“The worst religious text I have ever read.”

[I Have Questions]

James tour most likely believes the Book of Mormon is a terrible book and Joseph Smith was a fraud.

To be fair, James Tour has met Jesus in person, just like Joseph Smith.

It was on the 7th of November 1977, while alone is his room, that Tour realized Yeshua was the Messiah: “I said, ‘Lord, I am a sinner. Forgive me. Come into my life.’”

That’s when Tour recounts how Jesus appeared to him in his bedroom,

“Then all of a sudden, someone was in my room. I was on my knees. I opened my eyes. Who was in my room? That man, Jesus Christ, stood in my room. This amazing sense of God, Jesus was in my room. I wasn’t scared. I was just weeping. The presence was so glorious because He was there in my room. I didn’t want to get up. This amazing sense of forgiveness just started to come upon me. That was Him.”

But Jesus didn’t tell James to join the SLC LDS Church. Didn’t talk to him about The Book of Mormon. Didn’t suggest he meet the missionaries. I cannot find any evidence that James Tour has shown any interest in The Book of Mormon. Maybe MG 2.0 has some…

[MG 2.0]

No better reason than that to $hitcan every copy of the Book of Mormon, avoiding possible indoctrination via it and instead embrace science (knowledge) and reason.

The thing is that one can do both. Faith and reason. I've been watching a lecture and Q&A given by James Tour, a renowned organic chemist. He is a believer in Christ and in the resurrection. When I see that there are some well-known and respected scientists that are also Christians, I think that is significant.

In this presentation Dr. Tour goes into great detail in regard to origin of life and the great unlikelihood that current theories of abiogenesis can explain the great complexity that was present in the beginning stages of life's origins. Apparently, at least from what he says in the lecture, other scientists that are not trained specifically in organic chemistry are hesitant to have an in-depth discussion/debate with him. In the video presentation I found it refreshing that during the Q&A that the students who were present were so kind and respectful towards him. They had their questions, and he had answers that showed he had done his homework...obviously.

I honestly hadn't heard of him before watching this presentation. I would like to know how someone trained in the sciences on this board would respond to Dr. Tour. Do you think he is compartmentalizing to the extreme? From watching the full video, it was rather obvious that his faith runs deep in his soul.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JjljpWgEDH8

sock puppet, do you fall into this category? You made a rather strong statement in your quote above.

Regards,
MG

The Book of Mormon brings souls to Christ. James Tour came to Christ. Believing in the resurrection of Christ and His Atonement does not then entail that one leaves science and reason behind.

That was my point. Pure and simple.

sock puppet seems to disagree as might others.

On topic with sock puppet's post which I believed was inaccurate.

James Tour and other well known scientists would tend to disagree with sock puppet's characterization of a disciple of Christ. I've mentioned Francis Collins and John Polkinghorne...there are many others. I just find it interesting that critics (who may not have the equivalent scientific training) take it upon themselves to be 'authorities' in matters of which they may not have expertise.

And to negate Tour's experience with the divine is kind of arrogant and disrespectful, in my opinion.

Regards,
MG

[I Have Questions]

The thing is that one can do both. Faith and reason. I've been watching a lecture and Q&A given by James Tour, a renowned organic chemist. He is a believer in Christ and in the resurrection. When I see that there are some well-known and respected scientists that are also Christians, I think that is significant.

In this presentation Dr. Tour goes into great detail in regard to origin of life and the great unlikelihood that current theories of abiogenesis can explain the great complexity that was present in the beginning stages of life's origins. Apparently, at least from what he says in the lecture, other scientists that are not trained specifically in organic chemistry are hesitant to have an in-depth discussion/debate with him. In the video presentation I found it refreshing that during the Q&A that the students who were present were so kind and respectful towards him. They had their questions, and he had answers that showed he had done his homework...obviously.

I honestly hadn't heard of him before watching this presentation. I would like to know how someone trained in the sciences on this board would respond to Dr. Tour. Do you think he is compartmentalizing to the extreme? From watching the full video, it was rather obvious that his faith runs deep in his soul.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JjljpWgEDH8

sock puppet, do you fall into this category? You made a rather strong statement in your quote above.

Regards,
MG

The Book of Mormon brings souls to Christ. James Tour came to Christ. Believing in the resurrection of Christ and His Atonement does not then entail that one leaves science and reason behind.

That was my point. Pure and simple.

sock puppet seems to disagree as might others.

On topic with sock puppet's post which I believed was inaccurate.

James Tour and other well known scientists would tend to disagree with sock puppet's characterization of a disciple of Christ. I've mentioned Francis Collins and John Polkinghorne...there are many others. I just find it interesting that critics (who may not have the equivalent scientific training) take it upon themselves to be 'authorities' in matters of which they may not have expertise.

And to negate Tour's experience with the divine is kind of arrogant and disrespectful, in my opinion.

Regards,
MG

You should send James a copy of The Book of Mormon, challenge him to read it and pray about it so that he can learn it’s truthfulness. Then return and report with his reaction to it (given that he meets with Jesus in person he’s in a good position to verify if it’s the real deal or not).

Will you do that MG? If not, why not?

How many Books of Mormon have you given out to non member neighbours in your area? And how many read it and were impressed and have now been baptised?

[Marcus]

You should send James a copy of The Book of Mormon, challenge him to read it and pray about it so that he can learn it’s truthfulness. Then return and report with his reaction to it (given that he meets with Jesus in person he’s in a good position to verify if it’s the real deal or not).

Will you do that MG? If not, why not?

He doesn't do anything real that's related to his posting here. And his talk of the meaningfulness of religion is just the cover he uses so he can disparage a group of people he hates and stereotypes.

Case in point, he calls it "arrogant and disrespectful" to "negate" a person's religious experience, right after he 'negates' critics with a group ad hom and a stereotyping speculation:

"...critics (who may not have the equivalent scientific training) take it upon themselves to be 'authorities' in matters of which they may not have expertise."

Those speculations are a specialty of the Wasatch front passive aggressive style. After all, he can defend it by saying he didn't really say a whole group has no 'expertise' (because of course he has no knowledge of that), he just speculated that they don't. Using this technique allows one to pretend to oneself, I suppose, that they really are trying to be a good person, while trolling a forum.

A never-Mo atheist decided to read the Book of Mormon from as neutral a place as you can expect. His glowing review?

“Like chewing flavorless gum for a month.”

As much as DCP loves to harp on the witnesses to the Book of Mormon, he has to crawl, stumble, and peer meekly over the giant boulder that is the non-Mormon apathy to this wet rag. Shakespeare it is not.

https://youtu.be/TDIBzFdEjkM

I like your alternate take on that metaphor:
"...he has to crawl, stumble, and peer meekly over the giant boulder that is the non-Mormon apathy to this wet rag..."

[MG 2.0]

You should send James a copy of The Book of Mormon, challenge him to read it and pray about it so that he can learn it’s truthfulness. Then return and report with his reaction to it (given that he meets with Jesus in person he’s in a good position to verify if it’s the real deal or not).

Will you do that MG? If not, why not?

He doesn't do anything real that's related to his posting here. And his talk of the meaningfulness of religion is just the cover he uses so he can disparage a group of people he hates and stereotypes.

Case in point, he calls it "arrogant and disrespectful" to "negate" a person's religious experience, right after he 'negates' critics with a group ad hom and a stereotyping speculation:

"...critics (who may not have the equivalent scientific training) take it upon themselves to be 'authorities' in matters of which they may not have expertise."

Those speculations are a specialty of the Wasatch front passive aggressive style. After all, he can defend it by saying he didn't really say a whole group has no 'expertise' (because of course he has no knowledge of that), he just speculated that they don't. Using this technique allows one to pretend to oneself, I suppose, that they really are trying to be a good person, while trolling a forum.

A never-Mo atheist decided to read the Book of Mormon from as neutral a place as you can expect. His glowing review?

“Like chewing flavorless gum for a month.”

As much as DCP loves to harp on the witnesses to the Book of Mormon, he has to crawl, stumble, and peer meekly over the giant boulder that is the non-Mormon apathy to this wet rag. Shakespeare it is not.

https://youtu.be/TDIBzFdEjkM

I like your alternate take on that metaphor:
"...he has to crawl, stumble, and peer meekly over the giant boulder that is the non-Mormon apathy to this wet rag..."

TTOC

[MG 2.0]

The Book of Mormon brings souls to Christ. James Tour came to Christ. Believing in the resurrection of Christ and His Atonement does not then entail that one leaves science and reason behind.

That was my point. Pure and simple.

sock puppet seems to disagree as might others.

On topic with sock puppet's post which I believed was inaccurate.

James Tour and other well known scientists would tend to disagree with sock puppet's characterization of a disciple of Christ. I've mentioned Francis Collins and John Polkinghorne...there are many others. I just find it interesting that critics (who may not have the equivalent scientific training) take it upon themselves to be 'authorities' in matters of which they may not have expertise.

And to negate Tour's experience with the divine is kind of arrogant and disrespectful, in my opinion.

Regards,
MG

You should send James a copy of The Book of Mormon, challenge him to read it and pray about it so that he can learn it’s truthfulness. Then return and report with his reaction to it (given that he meets with Jesus in person he’s in a good position to verify if it’s the real deal or not).

Will you do that MG? If not, why not?

How many Books of Mormon have you given out to non member neighbours in your area? And how many read it and were impressed and have now been baptised?

Straying off topic?

Regards,
MG

[I Have Questions]

You should send James a copy of The Book of Mormon, challenge him to read it and pray about it so that he can learn it’s truthfulness. Then return and report with his reaction to it (given that he meets with Jesus in person he’s in a good position to verify if it’s the real deal or not).

Will you do that MG? If not, why not?

How many Books of Mormon have you given out to non member neighbours in your area? And how many read it and were impressed and have now been baptised?

Straying off topic?

Regards,
MG

My post is completely on topic.

You should send James a copy of The Book of Mormon, challenge him to read it and pray about it so that he can learn it’s truthfulness. Then return and report with his reaction to it (given that he meets with Jesus in person he’s in a good position to verify if it’s the real deal or not).

Will you do that MG? If not, why not?

How many Books of Mormon have you given out to non member neighbours in your area? And how many read it and were impressed and have now been baptised?

[MG 2.0]

James tour most likely believes the Book of Mormon is a terrible book and Joseph Smith was a fraud.

Hard to know. I'm not aware of any direct comment or interaction James Tour has had with the LDS Church or it's people.

Guess work on your part.

Regards,
MG

[I Have Questions]

James tour most likely believes the Book of Mormon is a terrible book and Joseph Smith was a fraud.

Hard to know. I'm not aware of any direct comment or interaction James Tour has had with the LDS Church or it's people.

Guess work on your part.

Regards,
MG

So be a good missionary, send him a copy of the Book of Mormon and discuss it with him. He’s very easily reachable and is willing to have zoom calls with people. He’s met Jesus in person, why wouldn’t you reach out to him?

Or aren’t you willing to do that?

[MG 2.0]

Hard to know. I'm not aware of any direct comment or interaction James Tour has had with the LDS Church or it's people.

Guess work on your part.

Regards,
MG

So be a good missionary, send him a copy of the Book of Mormon and discuss it with him. He’s very easily reachable and is willing to have zoom calls with people. He’s met Jesus in person, why wouldn’t you reach out to him?

Or aren’t you willing to do that?

I appreciate your suggestion to reach out to Dr. Tour.

I did!

Sent an email with hopes of hearing from him. Honestly, I hadn't really considered making any contact with him.

We'll see. Maybe I'll make a new friend!

If I hear from him I'll let you know.

Regards,
MG