first time, I am in complete agreement with Tobin -- I think I'm getting misty. Very well said.

[_SteelHead]

Were attendees truly given an ultimatum after the Swedish rescue firesides?