Joseph Smith, volcanoes, and being ?????less inclined to study?????

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Joseph Smith, volcanoes, and being “less inclined to study”

Post by _Lemmie »

I don't follow church history much, but I do remember what I read here, and so this by DCP seemed very odd after the review of the Saints books:

It scarcely needs to be said, I think, that this raises an intriguing question: How much could Joseph Smith have known about volcanism in 1828-1830?


He certainly had no first hand experience with them. He was, after all, born in Vermont, a state that apparently has no known volcanoes. He grew up to maturity in New York State, which evidently has no volcanoes. (See this list of the volcanoes in the United States.)

https://www.patheos.com/blogs/danpeters ... pests.html


Really?

From a history of Mormonism site:

he Cause and Effects of the Strange Phenomenon

The chain of events that developed into what would become known as “Year without a summer” were a result of a series of volcanic eruptions. Crop harvests in the areas of New England, Atlantic Canada, and parts of Western Europe had been poor for several years. The final devastating blow came in 1815 with the eruption of Mount Tambora located in Sumbawa, Indonesia....

History records that on 10 April 1815, Mount Tambora produced the largest eruption known on the planet during the past 500 years, erupting about 50-150 cubic kilometers of magma and measuring 7 on the Volcanic Explosivity Index (VEI) scale. The eruption produced global climatic effects and killed more than 120,000 people, directly and indirectly.

This strange turn of events which historian John D. Post has called “the last great subsistence crisis in the Western world” resulted in an agricultural disaster with major food shortages across the Northern Hemisphere. As aforementioned, most of New England, Atlantic Canada, and parts of Western Europe were the areas most affected.
It is recorded that in May 1816 frost killed off most crops in the higher elevations of New England and New York, and on 6 June 1816, snow fell in Albany, New York, and Dennysville, Maine. In July and August, lake and river ice was observed as far south as northwestern Pennsylvania. A Massachusetts historian summed up the disaster:

The weather pattern for 1816 also helps to substantiate the final crop failure of 1816 that forced the Smith family to leave Vermont and move to Palmyra, New York. It was reported that the month of February was warmer than usual and crops were planted. However, by March, the weather took a turn for the worse, and “the people were visited by a piercing northeast wind, with a hail or drizzling sleet during the day....

https://historyofmormonism.com/2015/03/ ... -a-summer/


This is just a quick and dirty look at the literature, but I find it difficult to believe that the volcanic eruption that caused the Smith family to move, and which was reported extensively in the news, was completely unknown to Smith.

In fact, to a born story teller this seems like a terrific opportunity to borrow from nature in his own storytelling. How much do his descriptions of volcanic explosions match the news reports of the day from Tambora?

Seriously, I am at best a casual reader of church history. If I can see this connection, I am hard pressed to believe Peterson really thinks Smith had no knowledge of volcanic activity. This, also, seems facetious, at best:

Moreover, even assuming that books on volcanology or seismology were somehow available in his information environment, the young Joseph Smith seems to have been less than an avid student before his call to prophethood: “Joseph,” his mother later recalled, “was less inclined to the study of books than any child we had.”

https://www.patheos.com/blogs/danpeters ... pests.html



This kind of disingenuous disinformation is immoral. It contributes to the tearing apart of families.
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Re: Joseph Smith, volcanoes, and being “less inclined to stu

Post by _honorentheos »

He apparently knew so much he was the only one who knew the gases from a volcano would extinguish any fire-based light source as well as block out the sun...but only up to a point so as to not suffocate the people trying to use said light. And he knew being caught in a pyroclastic flow wasn't fatal circa 34CE. When scientists figure that out the world will have to acknowledge he was a real prophet. #greatestguesser #2.69x10–151 #coecansuckit
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Re: Joseph Smith, volcanoes, and being “less inclined to stu

Post by _NorthboundZax »

The text never says volcanoes either. So, the apologetic is rather silly multiple angles.
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Re: Joseph Smith, volcanoes, and being “less inclined to stu

Post by _Dr Exiled »

How about the apologists or someone providing evidence of a city near the LGT area that sunk into the ocean around 34 A.D.?
"Religion is about providing human community in the guise of solving problems that don’t exist or failing to solve problems that do and seeking to reconcile these contradictions and conceal the failures in bogus explanations otherwise known as theology." - Kishkumen 
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Re: Joseph Smith, volcanoes, and being “less inclined to stu

Post by _peacemaker »

Joseph Smith did not have a formal education and could not have know that Mesoamerica has many volcanoes. The Book of Mormon makes no mention of volcanoes, but it does describe volcanic activity.

The ilopango volcano erupted 2,000 years ago and devastated Mayan cities.
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Re: Joseph Smith, volcanoes, and being “less inclined to stu

Post by _I have a question »

A mopologist is once again shouting Bullseye about an arrow around which he has decided to draw a target.
“When we are confronted with evidence that challenges our deeply held beliefs we are more likely to reframe the evidence than we are to alter our beliefs. We simply invent new reasons, new justifications, new explanations. Sometimes we ignore the evidence altogether.” (Mathew Syed 'Black Box Thinking')
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Re: Joseph Smith, volcanoes, and being “less inclined to stu

Post by _Shulem »

Peterson wrote:How much could Joseph Smith have known about volcanism in 1828-1830?


How about you ask Oliver Cowdery? He was a learned man and Smith's sidekick who helped him write the Book of Mormon novel. Too much credit is given to Joseph Smith by the Church and flunky school teachers such as Peterson who will say and do anything do live and defend a lie.

I'm pretty sure bro. Oliver knew all about volcanoes!

Later, Smith took an interest in using the imagery of a volcano to instill fear into the hearts of his followers:

Smith wrote:Hell may pour forth its rage like the burning lava of Mount Vesuvius, or of Etna, or of the most terrible of the burning mountains; and yet shall “Mormonism” stand. Water, fire, truth and God are all realities.


Blah, blah, blah, from Joseph Smith and Oliver Cuntry!

Blah, blah, blah, from Daniel damned Peterson, a liar for the Lord.

:twisted:
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Re: Joseph Smith, volcanoes, and being “less inclined to stu

Post by _Mormonicious »

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Re: Joseph Smith, volcanoes, and being “less inclined to stu

Post by _grindael »

People knew there was a problem in 1816, it was VERY widespread:

The weather in 1816 was sure different. Spring had arrived as usual, but cold weather would not subside. There were lots of overcast days with no sunlight. Farmers lost their crops and all over the country there were, of course, food shortages.

The basic reason for this strange weather pattern was the eruption of Mount Tambora, in early April of 1815, which sent its dust to shroud the globe, virtually blocking the sun. However that, at the time, was not really understood.

The result was so disastrous for American farmers in Eastern Connecticut that hundreds of them made the decision to move to western territories.

Authorities were stunned and offered strange reasons for the unusual weather pattern.

Newspapers in Connecticut years later reported that old-time farmers in the state referred to 1816 as “eighteen hundred and starve to death.”

It wasn’t until well into the 20th century that scientists began to link the eruption of Mount Tambora and “the year without a summer.”

In that fateful year, 6 inches of snow fell in June, and a hard frost was evident throughout Connecticut’s summer.

To make conditions worse, the resulting drought caused wildfires to break out in many areas, including parts of Connecticut.

Other impacts included hoarding, hog price increases, and scores of people going hungry.


Throughout the state, many diary entries included facts about the lack of vegetation, birds fell dead out of the trees, and a three-day summer cold spell dropped temperatures to 40 degrees in Norwich and New London.

A day of public prayer was pronounced in Connecticut and Rhode Island.

Other cold spells continued throughout the summer, with intermittent snow freezing crops. Farmers frantically wrapped rags around their plants, but to no avail.

On Sept. 26 of that year, the temperature was 26 degrees in many places, with snow falling everywhere in New England.

Much of the corn crop in New England was lost, inflation affected wheat, grains, meat, vegetables, butter, milk and flour. Even hay was sold for six times its normal cost.

With all this gloom amongst farmers, there was, in northern New England, a beacon of hope. There were those “farmers” who produced maple syrup. Their products could be traded with active fishermen who provided fish to those men who called 1816 “the Mackerel Year.”

In spite of financial ruin for many, members of Congress voted to double their own salaries. That was a big mistake, resulting in 70% of representatives being voted out of office. One of those representatives was none other than Daniel Webster.

Not too long ago, a meteorologist named Lee Foster noted that 1816 climate data showed that year as being part of a mini-ice age. Some newspaper accounts even considered the following as possible reasons for the uncommon weather that year: deforestation, fields of ice in the Atlantic, Ben Franklin’s lightning rod experiments and, last but not least, the wrath of God.

Although Connecticut escaped most of the problems that the other New England states severely felt, there were some farmers in Eastern Connecticut who seemed to have experienced the worst of the conditions. However, for some reason or other their names were absent from the research.

The book, “The Year Without Summer: 1816 and the Volcano That Darkened the World and Changed History,” by William and Nicholas P. Klingaman is a good read. https://www.norwichbulletin.com/news/20 ... out-summer


There were newspaper reports during the summer of 1816, but not linking the strange weather with the volcano. But that would come in subsequent years... through other reports and Farmer's Almanacs which were widely read.

WILD WEATHER EVENTS IN THE SUMMER OF 1816

May frosts killed off most crops in upstate New York and the higher elevations of Massachusetts, New Hampshire, and Vermont.
On June 6, snow fell in Albany, New York, and Dennysville, Maine.
In Cape May, New Jersey, frost was reported five nights in a row in late June, causing extensive crop damage.
Lake and river ice was observed as far south as northwestern Pennsylvania in July, with frost reported as far south as Virginia on August 20 and 21.
Rapid, dramatic temperature changes occurred frequently, as temperatures sometimes went from above-normal summer levels to near freezing within hours. U.S. grain prices at least quadrupled, and oat prices increased almost eightfold.
Famine, riots, arson, and looting occurred in many European cities, while China suffered from massive crop failures and disastrous floods, and a disruption in the Indian summer monsoon season spread a cholera outbreak from the River Ganges all the way to Moscow.
ICE STORMS IN JULY?
In the United States, among the hardest hit were the people of New England. All through July, heavy frosts and occasional ice storms were commonly seen. Most people took off their winter clothing, only to have to put it on again. So many young (and old) birds were frozen that but a few were found around New England in the following 3 years.

Suicides were also not uncommon: Drought, financial panic, and lack of food goaded many to desperation.

In sum, as one anonymous poet put it:

The trees were all leafless,
the mountains were brown,
The face of the country was scathed with a frown;
And bleak were the hills,
and the foliage sere
As had never been seen at
that time of year.

A variety of almanacs and magazines have published their thoughts on the event, too:

“The Sun’s rays seemed to be destitute of heat throughout the summer; all nature was clad in a sable hue.” –Albany (N.Y.) Almanac, 1852

“During the entire season, the Sun arose each morning as though in a cloud of smoke, red and rayless, shedding little light or warmth and setting at night as behind a thick cloud of vapor, leaving hardly a trace of its having passed over the face of the Earth.” –American Magazine of History

“What would happen if the Sun should become tired of illuminating this gloomy planet?” –North American Review, 1816

CHILLING TALES OF THE TIMES
At least one Vermont farmer, according to the recollection of his nephew, James Winchester, was frozen to death in the great snowstorm of June 17 of that year: “I was at my uncle’s when he left home to go to the sheep lot, and as he went out the door, he said, jokingly, to his wife: ‘If I am not back in an hour, call the neighbors and start them after me. June is a bad month to get buried in the snow, especially when it gets so near July.’ … Three days later, searchers found him … frozen stiff.”
The Rev. Thomas Robbins of East Windsor, Connecticut, kept a diary of this cold year. It tells of a man in Maine freezing to death, of a foot of June snow in the Berkshires, and ice in Massachusetts that would bear the weight of a man. The entire corn crop, except in fields nearby ponds or the ocean, failed. Hailstones beat the blossoms off all fruit trees.
Caleb Emery of Lyman, New Hampshire, visited a well in his town that was completely frozen over on the 4th of July—8 feet below the surface of the earth and it remained that way until the 25th. The 120-day drought, which began in August, created fearsome forest fire conditions and led to fires that only the November snows could quell. Sheep froze to death in their pastures. Mackerel had to be introduced as a main course instead of pork and beef.
Elisha Clark of China, Maine, according to his granddaughter, Nellie Clark Strong of Somerville, Massachusetts, often picked Baltimore orioles off the branches of orchard trees in the cold summer and brought them into the house to warm them up.

CULTURAL EFFECTS OF THE YEAR WITHOUT A SUMMER

The lack of oats to feed the horses likely inspired the German inventor Karl Drais to research new ways of horseless transportation, which led to his invention of the ancestor of the bicycle.
Many Americans left New England for the Midwest, accelerating the westward movement of the American people. Vermont alone had as many as 15,000 people emigrate, including the family of Joseph Smith, which moved from Norwich, Vermont, to Palmyra, New York. This move may have made possible the publication of the Book of Mormon and the founding of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
In June 1816, Mary Shelley was forced by the weather to spend her Swiss holiday indoors with her literary companions, where to pass the time they decided to have a contest to see who could write the scariest story. The result was the novel Frankenstein; or, The Modern Prometheus.


Image

The dust from the 1815 eruption of Mount Tambora in the Dutch East Indies (now Indonesia) caused a worldwide lowering of temperatures during the summer of 1816, when the [Old Farmers] Almanac, legend has it, inadvertently but correctly predicted snow for July.


Unfortunately, no one linked Tambora to the global weather in Smith's day. However, there was a source where Smith could get all the information that Peterson says he could not, in Adam Clarke's Commentary. We know Smith used it, and had access to it, during the Book of Mormon translation. Here is Clarke from the Book of Revelation:

Introduction
What followed on the opening of the seven seals. The opening of the first seal; the white horse, Revelation 6:1, Revelation 6:2. The opening of the second seal; the red horse, Revelation 6:3, Revelation 6:4. The opening of the third seal; the black horse and the famine, Revelation 6:5, Revelation 6:6. The opening of the fourth seal; the pale horse, Revelation 6:7, Revelation 6:8. The opening of the fifth seal; the souls of men under the altar, Revelation 6:9-11. The opening of the sixth seal; the earthquake, the darkening of the sun and moon, and falling of the stars, Revelation 6:12-14. The terrible consternation of the kings and great men of the earth, Revelation 6:15-17.

Verse 1
When the Lamb opened one of the seals - It is worthy of remark that the opening of the seals is not merely a declaration of what God will do, but is the exhibition of a purpose then accomplished; for whenever the seal is opened, the sentence appears to be executed. It is supposed that, from Revelation 6:1-11:19, the calamities which should fall on the enemies of Christianity, and particularly the Jews, are pointed out under various images, as well as the preservation of the Christians under those calamities.

One of the four beasts - Probably that with the face of a lion. See Revelation 4:7.

Come and see - Attend to what is about to be exhibited. It is very likely that all was exhibited before his eyes as in a scene, and he saw every act represented which was to take place, and all the persons and things which were to be the chief actors.

Verse 2
A white horse - Supposed to represent the Gospel system, and pointing out its excellence, swiftness, and purity.

He that sat on him - Supposed to represent Jesus Christ.

A bow - The preaching of the Gospel, darting conviction into the hearts of sinners.

A crown - The emblem of the kingdom which Christ is to establish on earth.

Conquering, and to conquer - Overcoming and confounding the Jews first, and then the Gentiles; spreading more and more the doctrine and influence of the cross over the face of the earth.

Verse 3
The second beast - That which had the face of an ox.

Verse 4
Another horse - red - The emblem of war; perhaps also of severe persecution, and the martyrdom of the saints.

Him that sat thereon - Same say, Christ; others, Vespasian; others, the Roman armies; others, Artabanus, king of the Parthians, etc., etc.

Take peace from the earth - To deprive Judea of all tranquillity.

They should kill one another - This was literally the case with the Jews, while besieged by the Romans.

A great sword - Great influence and success, producing terrible carnage.

Verse 5
The third beast - That which had the face of a man.

A black horse - The emblem of famine. Some think that which took place under Claudius. See Matthew 24:7; the same which was predicted by Agabus, Acts 11:28.

A pair of balances - To show that the scarcity would be such, that every person must be put under an allowance.

Verse 6
A measure of wheat for a penny - The chaenix here mentioned was a measure of dry things; and although the capacity is not exactly known, yet it is generally agreed that it contained as much as one man could consume in a day; and a penny, the Roman denarius, was the ordinary pay of a laborer. So it appears that in this scarcity each might be able to obtain a bare subsistence by his daily labor; but a man could not, in such cases, provide for a family.

Three measures of barley - This seems to have been the proportion of value between the wheat and the barley. Barley was allowed to afford a poor aliment, and was given to the Roman soldiers instead of wheat, by way of punishment.

Hurt not the oil and the wine - Be sparing of these: use them not as delicacies, but for necessity; because neither the vines nor the olives will be productive.

Verse 7
The fourth beast - That which had the face of an eagle.

Verse 8
A pale horse - The symbol of death. Pallida mors, pale death, was a very usual poetic epithet; of this symbol there can be no doubt, because it is immediately said, His name that sat on him was Death.

And hell followed with him - The grave, or state of the dead, received the slain. This is a very elegant prosopopaeia, or personification.

Over the fourth part of the earth - One fourth of mankind was to feel the desolating effects of this seal.

To kill with sword - War; with hunger - Famine; with death - Pestilence; and with the beasts of the earth - lions, tigers, hyenas, etc., which would multiply in consequence of the devastations occasioned by war, famine, and pestilence.

Verse 9
The fifth seal - There is no animal nor any other being to introduce this seal, nor does there appear to be any new event predicted; but the whole is intended to comfort the followers of God under their persecutions, and to encourage them to bear up under their distresses.

I saw under the altar - A symbolical vision was exhibited, in which he saw an altar; and under it the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God - martyred for their attachment to Christianity, are represented as being newly slain as victims to idolatry and superstition. The altar is upon earth, not in heaven.

Verse 10
And they cried with a loud voice - That is, their blood, like that of Abel, cried for vengeance; for we are not to suppose that there was any thing like a vindictive spirit in those happy and holy souls who had shed their blood for the testimony of Jesus. We sometimes say Blood cries for blood; that is, in the order of Divine justice, every murderer, and every murdering persecutor, shall be punished.

O Lord - Ὁ Δεσποτης· Sovereign Lord, supreme Ruler; one having and exercising unlimited and uncontrolled authority.

Holy - In thy own nature, hating iniquity;

And true - In all thy promises and threatenings;

Dost thou not judge - The persecutors;

And avenge our blood - Inflict signal punishment;

On them that dwell on the earth? - Probably meaning the persecuting Jews; they dwelt επι της γης, upon that land, a form of speech by which Judea is often signified in the New Testament.

Verse 11
White robes - The emblems of purity, innocence, and triumph.

They should rest yet for a little season - This is a declaration that, when the cup of the iniquity of the Jews should be full, they should then be punished in a mass. They were determined to proceed farther, and God permits them so to do; reserving the fullness of their punishment till they had filled up the measure of their iniquity. If this book was written before the destruction of Jerusalem, as is most likely, then this destruction is that which was to fall upon the Jews; and the little time or season was that which elapsed between their martyrdom, or the date of this book, and the final destruction of Jerusalem by the Romans, under Vespasian and his son Titus, about a.d. 70. What follows may refer to the destruction of the heathen Roman empire.

Verse 12
The sixth seal - This seal also is opened and introduced by Jesus Christ alone.

A great earthquake - A most stupendous change in the civil and religious constitution of the world. If it refer to Constantine the Great, the change that was made by his conversion to Christianity might be very properly represented under the emblem of an earthquake, and the other symbols mentioned in this and the following verses.

The sun - the ancient pagan government of the Roman empire, was totally darkened; and, like a black hair sackcloth, was degraded and humbled to the dust.

The moon - the ecclesiastical state of the same empire, became as blood - was totally ruined, their sacred rites abrogated, their priests and religious institutions desecrated, their altars cast down, their temples destroyed, or turned into places for Christian worship.

Verse 13
The stars of heaven - The gods and goddesses, demi-gods, and deified heroes, of their poetical and mythological heaven, were prostrated indiscriminately, and lay as useless as the figs or fruit of a tree shaken down before ripe by a tempestuous wind.

Verse 14
And the heaven departed as a scroll - The whole system of pagan and idolatrous worship, with all its spiritual, secular, and superstitious influence, was blasted, shrivelled up, and rendered null and void, as a parchment scroll when exposed to the action of a strong fire.

And every mountain - All the props, supports, and dependencies of the empire, whether regal allies, tributary kings, dependent colonies, or mercenary troops, were all moved out of their places, so as to stand no longer in the same relation to that empire, and its worship, support, and maintenance, as they formerly did.

And island - The heathen temples, with their precincts and enclosures, cut off from the common people, and into which none could come but the privileged, may be here represented by islands, for the same reasons.

Verse 15
The kings of the earth, etc. - All the secular powers who had endeavored to support the pagan worship by authority, influence, riches, political wisdom, and military skill; with every bondman - all slaves, who were in life and limb addicted to their masters or owners.

And every freeman - Those who had been manumitted, commonly called freedmen, and who were attached, through gratitude, to the families of their liberators. All hid themselves - were astonished at the total overthrow of the heathen empire, and the revolution which had then taken place.

Verse 16
Said to the mountains and rocks - Expressions which denote the strongest perturbation and alarm. They preferred any kind of death to that which they apprehended from this most awful revolution.

From the face of him that sitteth on the throne - They now saw that all these terrible judgments came from the Almighty; and that Christ, the author of Christianity, was now judging, condemning, and destroying them for their cruel persecutions of his followers.

Verse 17
For the great day of his wrath - The decisive and manifest time in which he will execute judgment on the oppressors of his people.

Who shall be able to stand? - No might can prevail against the might of God. All these things may literally apply to the final destruction of Jerusalem, and to the revolution which took place in the Roman empire under Constantine the Great. Some apply them to the day of judgment; but they do not seem to have that awful event in view. These two events were the greatest that have ever taken place in the world, from the flood to the eighteenth century of the Christian era; and may well justify the strong figurative language used above.

Through I do not pretend to say that my remarks on this chapter point out its true signification, yet I find others have applied it in the same way. Dr. Dodd observes that the fall of Babylon, Idumea, Judah, Egypt, and Jerusalem, has been described by the prophets in language equally pompous, figurative, and strong. See Isaiah 13:10; Isaiah 34:4, concerning Babylon and Idumea; Jeremiah 4:23, Jeremiah 4:24, concerning Judah; Ezekiel 32:7, concerning Egypt; Joel 2:10, Joel 2:31, concerning Jerusalem; and our Lord himself, Matthew 24:29, concerning the same city. "Now," says he, "it is certain that the fall of any of these cities or kingdoms was not of greater concern or consequence to the world, nor more deserving to be described in pompous figures, than the fall of the pagan Roman empire, when the great lights of the heathen world, the sun, moon, and stars, the powers civil and ecclesiastical, were all eclipsed and obscured, the heathen emperors and Caesars were slain, the heathen priests and augurs were extirpated, the heathen officers and magistrates were removed, the temples were demolished, and their revenues were devoted to better uses. It is customary with the prophets, after they have described a thing in the most symbolical and figurative manner, to represent the same again in plainer language; and the same method is observed here, Revelation 6:15-17; : And the kings of the earth, etc. That is, Maximin, Galerius, Maxentius, Licinius, etc., with all their adherents and followers, were so routed and dispersed that they hid themselves in dens, etc.; expressions used to denote the utmost terror and confusion. This is, therefore, a triumph of Christ over his heathen enemies, and a triumph after a severe persecution; so that the time and all the circumstances, as well as the series and order of the prophecy, agree perfectly with this interpretation. Galerius, Maximin, and Licinius, made even a public confession of their guilt, recalled their decrees and edicts against the Christians, and acknowledged the just judgments of God and of Christ in their own destruction." See Newton, Lowman, etc., and Dr. Dodd on this chapter, with the works of several more recent authors. https://www.studylight.org/commentaries ... ion-6.html


Verse 12. The earth swallowed them.] It is very likely there was also an earthquake on this occasion, and that chasms were made in the bottom of the sea, by which many of them were swallowed up, though multitudes were overwhelmed by the waters, whose dead bodies were afterward thrown ashore. The psalmist strongly intimates that there was an earthquake on this occasion: The voice of thy thunder was in the heaven; the lightnings lightened the world; the EARTH TREMBLED and SHOOK; #Ps 77:18.


It was absolutely necessary that God should give the people at large some particular evidence of his being and power, that they might be saved from idolatry, to which they were most deplorably prone; and that they might the more readily credit Moses, who was to be the constant mediator between God and them. God, therefore, in his indescribable majesty, descended on the mount; and, by the thick dark cloud, the violent thunders, the vivid lightnings, the long and loud blasts of the trumpet, the smoke encompassing the whole mountain, and the excessive earthquake, proclaimed his power, his glory, and his holiness; so that the people, however unfaithful and disobedient afterwards, never once doubted the Divine interference, or suspected Moses of any cheat or imposture. Indeed, so absolute and unequivocal were the proofs of supernatural agency, that it was impossible these appearances could be attributed to any cause but the unlimited power of the author of Nature.
It is worthy of remark that the people were informed three days before, #Ex 19:9-11, that such an appearance was to take place; and this answered two excellent purposes: 1. They had time to sanctify and prepare themselves for this solemn transaction; and, 2. Those who might be skeptical had sufficient opportunity to make use of every precaution to prevent and detect an imposture; so this previous warning strongly serves the cause of Divine revelation.


Verse 22. I have talked with you from heaven.] Though God manifested himself by the fire, the lightning, the earthquake, the thick darkness, &c., yet the ten words, or commandments were probably uttered from the higher regions of the air,


Smith:
And it came to pass that there was a voice heard among all the inhabitants of the earth, upon all the face of this land, crying... 3 NE 9:1


[Clarke]Verse 33. They, and all that appertained to them] Korah, Dathan, and Abiram, and all that appertained to their respective families, went down into the pit caused by this supernatural earthquake; while the fire from the Lord consumed the 250 men that bare censers. Thus there were two distinct punishments, the pit and the fire, for the two divisions of these rebels. Deut 16


Clarke Matthew 24:

Earthquakes, in divers places - If we take the word σεισμοι from σειω to shake, in the first sense, then it means particularly those popular commotions and insurrections which have already been noted; and this I think to be the true meaning of the word: but if we confine it to earthquakes, there were several in those times to which our Lord refers; particularly one at Crete in the reign of Claudius, one at Smyrna, Miletus, Chios, Samos. See Grotius. One at Rome, mentioned by Tacitus; and one at Laodicea in the reign of Nero, in which the city was overthrown, as were likewise Hierapolis and Colosse. See Tacit. Annal. lib. xii. and lib. xiv. One at Campania, mentioned by Seneca; and one at Rome, in the reign of Galba, mentioned by Suetonius in the life of that emperor. Add to all these, a dreadful one in Judea, mentioned by Josephus (War, b. iv. c. 4). accompanied by a dreadful tempest, violent winds, vehement showers, and continual lightnings and thunders; which led many to believe that these things portended some uncommon calamity.


PSALM CIV

The majesty and power of God manifested in the creation of the heavens and the atmosphere, 1-3; of the earth and sea, 4- 9; of the springs, fountains, and rivers, 10-13; of vegetables and trees, 14-18; of the sun and moon, 19; of day and night, and their uses, 20-23; of the riches of the earth, 24; of the sea, its inhabitants, and its uses, 25, 26; of God's general providence in providing food for all kinds of animals, 27-31; of earthquakes and volcanoes, 32. God is praised for his majesty, and the instruction which his works afford, 33, 34. Sinners shall be destroyed, 35.

Smith
1. A great storm (8:5)

Clarke

The storm of hail, thunder, and lightning takes place, 22-24. (Exodus)

Smith

2. A strong and terrible tempest (8:6, 12, 17; 10:14)

Clarke

The flax and barley, being in a state of maturity, are destroyed by the tempest, 31 (Exodus)

Smith

3. Terrible thunder (8:6, 12, 17)

Clarke

Destroyed their crops with grievous storms of hail, accompanied with the most terrible thunder
and lightning.

Smith

4. Shaking of the whole earth (8:6, 12, 14, 17, 19; 10:9)

Clarke

Isaiah 24

Verse 23
Before his ancients gloriously - In the sigt of their olde men he schal ben glorified. Old MS. Bible.

"The figurative language of the prophets is taken from the analogy between the world natural and an empire or kingdom considered as a world politic. Accordingly the whole world natural, consisting of heaven and earth, signifies the whole world politic, consisting of thrones and people; or so much of it as is considered in prophecy: and the things in that world signify the analogous things in this. For the heavens and the things thereto signify thrones and dignities, and those who enjoy them; and the earth with the things thereon, the inferior people; and the lowest parts of the earth, called hades or hell, the lowest or most miserable part of them. Great earthquakes, and the shaking of heaven and earth, are put for the shaking of kingdoms, so as to distract and overthrow them; the creating a new heaven and earth, and the passing away of an old one, or the beginning and end of a world, for the rise and ruin of a body politic signified thereby. The sun, for the whole species and race of kings, in the kingdoms of the world politic; the moon, for the body of the common people, considered as the king's wife; the stars, for subordinate princes and great men; or for bishops and rulers of the people of God, when the sun is Christ: setting of the sun, moon, and stars. darkening the sun, Turning the moon into blood and falling of the stars, for the ceasing of a kingdom." Sir 1. Newton's Observations on the Prophecies, Part I., chap. 2.

These observations are of great consequence and use, in explaining the phraseology of the prophets.

Smith

5. Exceedingly sharp lightning (8:7, 12, 17)

Clarke

Verse 4
Sharp arrows - The Chaldee has, "The strong, sharp arrows are like lightning from above, with coals of juniper kindled in hell beneath." On the juniper, see the note on Job 30:4, where this passage is explained. Fiery arrows, or arrows wrapped about with inflamed combustibles, were formerly used in sieges to set the places on fire. See my notes on Ephesians 6:16; (note). (Psalm 120)

Smith

6. Burning of cities (8:8, 14, 24; (9:3, 9-10; 10:13-14)

Clarke

Introduction
This chapter contains two prophecies: the first, delivered during the siege of Jerusalem, predicts to Zedekiah the taking and burning of the city, with his own peaceful death and honorable burial, Jeremiah 34:1-7. The second was delivered when the Chaldeans had for some time broken up the siege. It reproves the Jews for their conduct towards their brethren of the poorer sort, whom they released, by a solemn covenant, from bondage, in the extremity of their danger; but compelled to return to it when they thought that danger over, Jeremiah 34:8-11. For this God threatens them with the sword, pestilence, and famine; and with the return of the Chaldeans, who should take the city, destroy it and the other cities by fire, and make an utter desolation of the whole land of Judea, Jeremiah 34:12-22.

Verse 22
The voice of harpers, etc. - This seems to indicate not only a total destruction of influence, etc., but also of being. It seems as if this city was to be swallowed up by an earthquake, or burnt up by fire from heaven. (Revelation 18)

Smith

Sinking of cities into the sea (8:9; 9:4, 7; 10:13)

Clarke

Verse 17
The clouds poured out water - It appears from this that there was a violent tempest at the time of the passage of the Red Sea. There was a violent storm of thunder, lightning, and rain. These three things are distinctly marked here.

"The skies sent out a sound:" the Thunder.
"Thine arrows went abroad:" the Lightning.
"The clouds poured out water:" the Rain. In the next verse we have,
4. An Earthquake: "The earth trembled and shook," Psalm 77:18.

Exodus 15:10

"You blew with Your wind, the sea covered them; They sank like lead in the mighty waters.

[Not an original concept when God buried all the Egyptians in water]

Smith

8. Earth carried up on cities (8:10, 14, 25; 9:5; 10:13)

Clarke

"You stretched out Your right hand, The earth swallowed them. Exodus 15

Do I need to go on?
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Re: Joseph Smith, volcanoes, and being “less inclined to stu

Post by _grindael »

The word "volcano" never occurs in the Book of Mormon. So Peterson claiming that Smith attributed all this to a volcano is simply, fantastically disingenuous. That's not what the text says at all:

CHAPTER IV.

And now it came to pass that according to our record, and we know our record to be true: for behold, it was a just man which did keep the record; for he truly did many miracles in the name of Jesus; and there was not any man which could do a miracle in the name of Jesus, save he were cleansed every whit from his iniquity. And now it came to pass, if there was no mistake made by this man in the reckoning of our time, the thirty and third year had passed away, and the people began to look with great earnestness for the sign which had been given by the prophet Samuel, the Lamanite; yea, for the time that there should be darkness for the space of three days, over the face of the land. And there began to be great doubtings and disputations among the people, notwithstanding so many signs had been given.
And it came to pass in the thirty and fourth year, in the first month, in the fourth day of the month, there arose a great storm, [NOT A VOLCANO] such an one as never had been known in all the land; and there was also a great and terrible tempest; [NOT A VOLCANO]and there was terrible thunder, [NOT A VOLCANO]insomuch that it did shake the whole earth as if it was about to divide asunder; and there was exceeding sharp lightnings, [NOT A VOLCANO] such as never had been known in all the land. And the city of Zarahemla did take fire; and the [p. 470] city of Moroni did sink into the depths of the sea, and the inhabitants thereof were drowned; and the earth was carried up upon the city of Moronihah, that in the place of the city thereof, there became a great mountain; and there was a great and terrible destruction in the land southward. But behold, there was a more great and terrible destruction in the land northward: for behold, the whole face of the land was changed, because of the tempest, and the whirlwinds, and the thunderings, and the lightnings, and the exceeding great quaking of the whole earth; and the highways were broken up, and the level roads were spoiled, and many smooth places became rough, and many great and notable cities were sunk, and many were burned, and many were shook till the buildings thereof had fallen to the earth, and the inhabitants thereof were slain, and the places were left desolate; and there were some cities which remained; but the damage thereof was exceeding great, and there were many in them which were slain; and there were some which were carried away in the whirlwind; [NOT A VOLCANO - WHEN DOES THIS HAPPEN IN A VOLCANIC ERUPTION?]and whither they went, no man knoweth, save they know that they were carried away; and thus the face of the whole earth became deformed, because of the tempests, and the thunderings, and the lightnings, and the quaking of the earth. [NOT A VOLCANO - A STORM & EARTHQUAKE] And behold, the rocks were rent in twain; yea, they were broken up upon the face of the whole earth, insomuch that they were found in broken fragments, and in seams, and in cracks, upon all the face of the land.
And it came to pass that when the thunderings, and the lightnings, and the storm, and the tempest, and the quakings of the earth did cease—for behold, they did last for about the space of three hours; and it was said by some that the time was greater; nevertheless, all these great and terrible things were done in about the space of three hours; and then behold, there was darkness upon the face of the land.
And it came to pass that there was thick darkness upon the face of all the land, insomuch that the inhabitants thereof which had not fallen, could feel the vapour of darkness; and there could be no light, because of the darkness, neither candles, neither torches; neither could there be fire kindled with their fine and exceeding dry wood, so that there could not be any light at all; and there was not any light seen, neither fire, nor glimmer, neither the sun, nor the moon, nor the stars, for so great were the mists of darkness which were upon the face of the land. [p. 471]
And it came to pass that it did last for the space of three days, that there was no light seen; and there was great mourning, and howling, and weeping among all the people continually; yea, great were the groanings of the people, because of the darkness and the great destruction which had come upon them. And in one place they were heard to cry, saying: O that we had repented before this great and terrible day, and then would our brethren have been spared, and they would not have been burned in that great city Zarahemla. And in another place they were heard to cry and mourn, saying: O that we had repented before this great and terrible day, and had not killed and stoned the prophets, and cast them out; then would our mothers, and our fair daughters, and our children have been spared, and not have been buried up in that great city Moronihah; and thus were the howlings of the people great and terrible.
And it came to pass that there was a voice heard among all the inhabitants of the earth upon all the face of this land, crying, Wo, wo, wo unto this people; wo unto the inhabitants of the whole earth, except they shall repent, for the Devil laugheth, and his angels rejoice, because of the slain of the fair sons and daughters of my people; and it is because of their iniquity and abominations that they are fallen. Behold, that great city Zarahemla have I burned with fire, and the inhabitants thereof. And behold, that great city Moroni have I caused to be sunk in the depths of the sea, and the inhabitants thereof to be drowned. And behold, that great city Moronihah have I covered with earth, and the inhabitants thereof, to hide their iniquities and their abominations from before my face, that the blood of the prophets and the saints shall not come up any more unto me against them. And behold, the city of Gilgal have I caused to be sunk, and the inhabitants thereof to be buried up in the depths of the earth; yea, and the city Onihah, and the inhabitants thereof, and the city of Mocum, and the inhabitants thereof, and the city of Jerusalem, and the inhabitants thereof, and waters have I caused to come up in the stead thereof, to hide their wickedness and abominations from before my face, that the blood of the prophets and the saints shall not come up any more unto me against them. And behold, the city of Gadiandi, and the city of Gadiomnah, and the city of Jacob, and the city of Gimgimno, all these have I caused to be sunk, and made hills and valleys in the places thereof, and the inhabitants thereof have I buried up in the [p. 472] depths of the earth, to hide their wickedness and abominations from before my face, that the blood of the prophets and the saints should not come up any more unto me against them.— And behold, that great city Jacobugath, which was inhabited by the people of the king of Jacob, have I caused to be burned with fire, because of their sins and their wickedness, which was above all the wickedness of the whole earth, because of their secret murders and combinations: for it was they that did destroy the peace of my people and the government of the land; therefore I did cause them to be burned, to destroy them from before my face, that the blood of the prophets and the saints should not come up unto me any more against them. And behold, the city of Laman, and the city of Josh, and the city of Gad, and the city of Kishkumen, have I caused to be burned with fire, and the inhabitants thereof, because of their wickedness in casting out the prophets, and stoning them which I did send to declare unto them concerning their wickedness and their abominations; and because they did cast them all out, that there were none righteous among them, I did send down fire and destroy them, that their wickedness and abominations might be hid from before my face, that the blood of the prophets and the saints which I sent among them, might not cry unto me from the ground against them; and many great destructions have I caused to come upon this land, and upon this people, because of their wickedness and their abominations.
O all ye that are spared, because ye were more righteous than they! will ye not now return unto me, and repent of your sins, and be converted, that I may heal you? Yea, verily I say unto you, if ye will come unto me, ye shall have eternal life. Behold, mine arm of mercy is extended towards you, and whosoever will come, him will I receive; and blessed are they which cometh unto me. Behold I am Jesus Christ, the Son of God. I created the Heavens and the earth, and all things that in them is. I was with the Father from the beginning. I am in the Father, and the Father in me; and in me hath the Father glorified his name. I came unto my own, and my own received me not. And the scriptures, concerning my coming, are fulfilled. And as many as have received me, to them have I given to become the Sons of God; and even so will I to as many as shall believe on my name: for behold, by me redemption cometh, and in me is the law of Moses fulfilled. I am the light and the life of the world. I [p. 473] am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. And ye shall offer up unto me no more the shedding of blood; yea, your sacrifices and your burnt offerings shall be done away, for I will accept none of your sacrifices and your burnt offerings; and ye shall offer for a sacrifice unto me a broken heart and a contrite spirit. And whoso cometh unto me with a broken heart and a contrite spirit, him will I baptize with fire and with the Holy Ghost, even as the Lamanites, because of their faith in me, at the time of their conversion, were baptized with fire and with the Holy Ghost, and they knew it not. Behold, I have come unto the world to bring redemption unto the world, to save the world from sin; therefore whoso repenteth and cometh unto me as a little child, him will I receive; for of such is the kingdom of God. Behold, for such I have laid down my life, and have taken it up again; therefore repent, and come unto me ye ends of the earth, and be saved.
And now behold it came to pass that all the people of the land did hear these sayings, and did witness of it. And after these sayings there was silence in the land for the space of many hours; for so great was the astonishment of the people that they did cease lamenting and howling for the loss of their kindred which had been slain; therefore there was silence in all the land for the space of many hours.
And it came to pass that there came a voice again unto the people, and all the people did hear, and did witness of it, saying: O ye people of these great cities which have fallen, which are a descendant of Jacob; yea, which are of the house of Israel; O ye people of the house of Israel, how oft have I gathered you as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and have nourished you. And again, how oft would I have gathered you, as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings; yea, O ye people of the house of Israel, which have fallen; yea, O ye people of the house of Israel; ye that dwell at Jerusalem, as ye that have fallen; yea, how oft would I have gathered you as a hen gathereth her chickens, and ye would not. O ye house of Israel, whom I have spared, how oft will I gather you as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, if ye will repent and return unto me with full purpose of heart. But if not, O house of Israel, the places of your dwellings shall become desolate, until the time of the fulfilling of the covenant to your fathers.
And now it came to pass that after the people had heard these words, behold they began to weep and howl again, be [p. 474]cause of the loss of their kindred and friends. And it came to pass that thus did the three days pass away. And it was in the morning, and the darkness dispersed from off the face of the land, and the earth did cease to tremble, and the rocks did cease to rend, and the dreadful groanings did cease, and all the tumultuous noises did pass away, and the earth did cleave together again, that it stood, and the mourning, and the weeping, and the wailing of the people which were spared alive, did cease; and their mourning was turned into joy, and their lamentations into the praise and thanksgiving unto the Lord Jesus Christ, their Redeemer: And thus far were the scriptures fulfilled, which had been spoken by the prophets.— And it was the more righteous part of the people which were saved, and it was they which received the prophets, and stoned them not; and it was they which had not shed the blood of the saints, which were spared; and they were spared, and were not sunk and buried up in the earth; and they were not drowned in the depths of the sea; and they were not burned by fire, neither were they fallen upon and crushed to death; and they were not carried away in the whirl-wind; neither were they overpowered by the vapor of smoke and of darkness. And now whoso readeth, let him understand; he that hath the scriptures, let him search them, and see and behold if all these deaths and destructions by fire, and by smoke, and by tempests, and by whirlwinds, and by the opening of the earth to receive them, and all these things, is not unto the fulfilling of the prophecies of many of the holy prophets. Behold I say unto you yea, many have testified of these things at the coming of Christ, and were slain because they testified of these things; yea, the prophet Zenos did testify of these things, and also Zenock spake concerning these things, because they testified particular concerning us, which is the remnant of their seed. Behold our father Jacob also testified concerning a remnant of the seed of Joseph. And behold, are not we a remnant of the seed of Joseph? And those things which testifies of us, are they not written upon the plates of brass which our father Lehi brought out of Jerusalem? And it came to pass that in the ending of the thirty and fourth year, behold I will shew unto you that the people of Nephi which were spared, and also they which had been called Lamanites, which had been spared, did have great favors shewn unto them, and great blessings poured out upon their heads, insomuch that soon after the ascension of Christ into [p. 475] Heaven, he did truly manifest himself unto them, shewing his body unto them, and ministering unto them; and an account of his ministry shall be given hereafter. Therefore for this time I make an end of my sayings.


This is Smith pilfering the Bible for ideas. He gloms them all together but never mentions any volcanoes or volcanic activity at all. No exploding mountains... but instead makes it all the result of a "great storm" and an earthquake. Where are the pyroclastic flows, the people turned to ash, all the phenomena that volcanoes produce? Volcanic eruptions don't carry people off in the wind. This is so ridiculous that it is just typical of Mopologists. A volcano that only kills the wicked? Nice trick.
Last edited by Guest on Sun Mar 01, 2020 8:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Riding on a speeding train; trapped inside a revolving door;
Lost in the riddle of a quatrain; Stuck in an elevator between floors.
One focal point in a random world can change your direction:
One step where events converge may alter your perception.
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