Mormonisms social caste system - My Personal Experience

[_Pokatator]

So this is why Utah leads the nation in pyramid schemes, they have such a great example!

Ward bishop
Stake high council
Stake president
Mission president
Area authority
General authority
First Presidency

What are the equivalent levels in AMWAY?

[_ajax18]

A very very big and powerful business that does not need to account for one thin dime...i wish I could operate my business's like that but no I have to account for every single friggin cent...or else I could go to JAIL[/quote]

Well Joseph Smith didn't even need a preacher's license back in the day. Maybe you should get into the business of preaching religion. You already said you wanted to write some female focused scriptures. What stops you from forming your own Church?

[_OUT OF MY MISERY]

Ajax18

I do not believe in organized religion

[_rcrocket]

Ajax18

I do not believe in organized religion

I guess that you do not believe in the New Testament.

[_harmony]

What an asinine thing to say, P. That's certainly one of your best so far.

I will tell my cousin Mitt the next time I see him. But, I will try not to deflect from the topic of your subthread.

Your cousin is Mitt Romney?

I'm glad that I have struck a nerve.

You wish.

Like I say, your post is so transparent. Let's see if I can interpret what goes on in your household. Your husband has never been in the church heirarchy as you define it, and you resent it.

Well, the first part is right (he's never been a bishop, although he's been in the bishopric), but I don't resent it. What I resent is that there are several very qualified but never asked men in my ward who would make excellent bishops, but they don't run in the same social circles as the men who are always called. Ya gotta have been on the High Council in order to get called as bishop of my ward, and only a very select very successful men are allowed in that exclusive group.

The both of you resent it with mean-spirited comments about the brethren that your kids hear.

My husband would never criticize anyone anywhere. It's not in his nature. I'm the one who calls a spade a spade around here, and I don't soften the message just because it includes home truths about men in Salt Lake Central. I prefer the truth, no matter how unpalatable. Obviously you consider the truth to be mean-spirited. I'm not surprised.

It has been this way in your household for many years. And, you continue to resent anybody, no matter how Christian, Christlike, or gracious, who labors as a bishop or stake president -- even your dear friend.

I pity my dear friend. Two days before he was called as SP, he sat in my living room and expressed his relief at being released from his calling (then the 1st counselor in the SP). He is between a rock and a hard place, and his health is failing because of the stress he's under. And he has another 3 years to go before he has any hope of release. If there was any kind of inspiration going on in SL Central, this man would be allowed to live out his life outside the servitude to the LDS church. I don't expect a change anytime soon though.

And, I might add, you and your husband are "face-time" Mormons. Whereas you resent membership in the Church, attendance at meetings, and such, you do demand lots and lots of face time with your local leadership so you can in a backhanded way claim affiliation with the elite power structure.

My husband is a faithful, believing member who completely supports the bishop. I am not even a face-time Mormon, P. What I demand is weekly emails giving me the speakers for the bulletin. Either they get me the speakers or it goes in as TBA, which shows the whole ward who did not contact who. It's not my job to hold their hand. They knew going in what I required. They agreed to the terms. I won't change my life so I can babysit the bishopric in order to do my very-public calling.

Oh, the utter moronity of those who like to play sandlot politics.

This, from you, is precious.

The Church has no place for people like you.

So you keep saying. And yet my temple recommend is as good as yours.

[_harmony]

That's not the sense I get of Harmony's husband based on what she has posted. She describes him on the Internet as "TBM" who would be mortified at her degree of unbelief. I think that either one or both of them are prominent in their community, so there may be some face-saving on Harmony's part going on.

My husband is TBM; he and the rest of my family know my level of belief (something you obviously don't). We are both prominent in our community. In addition, I am relatively well-known in the power circles of my state and within certain circles nationally.

[_Runtu]

Methinks the church would be a lot smaller were Plutarch in charge of deciding who belongs and who doesn't.

[_Mister Scratch]

Clark felt that public accountability was a good thing. Evidently, you do not.

Cite please?

Do you have evidence that tithing funds are being misspent?

Because the published report of expenditures included [Elder Henry Moyle's] building program, Moyle persuaded McKay not to publish even an abbreviated accounting of church spending. There has been no itemized financial report since.
This policy reversed Clark's insistence on full financial disclosure to the public. [...] In his view, voluntary disclosure of deficits encouraged greater austerity on the part of leaders at headquarters and elsewhere. ---Quinn, The Mormon Hierarchy: Extensions of Power, pp. 26-27.

As to whether the funds are "misspent," who knows? We are kept in the dark.

[_Runtu]

Because the published report of expenditures included [Elder Henry Moyle's] building program, Moyle persuaded McKay not to publish even an abbreviated accounting of church spending. There has been no itemized financial report since.
This policy reversed Clark's insistence on full financial disclosure to the public. [...] In his view, voluntary disclosure of deficits encouraged greater austerity on the part of leaders at headquarters and elsewhere. ---Quinn, The Mormon Hierarchy: Extensions of Power, pp. 26-27.

As to whether the funds are "misspent," who knows? We are kept in the dark.

Don't you know that Quinn is an untrustworthy anti-Mormon unless he can be used to beat up on critics?

[_rcrocket]

As to whether the funds are "misspent," who knows? We are kept in the dark.

I see. That is evidence they are misspent, I see.

What standing have you to challenge the church's expenditures? Either you pay tithing, which directly implies that you accept church central procedure that the church stands upon its position that these are not to be disclosed, or you don't, in which case you have no more basis to condemn the Church for its expenses than you do the Salvation Army.

By the way, I asked you for a reference to your claim that J. R. Clark disagreed with his brethren and insisted that the church finances be made public. Where is that reference?

P