Right Wing Violence - Media not accountable

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_EAllusion
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Re: Right Wing Violence - Media not accountable

Post by _EAllusion »

The claim Kevin cited is widely reported enough that if you are reasonably news literate, you were familiar with it. You can find it a variety of major news sources. It's not something he made up. The legitimate counter-objection to the claim that there is a significant upswing in hate crimes is that there may indeed be a selection effect due to reporter biases. If you dig a little deeper than the headlines, though, it's not as though this hasn't been considered by people and is generally presented in the context of many lines of evidence suggesting an increase in racism-related aggression. Take it for what you will.

hard Left looney tunes


Not often you see the FBI described as the looney tunes "hard left." Of course, in a world where everything you disagree with is the far left and you hold a whole range of ridiculous views spanning the political spectrum, then I guess anything can be the "hard left" can't it?

Doc, you might want to consider that listing your points just to note how poorly thought out they are is not the same thing as agreeing with what you are disagreeing with.
_EAllusion
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Re: Right Wing Violence - Media not accountable

Post by _EAllusion »

Kevin - Three historically black Churches have burned in Louisiana in the past 2 weeks. That seems fishy.

Doc - Oh yeah. Do you have data on how often Churches start on fire? What about other buildings that have burned? Have you talked about those? Have you considered the possibility that black Churches are made of especially flammable materials? Have you visited these sites yourself, or are you relying on the leftist media to tell you this happened? Huh! Huh!

EA: That seems stupid Doc.

Doc: There you go again defending your radical leftist nonsense, EA.
_Doctor CamNC4Me
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Re: Right Wing Violence - Media not accountable

Post by _Doctor CamNC4Me »

Once again we see EA turn to his usual tactic of creating a lie, argue with himself, and then declare victory. You'd think he'd get a new shtick, but what are ya gonna do when someone didn't even bother to open canpakes document? Doubling down on idiocy seems to be the order of the day around here. Sigh...

- Doc
In the face of madness, rationality has no power - Xiao Wang, US historiographer, 2287 AD.

Every record...falsified, every book rewritten...every statue...has been renamed or torn down, every date...altered...the process is continuing...minute by minute. History has stopped. Nothing exists except an endless present in which the Ideology is always right.
_subgenius
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Re: Right Wing Violence - Media not accountable

Post by _subgenius »

EAllusion wrote:Image
Seek freedom and become captive of your desires...seek discipline and find your liberty
I can tell if a person is judgmental just by looking at them
what is chaos to the fly is normal to the spider - morticia addams
If you're not upsetting idiots, you might be an idiot. - Ted Nugent
_EAllusion
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Re: Right Wing Violence - Media not accountable

Post by _EAllusion »

Doctor CamNC4Me wrote:Once again we see EAllusion turn to his usual tactic of creating a lie, argue with himself, and then declare victory. You'd think he'd get a new shtick, but what are ya gonna do when someone didn't even bother to open canpakes document? Doubling down on idiocy seems to be the order of the day around here. Sigh...

- Doc


Let's see. Kevin says, " The bureau reported a 17 percent increase in hate crimes in 2017 over the previous year, and more than half were motivated by biases based on race, ethnicity or ancestry. In California alone, hate crimes against Latinos have increased by more than 50 percent since 2016. - https://www.npr.org/2018/07/15/62921297 ... california"

You reply to this quote with - "Could they be attributed to increased reporting? An increase in Hispanic/Latino populations? What are the hard numbers, and how do they compare with Hispanics and Latinos perpetrating crimes against other etnicities?"

I characterize these objections as you arguing that the increase could be attributed to a comparable increase in the Latino population, that a large selection effect may be happening due to reporter bias, and asking for an irrelevant comparison to Hispanic crimes against other ethnicities. That's plainly what is being said here, but you call it lying because lying about lying is your one weird trick that you think makes you look clever.

Later on a literal white supremacist posting here says, "And who collects and counts these numbers? How do you know they haven't made of up the data with a conclusion in mind that fits what whoever is paying for the study wants to hear?"

Crime statistics have been skewed for years because Hispanics are in fact counted as white when they do something criminal."

You favorably quote him by saying, "That's actually a really good question, Ajax. We really don't know how the NPR's statistics were gathered for that particular interview, nor does KG do a good job of providing hard data. He just jumps at the chance, after a cursory Google search, to reiterate an assertion made by people who have a clear ideological and political ax to grind.

Let's say someone, and I'm not saying which prolific Liberal poster here this applies to, was shot at by his Latina wife's jilted lover, who is also Latino, would this be classified as a hate crime because he's White? Was the data collected and added to a database that aggregates hate crimes against White men like himself?"


I characterize this as, "3a) Ajax has a point that there very likely is a racist bias against whites in FBI statistics causing a systematic labeling of crimes committed by Hispanics to be categorized as crimes committed by white people.

3b) In fact, categorization of crimes as hate crimes is so unreliable that for all we know, any crime committed by a person presumed to be white against a person presumed to be non-white could be categorized as a hate crime. So maybe the reported increase in reported hate crimes is just a spike in Latino on Latino violence."


Granted, this is me doing a little work to craft a coherent point out of the racist conspiracy mongering you are having fun with, but it's as clean a reading of that nonsense as is possible.
_Doctor CamNC4Me
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Re: Right Wing Violence - Media not accountable

Post by _Doctor CamNC4Me »

So, let's take a closer look at KG's second quickly googled hit resulting in the openly and notoriously Leftist Southern Poverty Law Center's hate group assertion that hate groups and hate itself is increasing under President Trump's stewardship.

First, a Conservative take on the SPLC itself:

https://c-fam.org/home/the-truth-about-splc/

The Truth About SPLC


The Southern Poverty Law Center has created a list of its adversaries which it calls “hate groups.” This list includes champions of marriage and the family, including our name and those of some of our UN pro-life and pro-family coalition members.

Unfortunately, this false moniker has been wielded by those who oppose the natural family and marriage to scare government officials away from working with us and deter those who would support our work from funding us and others.

The real purpose of this list is to silence opponents, to isolate them. It is a kind of weaponized political correctness. It is also about raising money for the Southern Poverty Law Center, which has more than $300 million dollars in the bank and rakes in more than $50 million every year.

The SPLC and its allies are getting away with this scare tactic in part because they hide behind the perception that they are a human rights organization that champions fairness and American values.

This is false.

C-Fam’s core mission is truth telling, and we believe that the truth about SPLC should be known so that people of good faith can make up their own mind about SPLC scare tactics and put an end to them.

The good news is that many are waking up to the Southern Poverty Law Center. The FBI used to partner with them in identifying hate groups. They no longer do. The Army used to have them lecture on domestic terrorism. The Army has ended that relationship.

Below you will find a powerful video exposing the Southern Poverty Law Center and their stated goal of destroying their political opponents. You will also find many essays and articles about this nefarious group, including articles from left-wing groups who are also concerned about the tactics of the Southern Poverty Law Center.


The video is worth a looksie. Additionally, the SPLC is rife with internalized misogyny as evidenced by:

https://nypost.com/2019/03/14/a-shockin ... aw-center/

tl;dr - The SPLC is corrupt, and has went from an organization focused on calling White hate groups and focusing on voting rights to an org that labels anything Conservative as a hategroup.

Sure, they do a good job at tracking white supremacists and whatnot, but does their keen eye for finding hate and hateful rhetoric extend to academia? Why not list universities that encourage open misandry through their women's studies programs? Does the SPLC focus on the genesis of crimes committed against Whites by Hispanics, Blacks, and other ethnicities or is it always the fault of White people that White people are victims of crimes committed at higher rates by percentage toward them by ethnicities and non-European races than the other way around? What could possibly be their motivation to always present their findings that overreprsent small retarded White supremacist groups while consistently ignoring or minimizing various other groups?

The Family Research Council says this about the SPLC:

https://www.frc.org/issuebrief/the-sout ... ate-groups

What does the SPLC consider a "hate group?"

Logically, a "hate group" should be defined as one whose members 1) actually say that they hate a particular group of people; and/or 2) engage in or condone violence or other illegal activity toward such a group.

The SPLC, however, uses much broader criteria for defining "hate groups," and criteria which can vary depending on which of fourteen categories of "hate groups" you are looking at-ranging from "Neo-Nazi" to "Black Separatist" to "Radical Traditional Catholicism." These criteria are entirely subjective and largely ideological.[9]

While their rhetoric ties "hate groups" with actual "hate crimes,"[10] the SPLC acknowledges alleged "hate group" activities include constitutionally protected activities such as "marches, rallies, speeches, meetings, leafleting or publishing," and that the "hate group" designation "does not imply a group advocates or engages in violence or other criminal activity."[11] However, they do not distinguish between racist or violent groups and legitimate organizations that participate peacefully in the political process-tarring all with the same label.

As genuine "hate groups" such as the Ku Klux Klan have dwindled, the SPLC has broadened its target list in order to justify its continued existence. In recent years, whole categories and new groups have been added not because of actual "hate" activities, but because they hold conservative positions on controversial political issues such as immigration[12] and homosexuality.[13]

The SPLC claims that the number of "hate groups" in America increased by a staggering 66% from 2000 to 2010.[14] Yet this is only as a result of their own expanding definition of what constitutes a "hate group." Actual hate crimes, as measured by the FBI, fell nearly 25% between 1996[15] and 2009.[16]
The SPLC's Mark Potok has publicy confessed that there is "an element of hypocrisy" in the SPLC attacking conservative groups while remaining silent about liberal groups that use "exactly the same kind of tactics."[17]

A liberal writer in The Humanist said, "The SPLC campaigns for laws that will effectively deny free speech and freedom of association to certain groups of Americans on the basis of their beliefs. . . . [T]hen, with no discernible irony, it goes on to justify its Big Brother methods in the name of tolerance."[18]


Tbf, the most hate and consistently hatefulness I see on this board comes from Leftists. If their worldview, and resulting paranoia about Conservatives, is any indicator I would have to guess that their ideology breeds the most extremism and hate that's obvious to anyone who isn't a dullard (which is why they're probably blind to their own behavior).

- Doc
Last edited by Guest on Thu Apr 11, 2019 4:33 am, edited 3 times in total.
In the face of madness, rationality has no power - Xiao Wang, US historiographer, 2287 AD.

Every record...falsified, every book rewritten...every statue...has been renamed or torn down, every date...altered...the process is continuing...minute by minute. History has stopped. Nothing exists except an endless present in which the Ideology is always right.
_Doctor CamNC4Me
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Re: Right Wing Violence - Media not accountable

Post by _Doctor CamNC4Me »

Here's a good example of Leftist looney tune'ism:

Image

Liberals:

We live in the most peaceful time of human existence. Crime rates are down across the board!

Also Leftists:

hAt3 iS @ an 4ll tImE HiGh!

- Doc
In the face of madness, rationality has no power - Xiao Wang, US historiographer, 2287 AD.

Every record...falsified, every book rewritten...every statue...has been renamed or torn down, every date...altered...the process is continuing...minute by minute. History has stopped. Nothing exists except an endless present in which the Ideology is always right.
_EAllusion
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Re: Right Wing Violence - Media not accountable

Post by _EAllusion »

Anti-gay oraganizations that promote bigotry towards homosexuals do not like being labeled hate groups by the SPLC; therefore, Kevin’s citation of the SPLC regarding hate crime trends is suspect because...
_EAllusion
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Re: Right Wing Violence - Media not accountable

Post by _EAllusion »

Doctor CamNC4Me wrote:
Liberals:

We live in the most peaceful time of human existence. Crime rates are down across the board!

Also Leftists:

hAt3 iS @ an 4ll tImE HiGh!

- Doc


Not even attempting a cursory distinction between liberals and leftists I see. Anyway, I don't see anyone in this thread claiming that "hate is at an all time high." For someone who complains about strawman arguments in what I'm sure is total good faith honesty, that's strange. Nor do I see anyone here claiming that all crimes rates are down across the board. Once you dispel these naïve positions that exist in your mind, one is free to argue that it is both the case that crime (and violent crime in particular) is at a relative low point in American history while also claiming that crime motivated by racial or protected-class based bigtory has seen a recent uptick since the rise of the alt-right spearheaded by the political success of Donald Trump. There's nothing inconsistent about that.
_ajax18
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Re: Right Wing Violence - Media not accountable

Post by _ajax18 »

while also claiming that crime motivated by racial or protected-class based bigtory


that's a funny term "protected class," I suppose in your mind if you're assaulting a white male just because you need the money that's not nearly as bad as assaulting someone who happens to be a member of the protected class of people. What a screwed up legal/ethical system we live under! It's funny to think all this started as a movement for "equality."
And when the confederates saw Jackson standing fearless as a stone wall the army of Northern Virginia took courage and drove the federal army off their land.
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