"Being godless might be good for your health - study shows

[Doctor CamNC4Me]

I respect Physics Guy's personal experience. To me, that kind of personal experience is exactly the kind of spirituality that makes sense. It's not attached to any kind of fealty to an organization, power structure, or worthiness interview. It just is. It exists and it worked for him in a moment of crisis. It's kind of nice.

I do want to take a moment to address the atheist in a foxhole thing. A small personal example is in order, I think.

2009, Iraq, myself and my O went outside the wire to meet a local judge and his sheriff in an attempt to set up a jurisdictional court. We had a literal court, judge's chamber, and office built so some sort of order could be implemented in the area. Long story short, he shows up with a few extra henchmen and my O and the Terp are talking to him (this is outside in the middle of a road). As they were talking I eased myself back step by step until I had his folks in a kill 'fan' or vector. I literally thought, "I'm gonna shoot that idiot first, then him, him, him, and him. Don't shoot the judge." Then I proceeded to run the kill scenario through my mind over and over so I'd just react without hesitation if whatever went sideways. There were no prayers that day, or any day before or after.

As far as social isolation goes, I dunno about that. I'm married. I'm good with my kids. My wife and I are friendly enough with people. She's tight with her family. We're on good terms with our neighbors. What more qualifies as having a healthy social life? Going to some soul crushing, diaper crap smelling office building and singing hymns out of tune with other people who feel obligated to be there? Cool. Yeah, dawg. Imma pass on that one, but thanks anyway.

- Doc

[Themis]

Non-Muslims were second-class citizens but were not compelled to convert.

Do you see what is wrong with this statement?

[Lem]

It still seems to me that that short prayer was something that cost me nothing, yet raised my chances of not crashing the car and being fast enough by some percentage, by calming me down and helping me focus. And it was a card that I would not have been able to play if I had no faith in God.

It may be so for you, but it is not universal at all. You defined it as "an additional psychological asset," as though it were absolutely unique. I disagree. It does not exclusively require faith in god for everyone to engage in something that calms one down and helps one focus. It may work for some, but so do a lot of other things. This is not a rant against religion, simply a statement of fact. I am surprised that there is such an insistence that religion is so unique that there is literally nothing else in existence that can provide all of the things an individual may draw from a belief in it. We may have to revive DrW's thread on sources of human spirituality.

[Doctor CamNC4Me]

We may have to revive DrW's thread on sources of human spirituality.

I would love to read that thread again if you can find the link.

- Doc

[mentalgymnast]

I'm looking for your supporting evidence on this claim.

Still waiting...

I think that it is more likely that a person who has no belief in God tends to look inward rather than outward, to a deity, as they live in the world. Not that they aren’t social beings...we’re all human and have social needs and desires...but I would think that, generally speaking, atheists would be more introverted than extroverted as they look within to their inner light rather an external light to guide their way.

Granted, these are my thoughts and I don’t have any studies or research to refer to. Rather than say isolated I might have said introverted to be more precise.

And for all I know, I could be dead wrong. That’s just my gut instinct/feeling as I think about those that live together in religious/spiritual communities relying on each other and a higher power compared to those that don’t.

It would be interesting to know if there are any studies that would support my intuition, but I’m not aware of any offhand. So evidence? Not really.

Regards,
MG

[Lem]

We may have to revive DrW's thread on sources of human spirituality.

I would love to read that thread again if you can find the link.

- Doc

Here you go!

http://mormondiscussions.com/viewtopic. ... &start=273

[Doctor CamNC4Me]

Double thanks!

[Doctor CamNC4Me]

Boy, that was a blast from the past. I think this point made by Lemmie on the linked discussion kind of buttons up this thread's context nicely:

Ditto. The consistency issue is particularly troublesome, especially when the Mormon newsroom trumpets, as a spiritual experience, every coincidental "win" during emergencies, man-made or otherwise, but is utterly silent on the equally coincidental losses. To me, using that after-the-fact hindsight, as it was called in this thread, to declare the existence of a spiritual experience is simply dishonest.

Perhaps the lack of a spiritual safety net forces a person to ground themselves in this reality and often in the moment. For example, when I related the story about pulling guard duty above, instead of spending mental energy praying to a deity and wishing for Its protection I was hyper focused on the task at hand. I don't see this as being disadvantageous in the least on any level, whatsoever.

- Doc

[Meadowchik]

Perhaps the lack of a spiritual safety net forces a person to ground themselves in this reality and often in the moment. For example, when I related the story about pulling ghard duty above, instead of spending mental energy praying to a deity and wishing for Its protection I was hyper focused on the task at hand. I don't see this as being disadvantageous in the least on any level, whatsoever.

- Doc

Yes.

Speaking of coincidences, in December I attended an online funeral of a high school friend. The same day I listened to the in order to podcast interviewing Brother Jake taken about two years after his cardiac arrest and extensive therapy. The high school friend also experienced cardiac arrest. Yet unlike Brother Jake there was no one nearby who could give him CPR.

Brother Jake spoke about how he still sees randomness in the universe, not God. My high school friend's sister spoke at the funeral after others remarked about God's plan. She says she hopes more people learn CPR.

I still struggle to believe my friend is gone. He was a true light in the world. I think that in time I will feel more comfort in the fact that he lived his life so fully and generously for others. But for now, I still grieve. And I should learn CPR.

[Morley]

Still waiting...

I think that it is more likely that a person who has no belief in God tends to look inward rather than outward, to a deity, as they live in the world. Not that they aren’t social beings...we’re all human and have social needs and desires...but I would think that, generally speaking, atheists would be more introverted than extroverted as they look within to their inner light rather an external light to guide their way.

Granted, these are my thoughts and I don’t have any studies or research to refer to. Rather than say isolated I might have said introverted to be more precise.

And for all I know, I could be dead wrong. That’s just my gut instinct/feeling as I think about those that live together in religious/spiritual communities relying on each other and a higher power compared to those that don’t.

It would be interesting to know if there are any studies that would support my intuition, but I’m not aware of any offhand. So evidence? Not really.

Regards,
MG

MG, you're right about one thing: There's absolutely no credible research or psychological framework on introversion-extroversion that would back up your so-called feeling/intuition/gut instinct/extraction-from-your-bum.

.