Why is the Interpreter Foundation Obsessed with Brigham Young?

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Doctor Scratch
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Why is the Interpreter Foundation Obsessed with Brigham Young?

Post by Doctor Scratch »

On the thread concerning BY's erotic dream, Dean Robbers posed some important questions:
Doctor Robbers wrote:I guess I thought Six Days was a one-off thing. I suppose the Netflix series was a good excuse to stir up righteous indignation. But hasn't everyone forgotten about that? Was there a trip to London recently? Did that have anything to do with Brigham?

Do you think he will write a book about Brigham and publish it?

Do you think that the Afore and the Brethren have had secret meetings to discuss Brigham?

Is this more of an internal or external thing?

Here's where I'm going with this. it seems like an excuse to fund Interpreter. Look, the world is attacking Brigham! We're the last defense! Easy to explain.

But, the internal dynamics could be more interesting. Conservative and liberal Mormons have both had issues with Brigham. Denver Snuffer basically said the whole thing ends with Joseph. That current has pulled the typical conservative Mormon even deeper into Smith worship and ignored Brigham. And then I'd imagine the new MI and liberal scholars are uncomfortable with Brigham for all the authoritarian stuff. So if Interpreter can launch a new purity test, whereby members are vetted based on their testimonies of Brigham, and given Interpreter controls the talking points, then they are back in the saddle, holding the salvation of every member in their hands.

what do you think the whole thing might be about?
These are some fascinating inquiries, and I felt that they merited a more in-depth response, and a thread of their own. Indeed: What the heck is up with Interpreter's fixation on Brigham Young? For many years, it seemed that the Interpreter Powers That Be really only cared about Joseph Smith and the Witnesses, but at some point, there was something of a "pivot" to what now seems like a full-blown obsession with Brigham Young. So, what's up with this?

To address the Dean's specific questions:

--No, there will be no book. Only movies.

--Yes: I do think it's possible that there were secret meetings, though I think it's more likely that these clandestine meetings were kept within the "inner circle" of Interpreter. What I mean to say is: I think it's more likely that Interpreter's motives with these BY projects is very likely in defiance of the Brethren's preferences. To be clear: I don't mean to suggest that I think that Becoming BY or 6DIA are meant as a direct "middle finger" to the General Authorities or anything like that. Rather, I think that Interpreter's leadership has decided that they are going to pursue these BY projects, and they do not care what anyone thinks or says.

--Is it "internal" or "external"? Which I interpret to mean: Is this about satisfying some inner psychological need on the part of the Afore? Or is this a more calculated move aimed at maintaining Interpreter's status in the hierarchy of Mopologetics? Well, my answer is, by necessity, speculative, but I would think that the appropriate answer here is "both." As I noted in a previous response, I could see this being a kind of vicarious "rehab" effort. DCP believes that *he* has been "unfairly" maligned by critics, and so no he's going to try and achieve a sort of "by proxy" redemption by resuscitating BY's problematic reputation. And the goal, I guess, is to accomplish this via these heavily whitewashed short films.

But you raise an important point about audience. The problem with BY's reputation is that he is strongly disliked both within and outside the Church. Both groups can point to all kinds of problematic things: his authoritarianism; his polygamy; his attitudes towards race; his battles with the US government; his ordering up of extreme punishments, such as castrations; and so on. Meanwhile, there are his various embarrassing doctrinal teachings, such as the thing about people living on the sun, or the Adam-God doctrine (which the Afore himself has said is a "false doctrine"!), or the bit about Heavenly Father having physical sex with Mary.

So, is this a kind of "power-grab," then, with Interpreter trying to establish a "litmus test" of sorts, that they can use to continue waging war on Chapel Mormons, and, arguably, liberal/progressive Mormons? I think that this is a very insightful reading of the situation. I think the reality of the situation is likely multi-layered. I do think there is some element of the psychological "vicarious rehabbing the reputation" thing going on. I also think there is a bit of just base selfishness: this is another project that can be pointed to as a reason for dodging a senior mission.

But it may be that your political reading has even more merit. We have observed in the not-too-distant past that Interpreter was getting left in the dust by FAIR And Scripture Central. Can Interpreter seize a bigger slice of the pie by cornering the market on BY material? To me, this seems like a risky move, but it will be interesting to see how it plays out. Meanwhile, I think we also have to think about the sheer glee the Interpreter Mopologists have expressed about the re-taking of the Kirtland Temple from the CoC. I mean, the gloating and chest-thumping was over-the-top, even for them. And since BY is the primary figure who separates Utah Mormonism from the CoC, it would seem to be a part of this gloating. Mopologetics cannot exist without enemies, schadenfreude, inflicting pain on others, and general bullying, so this could be a key aspect of the project(s) as well.

In any case, this is an evolving situation, so it will be interesting to see what happens next. I, for one, am interested in seeing the extent to which they scrub out all the problematic aspects of BY's past from the films. I'm going to bet right now that the bit about HF physically going to "pound town" with Mary is not going to make it into the movies. I defy the Mopologists to prove me wrong.
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Re: Why is the Interpreter Foundation Obsessed with Brigham Young?

Post by Ego »

Perhaps the good fellows at the Interpreter realized that defending Mr. Smith alone was insufficient to adequately defend the Brighamite branch of Mormonism as the only true one.
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Re: Why is the Interpreter Foundation Obsessed with Brigham Young?

Post by Physics Guy »

If Mormonism were a film playing in an old-time movie theatre, Joseph Smith would be the name up in lights on the billboard; in small text below there would be "with Brigham Young". Everyone else is just fine print in the closing credits. So if you figure that there has already been enough invested in trying to defend Joseph Smith, then Brigham Young is the obvious next job. And who else needs defending?

No critics attack anyone else. I don't even think any Mormons care about anyone else. The other Mormon leaders have all just been a bunch of old guys, and the only reason anyone has ever offered, for why anyone should care about any of them, is that they are supposed to be the legitimate successors of Joseph Smith and Brigham Young.

So I don't think it takes any perversity for the Interpreter Foundation to be interested in Young. Shifting some attention away from Smith, to focus it on Young, is even a kind of implicit defence of Smith. Not saying anything much about Young, and only defending Smith, would be an admission that Smith's status is precarious.

I also have an impression that even though Smith wrote the Mormon scriptures, Mormon culture was really defined by Brigham Young. Mormons have to think about Smith a lot because he started it all, but I have the feeling that the farmhand prophet who hid his polygamy and got killed by a mob just isn't really the kind of hero that Mormons want to see on the screen. They don't want to say it, but Smith was kind of a wimp. Brother Brigham took charge. He rode the range. He died rich. He had his zillion wives openly. Brigham Young was the man! If I were a Mormon apologist, I think I might have been defending Joseph out of duty, but inside I'd have been itching to talk about Brigham instead.
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Re: Why is the Interpreter Foundation Obsessed with Brigham Young?

Post by I Have Questions »

As I’ve understood the process, Peterson wanted to make a film about C. S. Lewis. But it had already been done. He didn’t have any other good ideas for a second film. And he REALLY wanted a second film to show he could be a successful movie maker. So the production team (who also really wanted a second load of Interpreter money) scrabbled round and pitched the idea of Brigham Young. Reluctantly, and void of anything better as a suggestion, Peterson went with that.

So it was an off the cuff topic purely for the purposes of providing an excuse for a second film. And it was an absolute disaster. Now, they are throwing good money after bad to avoid accepting that it was a really bad idea, very badly executed. It’s the old sunk costs thing.
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Re: Why is the Interpreter Foundation Obsessed with Brigham Young?

Post by Gadianton »

Some great thoughts, this stood out in particular:
I also think there is a bit of just base selfishness: this is another project that can be pointed to as a reason for dodging a senior mission.
Right, if it's an important work deemed at the level of Steve Young's as a football star, then as the story I heard has it, a mission can be avoided for "the greater good". If Brigham Young's legacy is that important, then perhaps that could justify evasion of a senior's mission. That would explain why a "book" is off the table, it would require actual sacrifice. The ties to the Brigham projects are managerial and promotional, and can be worked around vacationing and eating.

There is one way in which this could backfire dramatically, and if anyone as access to a general authority, it should be suggested. Suppose the Church caught wind of the Brigham efforts and became convinced that the Church needs more Brigham celebration? They could call him to a senior's mission running an official Brigham Young biography program as a service mission. The catch would be he'd run this from SLC, and not allowed to travel elsewhere for the 2 years.

I wonder if this has been anticipated? If so, that could explain why a project as a whole, or the details of the project, have been carefully engineered as abrasive to the Brethren, but not totally apostate. He's got the Brethren checked: they can't punish him for apostasy, but they can't officially use him either. He's getting away with it at the Brethren's expense, it would seem, as if he's brandishing a bumper sticker on his car that says, "Consecration is for other people."
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Re: Why is the Interpreter Foundation Obsessed with Brigham Young?

Post by Ego »

Gadianton wrote:
Sat Jun 07, 2025 2:57 pm
There is one way in which this could backfire dramatically, and if anyone as access to a general authority, it should be suggested. Suppose the Church caught wind of the Brigham efforts and became convinced that the Church needs more Brigham celebration? They could call him to a senior's mission running an official Brigham Young biography program as a service mission. The catch would be he'd run this from SLC, and not allowed to travel elsewhere for the 2 years.
‘Brigham Young Papers’ after Wilford Woodruff perhaps?
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Re: Why is the Interpreter Foundation Obsessed with Brigham Young?

Post by Everybody Wang Chung »

All this attention the Interpreter Foundation is bringing to Brigham is not good for the Church. This will just cause more members to do their own research on Brigham, inevitably leading them to find out what a horrible person he really was.

It's obvious why the Afore is enamored/obsessed with Brigham, they are kindred spirits. One person is a ruthless dictator without a moral compass or anything to keep him in check, and if you can think of an evil or despicable deed, odds are he did it. The other person is Brigham Young.
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Re: Why is the Interpreter Foundation Obsessed with Brigham Young?

Post by huckelberry »

Interest in Brigham Young should be obvious and natural as Physics Guy explained. Obviously more interesting than the fifth president whom I would have to look up to have a name for.

I find myself puzzled as to why it is of interest who decides to go on a senior mission. Perhaps I underestimate the degree to which authority has been usurping free agency in Mormon expectations. An evolution has been taking place.
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Re: Why is the Interpreter Foundation Obsessed with Brigham Young?

Post by Doctor Scratch »

Physics Guy wrote:
Sat Jun 07, 2025 8:44 am
So I don't think it takes any perversity for the Interpreter Foundation to be interested in Young. Shifting some attention away from Smith, to focus it on Young, is even a kind of implicit defence of Smith. Not saying anything much about Young, and only defending Smith, would be an admission that Smith's status is precarious.
Some good and interesting points here. I suppose I would argue that defending Young is at least partly an attempt to discredit other claimants in the so-called "succession crisis" (especially Joseph Smith III).
I also have an impression that even though Smith wrote the Mormon scriptures, Mormon culture was really defined by Brigham Young. Mormons have to think about Smith a lot because he started it all, but I have the feeling that the farmhand prophet who hid his polygamy and got killed by a mob just isn't really the kind of hero that Mormons want to see on the screen. They don't want to say it, but Smith was kind of a wimp. Brother Brigham took charge. He rode the range. He died rich. He had his zillion wives openly. Brigham Young was the man! If I were a Mormon apologist, I think I might have been defending Joseph out of duty, but inside I'd have been itching to talk about Brigham instead.
These are also good points, though part of the problem, as I see it, is that Interpreter is not embracing the version of BY that you're describing. Instead, he is a well-scrubbed, whitewashed version who's all bummed out and morose about the death of his first wife, and he has a bizarre "homosocial" fixation on Joseph Smith. He's not the kick-ass manipulative frontier leader that you are describing. He's something else: a blond, Aryan-looking person who seems like he's all set to serve as Homecoming Prince at some Provo / Orem high school--all flowing hair and non-threatening charm.

And yet, when you realize this is coming from the Mopologists, it *is* very bizarre. Like you, I think that they'd gravitate more towards the violent, whip-cracking version of Brigham who was utterly autocratic and who took no prisoners--the BY who said, "Vengeance is mine, and I have taken a little." The fact that their version seems so toned-down is the reason why I think they are up to something vis-a-vis the Brethren.
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Re: Why is the Interpreter Foundation Obsessed with Brigham Young?

Post by Doctor Scratch »

Gadianton wrote:
Sat Jun 07, 2025 2:57 pm
I wonder if this has been anticipated? If so, that could explain why a project as a whole, or the details of the project, have been carefully engineered as abrasive to the Brethren, but not totally apostate. He's got the Brethren checked: they can't punish him for apostasy, but they can't officially use him either. He's getting away with it at the Brethren's expense, it would seem, as if he's brandishing a bumper sticker on his car that says, "Consecration is for other people."
Exactly. It's worth remembering that, by being employed by BYU, it's sort of like an "end-around" in terms of paying tithing. Or, to put it another way: I don't think there is a shot in hell that the Afore would be devoted to the Church merely because "it's true." His attitude towards Mormonism is 100% transactional: he expects to get something in return.
"If, while hoping that everybody else will be honest and so forth, I can personally prosper through unethical and immoral acts without being detected and without risk, why should I not?." --Daniel Peterson, 6/4/14
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