More Excommunications

[_karl61]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070926/ap_ ... uns_heresy

The Nuns got the boot.


"Six Catholic nuns have been excommunicated for heresy after refusing to give up membership in a Canadian sect whose founder claims to be the reincarnation of the Virgin Mary, the Diocese of Little Rock announced Wednesday"

[_karl61]

bump

[_harmony]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070926/ap_on_re_us/nuns_heresy

The Nuns got the boot.


"Six Catholic nuns have been excommunicated for heresy after refusing to give up membership in a Canadian sect whose founder claims to be the reincarnation of the Virgin Mary, the Diocese of Little Rock announced Wednesday"

If they're Catholic, how can they be members of a Canadian sect/church too? Isn't that like saying LDS missionaries are also members of the local witches coven? And why wouldn't they be ex'ed, if that were the case?

[_Livingstone22]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070926/ap_on_re_us/nuns_heresy

The Nuns got the boot.


"Six Catholic nuns have been excommunicated for heresy after refusing to give up membership in a Canadian sect whose founder claims to be the reincarnation of the Virgin Mary, the Diocese of Little Rock announced Wednesday"

If they're Catholic, how can they be members of a Canadian sect/church too? Isn't that like saying LDS missionaries are also members of the local witches coven? And why wouldn't they be ex'ed, if that were the case?

Perhaps there would be no problem in this...because they are nuns (clergy) and not lay people. But, (although I'm not sure what this sect is), some ideologies/churches/religions are not exclusive (like the LDS and Catholic churches)...and therefore people can be members of more than one. For instance, the Church of Scientology (which in my opinion isn't really a church in the traditional sense), the Freemasonry lodge, and Shintoism are examples in which people can belong to them, while holding membership in another church too--many Scientologist and Freemasons are also Baptists, Catholics, or Mormons....one census in Japan produced a 180% response rate because most people defined themselves as both Shinto and Buddhist. My own mother held official membership at the same time in the Southern Baptist Convention as well as the Roman Catholic Church. Some Mormons define themselves as "Republicans," "Libertarians," and even (gasp) "Democrats." Perhaps if we (as Mormons) didn't excommunicate everybody who had slightly differing ideas and perspectives than what is found in the current "officially approved" set of beliefs, we would find that the set of human thought and understanding of the Eternal God is wider than one's own mind, we could grow out of our arrogant ethnocentrism, and draw more people in.

[_Livingstone22]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070926/ap_on_re_us/nuns_heresy

The Nuns got the boot.


"Six Catholic nuns have been excommunicated for heresy after refusing to give up membership in a Canadian sect whose founder claims to be the reincarnation of the Virgin Mary, the Diocese of Little Rock announced Wednesday"

If they're Catholic, how can they be members of a Canadian sect/church too? Isn't that like saying LDS missionaries are also members of the local witches coven? And why wouldn't they be ex'ed, if that were the case?

Perhaps there would be no problem in this...because they are nuns (clergy) and not lay people. But, (although I'm not sure what this sect is), some ideologies/churches/religions are not exclusive (like the LDS and Catholic churches)...and therefore people can be members of more than one. For instance, the Church of Scientology (which in my opinion isn't really a church in the traditional sense), the Freemasonry lodge, and Shintoism are examples in which people can belong to them, while holding membership in another church too--many Scientologist and Freemasons are also Baptists, Catholics, or Mormons....one census in Japan produced a 180% response rate because most people defined themselves as both Shinto and Buddhist. My own mother held official membership at the same time in the Southern Baptist Convention as well as the Roman Catholic Church. Some Mormons define themselves as "Republicans," "Libertarians," and even (gasp) "Democrats." Perhaps if we (as Mormons) didn't excommunicate everybody who had slightly differing ideas and perspectives than what is found in the current "officially approved" set of beliefs, we would find that the set of human thought and understanding of the Eternal God is wider than one's own mind, we could grow out of our arrogant ethnocentrism, and draw more people in.

[_bcspace]

The more the merrier.

Excomunicate them all, see them driven before you, and hear the lamentation of the pricked kickers.

Some Mormons define themselves as "Republicans," "Libertarians," and even (gasp) "Democrats." Perhaps if we (as Mormons) didn't excommunicate everybody who had slightly differing ideas and perspectives than what is found in the current "officially approved" set of beliefs,

This does not happen at all. Witness Harry Reid. He has done far worse than many who are ex'd and yet he remains a member.

we would find that the set of human thought and understanding of the Eternal God is wider than one's own mind, we could grow out of our arrogant ethnocentrism, and draw more people in.

That would be contrary to scripture. We do not define God, and we know the way is narrow, but only the truly broad in mind can fit (those who have considered all things and rejected those that conflict with revealed doctrine).

[_Livingstone22]

The more the merrier.

Excomunicate them all, see them driven before you, and hear the lamentation of the pricked kickers.

Some Mormons define themselves as "Republicans," "Libertarians," and even (gasp) "Democrats." Perhaps if we (as Mormons) didn't excommunicate everybody who had slightly differing ideas and perspectives than what is found in the current "officially approved" set of beliefs,

This does not happen at all. Witness Harry Reid. He has done far worse than many who are ex'd and yet he remains a member.

we would find that the set of human thought and understanding of the Eternal God is wider than one's own mind, we could grow out of our arrogant ethnocentrism, and draw more people in.

That would be contrary to scripture. We do not define God, and we know the way is narrow, but only the truly broad in mind can fit (those who have considered all things and rejected those that conflict with revealed doctrine).

Very well, excommunication isn't applied on "everyone with slightly differing ideas and perspectives." That was an exaggeration; I admit. But I know some who have (in my opinion) done less than Harry Ried, and have been excommunicated (granted excommunicating Reid would be really bad publicity). But we do believe in personal revelation, correct? Are we not to read scriptures and pray for personal understanding? Do we not have free agency in our beliefs? Should this be reason to excommunicate lay members? It seems like a scare tactic to make people change their views--but then how morally responsible is someone who believes and acts the way they do just because they're afraid of being excommunicated? Most of all, can't we (even Church leaders) admit that we don't know it all? Sometimes there are things that we still don't understand? When Larry King asked President Hinckley if he thought God could have prevented the terrorist attacks of 9/11, President Hinckley responded "Oh, I suppose so. I believe He's all powerful, yes. I don't know His will. I don't know how He operates." Maybe we could be wrong about a lot of things.

Curiously, I am wondering what you mean when you use the word "know."

[_bcspace]

Very well, excommunication isn't applied on "everyone with slightly differing ideas and perspectives." That was an exaggeration; I admit.

And a bit of sensationalist yellow journalism as well.

But I know some who have (in my opinion) done less than Harry Ried, and have been excommunicated (granted excommunicating Reid would be really bad publicity).

Did I not also say as much? Harry Reid should have been long gone. Principle Trump's publicity in my book.

But we do believe in personal revelation, correct? Are we not to read scriptures and pray for personal understanding? Do we not have free agency in our beliefs? Should this be reason to excommunicate lay members?

If it conflicts with doctrine revealed to the Church. There is a reason for the Church organization and truth for the whole Church and the world does not come from outside it Ephesians 4:11-14.

It seems like a scare tactic to make people change their views--but then how morally responsible is someone who believes and acts the way they do just because they're afraid of being excommunicated?

It's downright hypocritical. One who does not accept the teachings/rules of an organization should voluntarily and hastily separate themselves from it

Most of all, can't we (even Church leaders) admit that we don't know it all?

Yes indeed.

Sometimes there are things that we still don't understand?

Sure.

When Larry King asked President Hinckley if he thought God could have prevented the terrorist attacks of 9/11, President Hinckley responded "Oh, I suppose so. I believe He's all powerful, yes. I don't know His will. I don't know how He operates."

Sure.

Maybe we could be wrong about a lot of things.

I've never known an official doctrine to be wrong. I have known many pet theories on what some consider to be doctrine to be wrong.

Curiously, I am wondering what you mean when you use the word "know."

Matthew 7:14

[_Livingstone22]

Curiously, I am wondering what you mean when you use the word "know."

Matthew 7:14

I'm sorry, I meant I was curious as to your understanding of using the word "know" in any context, not in what you professed to know in this particular instance.

[_bcspace]

we know the way is narrow

Curiously, I am wondering what you mean when you use the word "know."

Matthew 7:14

I'm sorry, I meant I was curious as to your understanding of using the word "know" in any context, not in what you professed to know in this particular instance.

In this, the religious context.....Alma 32:26-34