Doctor CamNC4Me wrote:Hrm. That's interesting. Do you believe there was death occurring on earth before Adam transgressed?
- Doc
I thought I already answered that question here:
zerinus wrote:The answer to the third question is, I don't know. There are too many unknowns to be able to answer that question without further revelation. But I believe there is no contradiction between that and my earlier statements. The existence of fossils dating back to millions of years before the chronology of creation story of the Bible does not invalidate the creation story. Other explanations for it exist which do not cause a contradiction between two.
zerinus wrote:For the most part yes. Parts of it may be allegorical, but not all of it. The story of Eve being created out of Adam's rib is very likely allegorical, but the story of Adam and Eve itself, the Fall, and the rest is literal.
Why would you dismiss that as allegorical and not the rest?
Because an allegory is the most likely possible explanation for that aspect of the story.
If Eve did not come from the rib, was she created out of dirt like Adam or do you believe they both had human parents?
The scripture says that they were created by a divine fiat out of the "dust of the earth," meaning out of the material elements of this world (rather than being spirits). That is what the Bible says, and the Book of Mormon confirms that, so that is what I adhere to.
I'm not really sure how to interpret that. Like, do you believe anything lived and died on our earth before Adam transgressed? I'm not trying to badger you, I'm just interested in your perspective on life on this earth; was it immortal or, perhaps, there was nothing here and it was all planted as a sort of garden that Adam lived in or tended? Do you believe the fossil record is that of another planet?
- Doc
In the face of madness, rationality has no power - Xiao Wang, US historiographer, 2287 AD.
Every record...falsified, every book rewritten...every statue...has been renamed or torn down, every date...altered...the process is continuing...minute by minute. History has stopped. Nothing exists except an endless present in which the Ideology is always right.
I'm not really sure how to interpret that. Like, do you believe anything lived and died on our earth before Adam transgressed? I'm not trying to badger you, I'm just interested in your perspective on life on this earth; was it immortal or, perhaps, there was nothing here and it was all planted as a sort of garden that Adam lived in or tended? Do you believe the fossil record is that of another planet?
- Doc
I will try again. If the following bit which I had said still does not answer your question, tell me why, and I will try to rephrase it differently. Note specially the highlighted part:
zerinus wrote:Your question is not as straightforward as you might think. When you say “death before Adam’s fall,” how far do you want to go back “before Adam’s fall”? You see, in Mormon theology this earth is not the only inhabited planet. There have been trillions of them before, and will continue to be after. The universe has been and will continue to be full of inhabited planets. So “death before the Fall” needs to be understood in that context. So was there “death before the Fall”? Yes there was, at least on other planets. As far as this planet specifically is concerned, again we don’t know the answer to that question if you go back far enough. Was this earth part of an earlier “creation cycle”? We have no way of knowing, unless it is revealed to us by God. . . .
zerinus wrote:(" Do you believe the fossil record is that of another planet?")
As far as this planet specifically is concerned, again we don’t know the answer to that question if you go back far enough. Was this earth part of an earlier “creation cycle”? We have no way of knowing, unless it is revealed to us by God
Now you're just making ____ up. Name one (1) single piece of evidence to back up such an outrageous, ridiculous, claim. If all you got is "magic-magic", then it isn't evidence.
And in the end, the love you take, is equal to the love...you make. PMcC
In the face of madness, rationality has no power - Xiao Wang, US historiographer, 2287 AD.
Every record...falsified, every book rewritten...every statue...has been renamed or torn down, every date...altered...the process is continuing...minute by minute. History has stopped. Nothing exists except an endless present in which the Ideology is always right.
bcuzbcuz wrote:Now you're just making ____ up. Name one (1) single piece of evidence to back up such an outrageous, ridiculous, claim. If all you got is "magic-magic", then it isn't evidence.
I am only interested in engaging people in a civil discourse. So if you would rephrase that to express it in an inoffensive manner, I will try to respond to it accordingly.
I'm not really sure how to interpret that. Like, do you believe anything lived and died on our earth before Adam transgressed? I'm not trying to badger you, I'm just interested in your perspective on life on this earth; was it immortal or, perhaps, there was nothing here and it was all planted as a sort of garden that Adam lived in or tended? Do you believe the fossil record is that of another planet?
- Doc
I will try again. If the following bit which I had said still does not answer your question, tell me why, and I will try to rephrase it differently. Note specially the highlighted part:
zerinus wrote:Your question is not as straightforward as you might think. When you say “death before Adam’s fall,” how far do you want to go back “before Adam’s fall”? You see, in Mormon theology this earth is not the only inhabited planet. There have been trillions of them before, and will continue to be after. The universe has been and will continue to be full of inhabited planets. So “death before the Fall” needs to be understood in that context. So was there “death before the Fall”? Yes there was, at least on other planets. As far as this planet specifically is concerned, again we don’t know the answer to that question if you go back far enough. Was this earth part of an earlier “creation cycle”? We have no way of knowing, unless it is revealed to us by God. . . .
When Adam was supposed to be in the garden of Eden, the creation of the earth was complete. Do you believe other humans were walking around the earth? Do you think animals were alive and dying while Adam was in the garden but had not fallen yet?
I believe I have answered that question already. If the previous answer I gave is not clear, you need to explain why it is not clear so I can improve on it, otherwise I won’t know how else to make it any clearer.
Themis wrote:When Adam was supposed to be in the garden of Eden, the creation of the earth was complete. Do you believe other humans were walking around the earth?
No.
Do you think animals were alive and dying while Adam was in the garden but had not fallen yet?