If I were a Christian......

[_Sam Harris]

Plutarch, the motive of your question?

I mean, we understand that Mormonism for you would operate without Christ, as it obviously does if your behavior on this forum is any indicator. It's ok to worship the men who are your leaders, just make that clear. But people would like to know your motive, if you don't mind.

Here, to keep it simple for you, my little "dee dee dee", I'll answer for ya.

Folks, Plutarch wants to do what he feels you are trying to do to him and all LDS. Tear down the faith.

[_Mister Scratch]

What the...? Are you honestly trying to counter the claim that Jesus was a historical figure? What on earth are you thinking, P.?

Do you believe Jesus to be a historical figure?

[Next question: On what basis?]

P

Do I "believe" he was, as in---a matter of faith? Yeah, I guess so. Frankly, I don't really care one way or the other whether or not he was a real, historical figure. Moreover, you didn't answer my question.

Are you trying to counter the claim that JC was a historical figure?

[_rcrocket]

Plutarch, the motive of your question?

I mean, we understand that Mormonism for you would operate without Christ, as it obviously does if your behavior on this forum is any indicator. It's ok to worship the men who are your leaders, just make that clear. But people would like to know your motive, if you don't mind.

Here, to keep it simple for you, my little "dee dee dee", I'll answer for ya.

Folks, Plutarch wants to do what he feels you are trying to do to him and all LDS. Tear down the faith.

Afraid to answer my question without being told the motive? Weak.

P

[_rcrocket]

What the...? Are you honestly trying to counter the claim that Jesus was a historical figure? What on earth are you thinking, P.?

Do you believe Jesus to be a historical figure?

[Next question: On what basis?]

P

Do I "believe" he was, as in---a matter of faith? Yeah, I guess so. Frankly, I don't really care one way or the other whether or not he was a real, historical figure. Moreover, you didn't answer my question.

Are you trying to counter the claim that JC was a historical figure?

In answer to your question, no.

So, do you believe the entire New Testament miracles story? If not, what are the limits of your belief?
If you believe the entire miracles story, how can you do so with no evidence?

P

[_Mister Scratch]

What the...? Are you honestly trying to counter the claim that Jesus was a historical figure? What on earth are you thinking, P.?

Do you believe Jesus to be a historical figure?

[Next question: On what basis?]

P

Do I "believe" he was, as in---a matter of faith? Yeah, I guess so. Frankly, I don't really care one way or the other whether or not he was a real, historical figure. Moreover, you didn't answer my question.

Are you trying to counter the claim that JC was a historical figure?

In answer to your question, no.

So, do you believe the entire New Testament miracles story? If not, what are the limits of your belief?
If you believe the entire miracles story, how can you do so with no evidence?

P

As I already said, I don't really care. I think that the significance of those stories lies in their symbolic value, not in whether they are literally and historically true or not.

[_rcrocket]

As I already said, I don't really care. I think that the significance of those stories lies in their symbolic value, not in whether they are literally and historically true or not.

The essential apostolic message is that you have to buy into the miracles story hook, line and sinker to be a true Christian.

"[Y]e should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light." 1 Peter 2:9.

"Well, because of unbelief they [the Jews] were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear: For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he spare not thee." Romans 11:20-21.

"So, because you are lukewarm -- neither hot nor cold -- I am about to spit you out of my mouth." Rev. 3:16.

Or, does the New Testament permit a mere belief that Jesus is a symbol, that He did not perform His miracles, that He did not work the atonement?

P

[_Gazelam]

So are you hoping for a symbolic salvation or a Literal one?

Are you symbolicly sealed to a companion for time and all eternity?

Symbolicly sealed up to the blessings promised to Abraham?

Symbolicly sealed up to the name of Christ?

Symbolicly carrying the Endless Priesthood after the order of the Son of God?

Symbolicly conferring the Gift of the Holy Ghost?

Literally your a coward.

[_Yoda]

As I already said, I don't really care. I think that the significance of those stories lies in their symbolic value, not in whether they are literally and historically true or not.

The essential apostolic message is that you have to buy into the miracles story hook, line and sinker to be a true Christian.

"[Y]e should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light." 1 Peter 2:9.

"Well, because of unbelief they [the Jews] were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear: For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he spare not thee." Romans 11:20-21.

"So, because you are lukewarm -- neither hot nor cold -- I am about to spit you out of my mouth." Rev. 3:16.

Or, does the New Testament permit a mere belief that Jesus is a symbol, that He did not perform His miracles, that He did not work the atonement?

P

I believe that Jesus was both a historical figure and the Savior of the world. I stated that earlier. Yes, I believe the miracles of the New Testament. Now what?

[_Mister Scratch]

As I already said, I don't really care. I think that the significance of those stories lies in their symbolic value, not in whether they are literally and historically true or not.

The essential apostolic message is that you have to buy into the miracles story hook, line and sinker to be a true Christian.

"[Y]e should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light." 1 Peter 2:9.

"Well, because of unbelief they [the Jews] were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear: For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he spare not thee." Romans 11:20-21.

"So, because you are lukewarm -- neither hot nor cold -- I am about to spit you out of my mouth." Rev. 3:16.

Or, does the New Testament permit a mere belief that Jesus is a symbol, that He did not perform His miracles, that He did not work the atonement?

P

No; you're missing the point. Is the atonement a literal, provable, historical fact? Does such a thing matter? Moreover, I see nothing in your quotes which states unquestionably that you must "buy into the miracles" in an empirical, materialist sort of way. This is a matter of faith, not literalism.

[_Mister Scratch]

So are you hoping for a symbolic salvation or a Literal one?

Are you symbolicly sealed to a companion for time and all eternity?

I can't see that there is really any appreciable, meaningful difference between the "literal" and the "symbolic" in this instance.

Symbolicly sealed up to the blessings promised to Abraham?

Symbolicly sealed up to the name of Christ?

Symbolicly carrying the Endless Priesthood after the order of the Son of God?

Symbolicly conferring the Gift of the Holy Ghost?

Can you explain what the difference is between the "literal" and the "symbolic" is in each of these examples?

Literally your[sic] a coward.

Your typo notwithstanding, you are a blowhard. There is nothing cowardly about addressing the nature of faith.