Did leaving religion change your ethics?

[_Sanctorian]

The Mike Norton thread has some interesting dialogue going back and forth particularly surrounding the ethics of his actions. Mike has certainly pushed the boundaries of most everyone’s ethical compass.

With that said, did leaving religion change your ethics?

For me, my moral compass stayed fairly similar. I still believe in being honest, true, benevolent, virtuous, and in doing good to all men. However, the narrative that shapes my ethical code has changed how I apply that moral compass. At times, that puts me at odds with religion, particularly the Mormon church which heavily influenced my moral code.

The temple is a perfect example. I think it’s ethically wrong to withhold saving ordinances from someone that doesn’t meet the standards the church set forth. If these ordinances are truly required by God for salvation, the temple doors should be open for all regardless if they are Mormon or not, full tithe payer, masturbator, criminal, gay, etc. God will then be the judge of the persons actions. Because of this, and because the church has not made public the temples, I see no harm in someone filming what should already be public by their very own claims of what the temple is supposed to do. That is, to provide saving ordinances for ALL mankind.

[_Mary]

My ethics didn't change, but I was gentler on myself if I messed up. My inner voice became more logical, more reasonable, kinder, loving, forgiving (of myself).

[_moksha]

It seems like many who have left the LDS Church have become less conservative in their politics. Not certain that would hold true for other religions, but I am guessing it would also be the case with Evangelicals.

In the past several years I have known some individuals who left their Church because it came into conflict with their own personal view of right and wrong. You might say that ethics triumphed in those cases.

[_Xenophon]

Interesting thought exercise, Sanctorian. I would say the my ethics did not change and that they helped propel my wife and I to at least removing our name form the records as we couldn't reconcile our ethics with the Church's approach towards the LGBT community.

I'd like to break out your commentary on the temple though:

The temple is a perfect example. I think it’s ethically wrong to withhold saving ordinances from someone that doesn’t meet the standards the church set forth(emphasis mine). If these ordinances are truly required by God for salvation, the temple doors should be open for all regardless if they are Mormon or not, full tithe payer, masturbator, criminal, gay, etc. God will then be the judge of the persons actions. Because of this, and because the church has not made public the temples, I see no harm in someone filming what should already be public by their very own claims of what the temple is supposed to do. That is, to provide saving ordinances for ALL mankind.

It seems to follow, that if you actually believed that the temple contained saving ordinances from God that you are attributing the standards set forth to the wrong group. If the teachings in the temple are true and from God (a big if I know), it follows that the standards to entry are most likely from God also, does it not? Again, I think both are created by the leaders within the LDS church and so I don't sweat it. I just don't follow the logic on one part being of and from God(ordinances), but not the other(standards for those ordinances).

Perhaps I am misunderstanding your view here.

[_Black Moclips]

No. Religion didn't teach me ethics. My mommy did.

[_Sanctorian]

Xen,

You nailed it and a it’s a big fallacy in their divine claims. Mormon God teaches its members the temple ordinances are required for ALL mankind to return to Him. Mormon God baptizes and endows gays, criminals, terrorists, non-tithe payers, etc, but only when they are dead. That creates a bit of a problem when those people can just as easily do it for themselves while they are alive. Why then does Mormon God exclude the living from ordinances that are required and will happen when they die regardless of how they lived their lives simply because they don’t meet the “standard” of Mormon Gods mortal organization?

That’s a big disconnect in the narrative in my opinion.

[Guest]

My ethics changed at a foundational level.

As a believer, what was good or evil was defined by eternal laws and immutable to the point God himself was bound by law. Law and ethics were largely synonymous. I believed in radical free will to the point a pre-existent spirit living in the presence of God could make micro-decisions resulting in being assigned to various earthly conditions that were used to explain the apparent injustice of the spectrum of human life conditions, and this seemed self-evident and just. If I had been taught something was wrong but I couldn't see why, it was my responsibility to figure out where I had it wrong. Or conversely, if I was told something was right but it seemed wrong to me, I was taught obedience was more important than judging right from wrong accurately.

Seeing the universe as arbitrary and human life being meaningful only subjectively and temporarily, I apply ethical judgment to everything completely differently than as defined by the above. Religion creates ethical handicaps in adults, in my opinion. It impairs the ability to make moral judgements because it defines morality in the authority of an inaccessible omniscient being as interpreted by other people pretending to know things to a degree that inserts dishonesty as fundamental to the process.

[_Yahoo Bot]

I would like to know rather if the posters on this board are divorced.

While it is politically incorrect to say, and I'm embarrassed to make the argument, it seems there is a high correlation between (1) anonymous posters critical of the Church and (2) divorce.

If I were to speculate, I'd say there is a sub rosa instinct among divorced persons to lash out at other than their own personal moral failings, and whether it be Judaism, the Catholic Church or Mormonism, the big Church is a likely target.

Just sayin.

[Guest]

I would like to know rather if the posters on this board are divorced.

While it is politically incorrect to say, and I'm embarrassed to make the argument, it seems there is a high correlation between (1) anonymous posters critical of the Church and (2) divorce.

Just sayin'.

No.

That said, only a dumb Mormon would make that an ethical issue inherently. It shouldn't be surprising that two adults who married as believing Mormons and go through the major worldview changing events that accompany learning the foundational beliefs they were raised with are lies end up finding out they have become very different people that would both be happier and better off separating.

So, while it's stupid to even suppose a rational human being would think that way, are you seriously implying divorce is inherently an ethcial dilemma?

[_RockSlider]

I would like to know rather if the posters on this board are divorced.

While it is politically incorrect to say, and I'm embarrassed to make the argument, it seems there is a high correlation between (1) anonymous posters critical of the Church and (2) divorce.

If I were to speculate, I'd say there is a sub rosa instinct among divorced persons to lash out at other than their own personal moral failings, and whether it be Judaism, the Catholic Church or Mormonism, the big Church is a likely target.

Just sayin.

Where the heck is that coming from????

Married, one and only woman for 36 years now. How about you Bot? How many wives have you had? Are you still married?