Holland skewers nuanced believers

[Rivendale]

Holland really doubles down on cafeteria Mormons and reinforces the idea that god stood by and watched as his son died in immense suffering without knowing he was right by his side. This is the most incredible admission of a Mormon leader that god likes or can't prevent horror. https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/bro ... 1?lang=eng At about 58 minutes you can see the gemli prophetic revelation. As soon as they talk about dead bodies coming out of cemeteries they all perk up. So interesting. At time stamp 1:06 holland expresses his real feelings.

[Everybody Wang Chung]

This Jeffrey Holland?

“The Church is growing in such a rate that it is creating Double Digit new Stake creation every week of our lives.”

“We're projecting out probably within four years the base-line number for the missionary force will be something around 100,000."

[Wonhyo]

Jeff Holland is the single biggest leadership factor in my struggle with the church, its history, its often-stupid and often-cultish culture. Some years ago, I believe it was 2015, Holland gave a speech in General Conference about the literalness of the Garden of Eden and the literalness of the fall of Adam and Eve.

Metaphors for rational members be damned.

Ever since then, I've been more able to hone in on his disdain for nuance in one's Mormon beliefs. His contempt for challenges to the correlated narrative is impossible for him to hide. I can't think of any other current member of the Q15 who drips as much sarcasm from such a lofty pedestal as Jeff. In fact, I think he's consciously made it to be his leadership persona.

[Physics Guy]

Even the infantry, which has a permissive rhetorical culture (sagen wir mal), frowns on sarcasm from leaders. Sarcasm from authority is punching down. It’s just not right.

[Gadianton]

Even the infantry, which has a permissive rhetorical culture (sagen wir mal), frowns on sarcasm from leaders. Sarcasm from authority is punching down. It’s just not right.

You may have stumbled upon the single biggest problem DCP has. Sure, many of us are guilty of sarcasm and could tone it down and be better people all around for it. However, most of us aren't in positions of relevant authority to the people we interact with. Back in the day, DCP was the highest ranking gospel authority in the world that the regular member stumbling around online had access to, and he made himself highly accessible. If you ask a question to anybody above your bishop, you'll be shot down and told either to talk to your Bishop or to have faith. And if you go to your Bishop, unless the Bishop is rogue, you'll be told to have faith.

Given FARMS relationship to BYU and BYU to the Church, and given DCP was the boss of all of that and has affirmed his close working relationship to the Brethren in that capacity, he was the guy. And sarcasm is his most fundamental communication style. People coming online for the first time don't know that there have been a thousand others in their shoes before them, and their worries are as very real. Here they can bypass all the red tape, and what do they get? They get DCP shooting them down, trying to make them feel stupid.

[drumdude]

I believe Holland was the general authority that DCP had the best relationship with. They’re two peas in a lying dishonest pod.

[IHAQ]

It seems to me that Holland is inwardly very insecure. To counter that he makes bold, blustering statements (100,000 missionaries etc) and belittles others to build himself up. It's a common trait of insecure leaders.

[Dr. Shades]

It seems to me that Holland is inwardly very insecure. To counter that he makes bold, blustering statements[.]

Hmm. If you're correct, then the possibility exists that his bombastic waving of the Book of Mormon around, saying that Joseph & Hyrum wouldn't have given their lives for it if it wasn't true, etc. was an attempt to convince himself of its truthfulness as opposed to anyone else. . . right?

[IHAQ]

It seems to me that Holland is inwardly very insecure. To counter that he makes bold, blustering statements[.]

Hmm. If you're correct, then the possibility exists that his bombastic waving of the Book of Mormon around, saying that Joseph & Hyrum wouldn't have given their lives for it if it wasn't true, etc. was an attempt to convince himself of its truthfulness as opposed to anyone else. . . right?

Testimonies are, it seems to me, always self serving. They are either trying to convince others that they, the testimony bearer, is special. Or they are trying to talk themselves into believing what they are saying. You see that at a local level as well during Fast & Testimony meeting. Local testimonies are either one of those two things, or an attempt to assuage personal guilt, or a need for attention. The very act of bearing a testimony is ultimately one of self indulgence.

[Dwight]

I don't know when the shift happened, but I used to view Holland's boldness as somewhat refreshing, but at some point it became like IHAQ says, it changed to him appearing to be insecure and pleading for others to believe and reassure him. I guess the cognitive dissonance has got him down.