Is your house in order?

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Xenophon
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Is your house in order?

Post by Xenophon »

I'm on the tail end of cleaning up the estate for my father and in simplest terms, it was an absolute cluster-fudge. His passing was not completely out of the blue but certainly much sooner than any of us really expected. I love him dearly, but my father was not a man of planning or discipline, and he left behind a tangled mess that has proved a challenge to sort. An outdated will (locked in a safe his own wife couldn't access), failure to update address for previous pensions/401k/insurance, failure to update beneficiaries, and decades long hoarding of goods that needed to be accounted for, sorted, and dealt with. Couple all that with no written instructions on what to do for his funeral apart from what I had effectively forced him to talk to me about and what you're left with is a seemingly impossible amount of work during an obviously very intense grieving process.

It was an eye-opening experience to me for sure. For one, it was the closest death to me where I was also in the position of having to manage most of the work. My mom passed too young for me to have been engaged in the process or remember it even if I had. And the passing of other close relatives came with support and guidance from other family and although I was a big part of some of those there was both the presence of a plan and many hands to help. Secondly I realized I'd obviously not done enough preparation for myself, SO and I have our will in place with a few contingency plans based on who goes first and when (or if we're together) but I certainly hadn't written out in great detail the kinds of things I wanted done with my body, what the service should look like, or how we were to pay for it all. I hadn't written out things like, what should happen to our pets (fortunately the kids are old enough to manage themselves now :lol: ) or identified those things in our home that are family heirlooms or valuable collectibles. I had an organized filing cabinet and some extra special instructions in a fireproof safe but outside of my SO I also hadn't prepared anyone on how to access it and use it.

Fortunately I had a little guide to help me. My sister had purchased my father a copy of I'm Dead. Now What? that is a workbook for helping you put all this information in once place. Much to my dismay Dad had only filled out the first page with his name and contact information, but I was at least able to use it to build my own guidebook for those left after I'm gone. The hardback copy was nice and I'm sure you could find a ton of other similar resources, I personally preferred to create a digital copy to go with the paper to make it easier to access all the appropriate sites for things like our mortgage, insurance, retirement, etc..

I think it is easy to think to ourselves "my loved ones know me and what I want" but I don't think it is too mean to suggest this is a selfish mindset. I also think I was naïve in not pushing these topics more. Maybe everyone here already had it all planned out, but I thought my latest experience might be a good wake-up call for others, even if it is just to go back and check there isn't anything you need to update. I'd also be interested to hear if anyone has anything particular they’ve done (or seen done by others) on this front to make the process easier for those that are left behind.
He/Him

“If you consider what are called the virtues in mankind, you will find their growth is assisted by education and cultivation.”
― Xenophon
Marcus
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Re: Is your house in order?

Post by Marcus »

I am with you on this. My SO's very close and very young sibling passed suddenly, and there was nothing in place. Making such urgent decisions while grieving the loss is overwhelmingly difficult.
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ceeboo
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Re: Is your house in order?

Post by ceeboo »

Hi X-Man

So sorry to hear of your loss.
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Jersey Girl
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Re: Is your house in order?

Post by Jersey Girl »

Xeno I'm so sorry to hear of your Dad's passing. It doesn't matter how old we are, the death of our parents is a loss like no other. I'll save what all else I want to address for later. Heart first, business later. So, so, sorry, Xeno.
We only get stronger when we are lifting something that is heavier than what we are used to. ~ KF

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Xenophon
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Re: Is your house in order?

Post by Xenophon »

Marcus wrote:
Mon Jul 24, 2023 8:29 pm
I am with you on this. My SO's very close and very young sibling passed suddenly, and there was nothing in place. Making such urgent decisions while grieving the loss is overwhelmingly difficult.
That is awful and I'm very sorry for your and your SO's loss.

As I've brought up my own issues and personal crusade against being unprepared in other circles I've heard so many similar stories. I consider myself very lucky that I am at least on great terms with his spouse and there wasn't that much to comb through. I can't even imagine if you injected things like competing interests from beneficiaries or guardianship of children into the equation.
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“If you consider what are called the virtues in mankind, you will find their growth is assisted by education and cultivation.”
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Re: Is your house in order?

Post by Jersey Girl »

So in response to the business end of the OP, our house is mostly in order but we're not "there" yet. We started out with literal nothing and now our estate involves serious value. I'll leave it at that. I didn't know how easy I had it when my mom died being an only child. I did all the real estate stuff long distance with the help of an attorney and the Boy's relatives took care of her personal belongings, sending some to me. I was single parenting a newborn and 4 year old in the PCNW. Ma, who was living with us to be my birth coach, died three weeks before I had the baby, the Boy was on a remote tour, and everything happened during that time. That's when I developed situational depression but I coped the best way I could. Anyway, it wasn't all that a complicated because I was the only one making decisions.

Here's another issue we have dealt with. When a wealthy relative passed away, she bequeathed a substantial amount of money to two of four siblings, and stuck it to the younger two. Without naming numbers, let's say it was akin to two siblings inheriting 100K and the other 2 inheriting 10 bucks. That's how bad the disparity was. This resulted in a family rift that lasted about 20 years with siblings not speaking to each other. We understand why she did it. The older two were and remain responsible adults. The younger two, not even close. I doubt she considered that these weren't her children and that her decisions would split the family down the middle. But that's exactly what happened and it was terrible. Our kids lost their aunt and uncle for 20 years. Can you imagine? People who want to do a similar thing and deliver a slap in the face need to remember that if you're going to stick it to some, you're going to end up sticking it to everyone else and blow up a family because the one's that got the slap will take it out on the rest.

Today...

Stuff

I've purged most everything accumulated over the years that I could on my own. I got really good at it, too, and it's freeing! It took years for the Boy to get on the same page because he's accumulated way too much inventory devoted to "just in case", but he's coming along if at a snails pace. Got rid of two vehicles and when I went to do thrift store drop offs, he started by handing me one book. Then more and more things. When I read your comment about your Dad's belongings...pretty much the same mindset and approach, and it's not fair to the children involved who have to go through everything as it is. If personal belongings are in a state of disorder, they shouldn't have to go through that and compound the situation they are faced with. I'm still working on a few categories myself and then...I have to compel him to rip the band aid off of what's left.

Funeral and/or celebration of life

He wants his funeral to be at his church. Casket and burial. VA will take care of some of that. He's done no personalized planning with regard to service. If he can't do it, I can do it. I am planning my own funeral service. This may sound crazy but I want the service to reflect me, my life, and who I have been. I want to make people cry. I want them to cry from their gut. I've got the songs and hymns mainly chosen and scripture. I just need to dig up a piper and I'm good. When my mother died she was cremated and there was no way I could have a service for her. Don't get me started on what the relatives said from back home! I want to share my service with her. I'll be cremated and where I previously wanted my ashes scattered with hers, I want to have a grave with a headstone and share it with Ma. I still don't know if I can be buried where the Boy will. That's the current status and I might go back to the scattering idea where the kids can visit a place of natural solitude and reflect.


Lawyerish things


I spoke at length with an attorney to figure out what our options are. For the sake of simplicity, let's say our estate is comprised of three piles. One money, two is the house, three is the personal property, furniture, vehicles and sort of thing is also part of the package. The money part is easy. Here is where it gets complicated. We have 2 kids who previously would have taken care of two and three together. Today we are not so sure. Not discussing the reason here.

Attorney said that we can appoint a third party to sell the house and also our belongings. Where does that leave the personal things that our kids might want? I don't expect them to want my style of anything. I'm talking about family items. This C'mas I am gifting them each a family heirloom piece of jewelry so I can get those out of the way. Who gets our wedding rings? My engagement ring? Does anyone want my collected art work? Do we just have a third party estate sale company sell off every little thing and leave an empty house? Do we want to put our kids in a situation where they have to work and grieve together? I don't want our kids cussing us out. I want them crying their baby eyes out in the pillow every night for grief's sake.

Right now we aren't in a situation where we can call a family meeting. We are seriously at a stand still over this right now and we're burning daylight over here.

As to the situation where one of us dies first. Everything pretty much relies on the key to our safe deposit box. It's a big one and has various documents stored in it. That part is easy. The above part that I wrote about, not so much. If I die first, he's ready to go forward. If he dies first, I am likewise ready to go forward. That much is in place. All I can say at this writing is that I hope I live long enough to finish the job we've started and get things settled in a way that is fair and equitable and makes sense to us.

We're not dragging our feet. We both want to have this done. It's just that there are complications and hurdles to jump. Like how do you decide this stuff? It's not the big things so much as it's the little things. Like the rings.

So yeah, there's my life on a public forum. I don't even care any more who reads it. :lol:
Last edited by Jersey Girl on Mon Jul 24, 2023 11:58 pm, edited 4 times in total.
We only get stronger when we are lifting something that is heavier than what we are used to. ~ KF

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Xenophon
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Re: Is your house in order?

Post by Xenophon »

ceeboo wrote:
Mon Jul 24, 2023 8:43 pm
Hi X-Man

So sorry to hear of your loss.
Jersey Girl wrote:
Mon Jul 24, 2023 9:03 pm
Xeno I'm so sorry to hear of your Dad's passing. It doesn't matter how old we are, the death of our parents is a loss like no other. I'll save what all else I want to address for later. Heart first, business later. So, so, sorry, Xeno.
Thank you both for your kinds words. You're spot on Jersey it was much more than I was really prepared for it to be. I'm just glad I've got a few more tools in the kit for sorting through and dealing with it than I did for my mother's passing.
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“If you consider what are called the virtues in mankind, you will find their growth is assisted by education and cultivation.”
― Xenophon
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Re: Is your house in order?

Post by Jersey Girl »

Xeno what I learned when my Ma died was that I lost the one person in my life that I could always count on to love me no matter what and who loved me like no one else did or has since. That is not a cut on the Boy. It's simply the truth in a way that is difficult to articulate.
We only get stronger when we are lifting something that is heavier than what we are used to. ~ KF

Slava Ukraini!
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Re: Is your house in order?

Post by Marcus »

Xenophon wrote:
Mon Jul 24, 2023 11:46 pm
Marcus wrote:
Mon Jul 24, 2023 8:29 pm
I am with you on this. My SO's very close and very young sibling passed suddenly, and there was nothing in place. Making such urgent decisions while grieving the loss is overwhelmingly difficult.
That is awful and I'm very sorry for your and your SO's loss.

As I've brought up my own issues and personal crusade against being unprepared in other circles I've heard so many similar stories. I consider myself very lucky that I am at least on great terms with his spouse and there wasn't that much to comb through. I can't even imagine if you injected things like competing interests from beneficiaries or guardianship of children into the equation.
Thank you, and i extend my sympathies for your loss also. We were also on very good terms with my SO's siblings ex, so that wasn't the issue, but a very difficult additional issue was that my SO was the health proxy because his sibling had no living will, and he had to make the final decision to remove life support. Tbat was an agonizing time.
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Re: Is your house in order?

Post by Gadianton »

Glad you got through it, Xen.
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