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Some Mormons Search the Web and Find Doubt - NYT

Posted: Sun Jul 21, 2013 2:32 am
by _Stormy Waters
When fellow believers in Sweden first began coming to him with information from the Internet that contradicted the church’s history and teachings, he dismissed it as “anti-Mormon propaganda,” the whisperings of Lucifer. He asked his superiors for help in responding to the members’ doubts, and when they seemed to only sidestep the questions, Mr. Mattsson began his own investigation.


Some Mormons Search the Web and Find Doubt

For those who might be interested.

Re: Some Mormons Search the Web and Find Doubt - NYT

Posted: Sun Jul 21, 2013 3:02 am
by _DrW
The actions of senior Church leadership, as described in this Podcast, are nothing short of despicable.

This kind of behavior should be made known to the general membership. However, these guys essentially operate in secret and are not accountable to anyone.

Paraphrasing, this Swedish Brother simply asks, "Why was I not told the truth? I went on a mission and taught people what I was taught, but what I taught was not the truth. The main thing my Stake President told me in response to my questions was to not talk about my doubts about anyone else, not even my wife."

What a Church.

What a screwed up excuse for a Church.

Re: Some Mormons Search the Web and Find Doubt - NYT

Posted: Sun Jul 21, 2013 3:09 am
by _sunstoned
The truth always finds a way to be heard. The internet is not a friend to the church.

Re: Some Mormons Search the Web and Find Doubt - NYT

Posted: Sun Jul 21, 2013 3:30 am
by _malkie
From the article:

'Eric Hawkins, a church spokesman, said that “every church faces this challenge,” adding, “The answer is not to try to silence critics, but to provide as much information and as much support as possible to those who may be affected.” Mr. Hawkins also said the Mormon Church, which counts 14 million members worldwide, added about one million members every three years.'

Well, at least they do the right thing. They don't try to hide information, or suppress doubts, right?

Re: Some Mormons Search the Web and Find Doubt - NYT

Posted: Sun Jul 21, 2013 3:30 am
by _sock puppet
sunstoned wrote:The truth always finds a way to be heard. The internet is not a friend to the church.

Or in one sentence: "The truth ... is not a friend of the church."

Re: Some Mormons Search the Web and Find Doubt - NYT

Posted: Sun Jul 21, 2013 3:32 am
by _sock puppet
malkie wrote:From the article:

'Eric Hawkins, a church spokesman, said that “every church faces this challenge,” adding, “The answer is not to try to silence critics, but to provide as much information and as much support as possible to those who may be affected.” Mr. Hawkins also said the Mormon Church, which counts 14 million members worldwide, added about one million members every three years.'

Well, at least they do the right thing. They don't try to hide information, or suppress doubts, right?

That's a sign of a true believer, someone who thinks that providing as much information will some how help the Mormon Church. Information is an anathema to the Mormon Church.

Re: Some Mormons Search the Web and Find Doubt - NYT

Posted: Sun Jul 21, 2013 3:35 am
by _malkie
sock puppet wrote:
malkie wrote:From the article:

'Eric Hawkins, a church spokesman, said that “every church faces this challenge,” adding, “The answer is not to try to silence critics, but to provide as much information and as much support as possible to those who may be affected.” Mr. Hawkins also said the Mormon Church, which counts 14 million members worldwide, added about one million members every three years.'

Well, at least they do the right thing. They don't try to hide information, or suppress doubts, right?

That's a sign of a true believer, someone who thinks that providing as much information will some how help the Mormon Church. Information is an anathema to the Mormon Church.

Of course, saying that you provide information and support is a bit different from actually providing information and support, isn't it?

Re: Some Mormons Search the Web and Find Doubt - NYT

Posted: Sun Jul 21, 2013 5:22 am
by _Willy Law
A version of this article appeared in print on July 21, 2013, on page A1 of the New York edition with the headline: Some Mormons Search the Web And Find Doubt.


Front page of the Sunday Times? Wow

Re: Some Mormons Search the Web and Find Doubt - NYT

Posted: Sun Jul 21, 2013 6:41 am
by _Stormy Waters
From the article

said Mr. Givens, who hosted a similar discussion in July in Provo, Utah, and has others planned in the United States. The church is not sponsoring the sessions, Mr. Givens said, but local bishops give their permission.


I thought these events were approved by church leadership, but now it appears I was mistaken. Really the church has done nothing for the average doubter. FAIR has tried, Givens is trying, but the prophets, and the apostles do nothing. Allegedly there will be essays to engage these issues at some point in the future. I'll believe them when I see them. So glad to see them finally paying the piper for whitewashing history.

Bring on the essays. Let's have a conversation about Joseph marrying his hired help. Let's have everyone hear the story of the proposal to Lucy Walker. Sure some will continue to believe, but I'm betting conversions will take a beating. At least those who stay in will do so knowing the whole story. The members have always deserved at least that much.

Re: Some Mormons Search the Web and Find Doubt - NYT

Posted: Sun Jul 21, 2013 8:38 am
by _angsty
This is an interesting and sensitive piece. I appreciate Mattsson's candor.

“The Roman Catholic Church has had 2,000 years to work through the hiccups in its history,” said Terryl L. Givens, a professor of English, literature and religion at the University of Richmond and a Mormon believer. “Mormonism is still an adolescent religion.”


Mormons typically believe Mormonism is exceptional as a religion and religious institution-- especially compared with Catholicism. If we're supposed to believe that Mormonism is credible as anything more than just another man-made faith running an expected course, explaining its development by bringing attention to the church's immaturity in relation to the RCC (which Mormons believe to be in full-blown apostasy) seems a very odd move.