DiscussMormonism.com

So I’m not really that worked up about this bill. It seems like a publicity stunt more than anything else. How much time is spent teaching LGBTQ+ stuff to third graders anyway? If there is anything to be upset about here, it is that we see our elected officials wasting time on stunts like these—proposing them or arguing against them.

It's the typical GOP playbook. Waste time talking about non-issues to distract the base from the fact that they do nothing to actually make American lives better, unless you have a 10-figure income.

DeSantis is just as much of a lying piece of crap as Trump, just not as stupid about it. It's little wonder the asshole demographic loves him.

Kishkumen wrote: ↑

Sun Apr 03, 2022 1:53 am

How much time is spent teaching LGBTQ+ stuff to third graders anyway?

What I told my kids at that age, and what they absorbed from people they encountered at school was the unastounding fact that different kids have different kinds of families.

- A lot of kids do have a woman and a man looking after them.
- Other kids have just one parent, more often a woman but it could be a man.
- Other kids may have two women or two men.

And all those kinds of parents can do their jobs well or badly, and make their kids happy or miserable. End of.

A much younger little girl whom I know was taken for the first time to the house of two gay men who were long-term family friends. It was a happy visit for everybody, and she had a good time. On the way home, she remarked to her mother "Mom, it's two guys in that house." No query, no "how could that be?". She just wanted to indicate that she had seen something new to her that day. Again, end of.

Basically, happy and confident kids don't get upset or stressed out when they find that people live their lives in different ways from the ones they are familiar with. Can't say the same of grownups, unfortunately ...

Some Schmo wrote: ↑

Sun Apr 03, 2022 1:36 pm

It's the typical GOP playbook. Waste time talking about non-issues to distract the base from the fact that they do nothing to actually make American lives better, unless you have a 10-figure income.

DeSantis is just as much of a lying piece of crap as Trump, just not as stupid about it. It's little wonder the asshole demographic loves him.

DeSantis is a real showboater and a creep. Yeah. I don't have any respect for him. It is usually the case that he says something outrageous, and then does something quite a bit less outrageous but still not much that I support. I would love to be clear of him, but he is the governor of my state.

There is a certain evil genius in getting the Left to react hysterically as though they really were pushing sex ed on elementary school students.

I recall when my mother introduced me to the concept of homosexuality. She had rented much of our property and farm facilities to a couple of guys who had been married in Spain. I was 8 years old at the time. In subsequent years I was reintroduced to homosexuality when I was sexually harassed by older boys at gym class and scout camp. I guess I was a real looker to them or something. If only I had been as appealing to the gender I was interested in.

In any case, I did not need the school telling me at the age of 8 what homosexuality is, and I don't think my parents would have been thrilled if my teachers had taken it upon themselves to do so. Not because they were dead set against homosexuality, but because they preferred taking the lead in teaching us certain things. There are plenty of busybodies out there who think it is there business to teach you what they think you need to know. I do agree that in some matters parents should be the ones to decide what their kids learn at a very young age, not the schools.

The idea of introducing things to kids at an age-appropriate time isn't really the end of the world for those who feel like their kids need to know about married gay couples at the age of five or seven. They can always do so as my parents did: teach it in their own home. For those who are not necessarily comfortable with having some teacher--and let me tell you, not all teachers are equally capable--educate their kids on gay marriage, perhaps it is not wise to antagonize them by insisting that Heather Has Two Mommies be on the shelf in the classroom or on the reading list in elementary school.

I imagine a kid can hold on until middle school before all of these nuances of identity and family life are covered more fully in public schools. Ideally, kids aren't dating in elementary school. So perhaps they don't need the school covering much of that area of life until sexual development is a little further along. If Heather in their third grade class does have two mommies, then maybe a kid's own parents can be responsible for explaining that.

It would be great if we could find some honest middle ground to work with here. Not between bigotry and acceptance, which should not be the issue, in my opinion, but between insisting that it is the school's job to teach every facet of life as early as possible, on the one hand, and refusing to teach kids about certain aspects of the real world altogether, on the other.

Of course, the whole thing could be a fake controversy. I would not be surprised. Honestly, I would be more surprised to find that gender issues were coming up in any big way in elementary school. I have a difficult time buying that they do come up very much.

My bottom line is that I am tired of the drama. Tired of people yanking everyone around with their culture wars BS.

Kishkumen wrote: ↑

Sun Apr 03, 2022 3:53 pm

Of course, the whole thing could be a fake controversy. I would not be surprised.

And you'd be right in my experience. See my post above.

Chap wrote: ↑

Sun Apr 03, 2022 3:50 pm

What I told my kids at that age, and what they absorbed from people they encountered at school was the unastounding fact that different kids have different kinds of families.

- A lot of kids do have a woman and a man looking after them.
- Other kids have just one parent, more often a woman but it could be a man.
- Other kids may have two women or two men.

And all those kinds of parents can do their jobs well or badly, and make their kids happy or miserable. End of.

A much younger little girl whom I know was taken for the first time to the house of two gay men who were long-term family friends. It was a happy visit for everybody, and she had a good time. On the way home, she remarked to her mother "Mom, it's two guys in that house." No query, no "how could that be?". She just wanted to indicate that she had seen something new to her that day. Again, end of.

Basically, happy and confident kids don't get upset or stressed out when they find that people live their lives in different ways from the ones they are familiar with. Can't say the same of grownups, unfortunately ...

Yes, that's right: we can't say the same of grownups. And, not all kids are happy and confident. There are going to be problems in reference to this, as there are problems in so many things. The question not infrequently is raised: what is to be done about it? Less often: is it really necessary to make a government issue out of it?

Too often, I think, people create issues out of non-issues. You don't seem to see any issue here, and I agree. This should not be the issue that it is. There simply are people who live in different kinds of family arrangements, and perhaps that is something neither those comfortable with it nor those not comfortable with it need to make an issue of for K-5 kids. Those not comfortable with it cannot make reality disappear, while those comfortable with it will not be able to prevail upon those who are not comfortable with it through the mechanism of K-5 education.

We should not rise to the bait. If there is a problem in my kids' classroom, then I can address the problem with my school, not go out and agitate for the passing of yet another performative piece of bad legislation. In the USA, people are too itchy to pass legislation on this, that, and the other.