Bye bye illegals don't cry CEOs

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ajax18
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Bye bye illegals don't cry CEOs

Post by ajax18 »

As the old saying goes, the civil war didn't end slavery, it was the invention of the cotton gin. DeSantis's policy is striking a huge blow to modern day plantation owners who support their lavish and idolent lifestyles with cheap/illegal taxpayer funded labor. This will be a rare victory for working middle class native born Americans who seek to maintain and perhaps even improve their standard of living.

Florida CEOs Raise Wages, Urge Tech Innovation After DeSantis Immigration Reform
Florida employers are raising wages and urging greater investment in wage-boosting technological innovation after Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis signed a state-wide set of immigration reforms.

“Some of them have raised wages” amid a worker shortage, said Jeannie Economos, a manager at the Farmworker Association of Florida, which opposes the law.

The farm companies are also “saying ‘More money for research into mechanization, we need more mechanization, we can’t afford the cost of labor,'” she told Breitbart News on June 6.

Desantis’s immigration reforms — especially his law requiring employers to use the E-Verify system — are also pushing up wages in the construction sector, USA Today reported on June 21:

The owner of a Naples construction company, Valdez, who is also from Mexico, stayed home in solidarity with his Hispanic workers who boycotted Florida’s new immigration law.

Since DeSantis signed the immigration bill, Valdez has lost 15 of his best [illegal migrant] workers, who have moved to other states like Illinois and North Carolina.

He used to pay painters $18-$20 an hour. Now, he’s paying $30-$35, which ended up increasing the costs for his work. “I have to adapt,” he said.

For decades, Florida’s bipartisan establishment has imported millions of low-wage, hard-working, and uncomplaining migrants to subsidize its farm employers, landlords, and retail investors.

“Norma arrived from Guatemala just five months ago with her daughter… like many workers from Guatemala and Mexico,” Union-Bulletin.com reported on June 22. “When Norma arrived in Homestead she noticed a sign on the side of the road offering work, and even without papers, she got the job at the warehouse working for $10 an hour.”

The massive resident population of perhaps 800,000 illegal migrants has chopped wages and boosted housing costs for millions of ordinary Americans, even as the state’s employers, investors, and landlords grew wealthy.

But that elite consensus has been cracked by DeSantis’s pro-American migration laws, including his law that requires employers with more than 25 employees to confirm the legal status of job applicants via the federal government’s E-Verify system. The new laws are pressuring many illegal migrants to quit the state, so opening up many economic opportunities for Americans.

“Irma Bautista is a construction business employer who has noticed her work staff numbers dwindling,” reported Winknews.com, a news site in Florida. “We had 45 workers. From 45, now we have 20,” Bautista said.

One undocumented worker, Carina, who did not want to reveal her last name out of fear she could be deported, said she is worried about her children. In the next few weeks she plans to return to her home country of Guatemala after 20 years, together with her three children, ages 19, 13 and 9. She said she had been thinking about returning for some time now, but that the new law was the push she needed to decide to return home.

Meanwhile, business groups and their pro-migration progressive allies are looking for loopholes and are preparing lawsuits as they try to keep the state’s huge population of illegal workers.

The farm companies are also demanding wage cuts in the federal government’s H-Second Amendment program, Economos said. The program imports agricultural workers for seasonal jobs. However, GOP Senators have quietly blocked a Democratic-pushed plan to slash wages paid to H-Second Amendment foreign workers.

Many farm companies prefer to rely on cheap, disposable labor instead of American-made, crop-picking machines.

Their cheap-labor priorities are often touted by many establishment media outlets.

“New immigration law sparks fear and worker exodus from Florida,” said the June 21 headline in USA Today.
“Florida’s new immigration law previews a DeSantis presidency: The law that takes effect this weekend has already sparked fear — and could carry human and financial costs,” said Vox.com.

The farmworkers’ group is also on the same side as business, said Economos. “It is seldom that labor and business are on the same page — but on this one, I think, we have some common ground,” she told Breitbart News.

“Obviously, we were really surprised that the [GOP] legislature passed this [E-Verify law] because they’re so devoted to business that we didn’t think that they would pass something that would harm business,” she added.

Economos’ group — and other pro-migration groups — are working with companies and some Republicans to persuade workers to stay in Florida, partly by organizing illegal migrants to conduct loud protests against the wage-boosting reforms.

DeSantis’s immigration reform is spotlighting GOP divides between pocketbook-minded swing voters and the business-funded donors who prefer to win elections with “culture war” issues. For example, Jeff Roe, a top campaign adviser to DeSantis, told the establishment-backed Axios.com on June 5:

“The fight for the soul of the party isn’t about tax cuts or trade deals,” Jeff Roe, a top adviser to Never Back Down, the super PAC supporting DeSantis, told Axios. “It is this cultural combat that we have as a country.”

“These people know that DeSantis is a culture warrior for this time,” he said. “These voters are more angry than they were in 2016.”

DeSantis’s spokesman emphasizes DeSantis’s support for legal migration. amid widespread efforts by establishment outlets to describe illegal migrants as “immigrants.”

“The media has been deliberately inaccurate about this distinction between legal and illegal immigration to create this very sort of outrage based on a false premise,” said Jeremy Redfern, DeSantis’s press secretary. “Any business that exploits this [border] crisis by employing illegal aliens instead of Floridians will be held accountable,” he added.

“You can’t address the immigration issue only as a culture war issue — the economic aspects are integral,” responded Mark Krikorian, the director of the Center for Immigration Studies. He added:

Clearly, he’s committed to E-Verify, having made two significant pushes for it in the state legislature and gotten a pretty good bill, which went into effect July 1. But his campaign literature so far addresses E-Verify but in a more vague way, and this is pure speculation, — but I wonder whether the political-operative types are a little more skittish about it than the governor himself is.

DeSantis has repeatedly mixed national economics and voters’ pocketbook concerns into his immigration platform, for example, by threatening tariffs on Mexico if they don’t help manage the border.

The United States has to get Mexico’s attention for it to cooperate on issues, like migration, like fentanyl, and one of the most powerful ways to do that is by playing the tariff card. So you can’t separate what are sometimes segregated as “culture” issues from economic issues? They’re all just different facets of the same problem.

Meanwhile, back in Florida, even reporters have to admit that some Americans welcome the migrant exit. “Mario Martinez, born and raised in Immokalee, agrees people who aren’t legally permitted to be here shouldn’t be here,” Winknews.com reported.
https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2023 ... on-reform/
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Re: Bye bye illegals don't cry CEOs

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Interesting. Bidenflation bad. DeSantiflation good.
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Re: Bye bye illegals don't cry CEOs

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Res Ipsa wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2023 2:49 pm
Interesting. Bidenflation bad. DeSantiflation good.
We're talking about an increase in worker's wages, not an increase in the cost of groceries, gasoline, and housing. I do admit that this would cut into the profits of wealthy employers of illegal immigrants like Veritas if such policies were implemented in his home state, which should explain his stance on the issue.
And when the Confederates saw Jackson standing fearless like a stonewall, the army of Northern Virginia took courage and drove the federal army off their land.
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Re: Bye bye illegals don't cry CEOs

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Are you sure Rhonda Santis didn't envision Next-Gen Japanese robots harvesting the orange groves?
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Re: Bye bye illegals don't cry CEOs

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ajax18 wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2023 4:43 pm
Res Ipsa wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2023 2:49 pm
Interesting. Bidenflation bad. DeSantiflation good.
We're talking about an increase in worker's wages, not an increase in the cost of groceries, gasoline, and housing.
So paying folks more doesn’t translate into inflation? And a company that’s increasing wages doesn’t attempt to compensate by raising the price of their goods?

Wasn’t one of your earlier arguments against the COVID economic income payments that they drove the spike in inflation?
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Re: Bye bye illegals don't cry CEOs

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ajax18 wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2023 4:43 pm
Res Ipsa wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2023 2:49 pm
Interesting. Bidenflation bad. DeSantiflation good.
We're talking about an increase in worker's wages, not an increase in the cost of groceries, gasoline, and housing. I do admit that this would cut into the profits of wealthy employers of illegal immigrants like Veritas if such policies were implemented in his home state, which should explain his stance on the issue.
Ajax, if you're going to make these kind of proclamations about the economy, you should take some time and educate yourself on how economics works. Remember the spike in oil prices? Did the increase in the cost of crude oil cut into the profits of the oil companies who buy crude from the producers and then refine it and sell you gasoline? Hell no! They made record profits even though they were paying record prices to the Saudis and other oil producers. For businesses, increased costs are increased costs, whether the increased cost is materials, or labor, or capital. When a business's costs increase, the business doesn't eat the entire loss. The increased cost is distributed throughout the entire economy. Just like increases in the cost of crude petroleum is spread throughout the economy, resulting in higher prices for all kinds of goods and services, so do increase in the cost of labor.

If Florida's economy is typical of the U.S. economy, the labor market is tight. What DeSantis has done, in terms of economics, is a government-created labor shortage in the construction industry. So, the first hit is to trade subcontractors: excavators, framers, roofers, etc. These aren't the people you hate. Lots of them are small businesses -- often family businesses. Labor is a large potion of their costs, and the government has just doubled its price. If they are unable to offset that cost increase by raising prices to general contractors, they simply go out of business. Go find a roofer in your area and ask what the effect of doubling their labor costs would have on their business if they couldn't increase their prices.

Luckily for these hard working American families, its very rare that a business can't protect some of its profits from cost increases by increasing its own prices. But its also very rare that a business can push 100% of a cost increase on to its customers. So, what will happen is that some of these small businesses will go out of business (yay, DeSantis -- you just killed small businesses) and general contractors will face increased costs. And on and on. What you eventually get is a contraction in the entire construction industry -- less stuff gets built and the cost of what does get built is more expensive. Housing prices increase and fewer houses are built. Rents will increase. Everyone who is affected by the this cost increase will try to pass it on to someone else. So, the cost of this government created labor shortage will not be borne by the people you hate. it will be borne by you and the people you like.

But that's only part of the way the cost of this artificial labor shortage will spread. Because we're in a tight labor market, those subcontractors we were talking about are going to have to hire currently employed workers away from other employers. So, now Florida employers are going to be in a bidding war over workers. As the construction trades increase the wages they pay, they will peel workers away from grocery stores, food service, and other industries. The increased labor costs for construction workers won't stay in the construction industry -- it will increase the labor costs of grocery stores, restaurants, etc.

What DeSantis has done, in effect, is impose a 100% tax on construction labor and given the proceeds of that tax to the workers. Why, it's redistribution of wealth from small business owners to workers. It's the kind of redistribution of income you claim to hate when its done by Democrats. And it's not going to harm just the people you hate. In fact, it's very likely it will hurt the people you like more than the people you hate. Market forces don't care about people's politics -- they just try to equalize the quanties supplied and demanded of everything by changing prices.

Or, put another way, DeSatis just raised the minimum wage for construction workers only to $30 per hour. Did you think raising the minimum wage generally to just $15 per hour would be the best thing ever because it would put more money in the pockets of American workers? Or is it only a good thing when your favorite right winger does it?

Bottom line: your claim that "We're talking about an increase in worker's wages, not an increase in the cost of groceries, gasoline, and housing" is so detached from reality that it could fairly be described as delusional. Whether you like it or not, you live in an interconnected world in which the ability to swing your fist without hitting someone else is becoming less and less possible. Even worse, when your worldview consists of treating Breitbart as gospel truth, when you throw a punch you're more likely to hit yourself rather than your intended target.
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Re: Bye bye illegals don't cry CEOs

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Res Ipsa wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2023 7:09 pm
Bottom line: your claim that "We're talking about an increase in worker's wages, not an increase in the cost of groceries, gasoline, and housing" is so detached from reality that it could fairly be described as delusional.
It’s probably not helping ajax when he reads from sources that are so twisted in their presentation. Per the article:
The new laws are pressuring many illegal migrants to quit the state, so opening up many economic opportunities for Americans.

“Irma Bautista is a construction business employer who has noticed her work staff numbers dwindling,” reported Winknews.com, a news site in Florida. “We had 45 workers. From 45, now we have 20,” Bautista said.
Notice how so many Americans have rushed to be hired into Bautista’s construction business, swelling her employee rolls from 45, to 20.

Sure, Bautista may find those Americans eventually. But the pay - as the article notes - may double, and that means that the cost to customers will be increasing.

This is normal and expected with free market capitalism, but I’m always amused by the folks bitching about Chinese imports and illegal immigrants supposedly taking American jobs, while simultaneously bitching about prices and buying cheap crap in Walmart that’s made in China. More domestic replacement for imported goods, and more booting of immigrant and green card labor in preference for higher wages paid to their replacements means that the standard of living for many Americans may be negatively affected as a result, because of increased prices. There’s no free lunch here.
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Re: Bye bye illegals don't cry CEOs

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ajax18 wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2023 2:07 pm
As the old saying goes, the civil war didn't end slavery, it was the invention of the cotton gin.
That's not an 'old saying' that anyone but idiots spout, at least not without considerable elaboration.

The cotton gin actually magnified the demand for slavery in the US. Because Eli Whitney's invention efficiently removed cotton seeds from the fibers, the invention increased cotton production--and the need for more enslaved workers to harvest it.

The US had fewer than a million enslaved people at the close of the Eighteenth Century, when the cotton gin was invented. By 1860, and the start of the American Civil War, it had almost four million. That's not the cotton gin ending slavery.

Read some fricking history. This is part of a middle school curricula.
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Re: Bye bye illegals don't cry CEOs

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It's a good thing that Dennis Prager doesn't teach courses in optometry or you'd be in prison.

Forget about "inflation" for the moment, as you only believe that government printing dollars causes inflation -- plus, inflation is technically "gradually rising prices," not necessarily any rise in price, so it's a controversial term. In other words, inflation isn't identical to price going up.

What DeSantis has done here is good old-fashioned government regulation from econ 100, no macro course work required, that poses a barrier to entering the market -- it's the same thing as a price ceiling or a price floor. So what you've done is restricted supply of labor, bidding wages up, with the ultimate result of a lower output clearing and at a higher price for consumers.

Whether it's building a wall to keep cheap labor out, affirmative action at a university, or a rent ceiling in New York to help poor families, it's the same principle at work; using government policy to a stifle supply or demand such that markets clear sub-optimally, causing surpluses or shortages, and only benefiting a restricted class of people. In other words, Ron DeSantis is officially a socialist, and so are you, SOCIALIST!!!! Get behind me SOCIALIST!!! Under my feet Satan!!! F&#^()@#)!!!!!!!
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Re: Bye bye illegals don't cry CEOs

Post by Res Ipsa »

canpakes wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2023 8:20 pm
Res Ipsa wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2023 7:09 pm
Bottom line: your claim that "We're talking about an increase in worker's wages, not an increase in the cost of groceries, gasoline, and housing" is so detached from reality that it could fairly be described as delusional.
It’s probably not helping ajax when he reads from sources that are so twisted in their presentation. Per the article:
The new laws are pressuring many illegal migrants to quit the state, so opening up many economic opportunities for Americans.

“Irma Bautista is a construction business employer who has noticed her work staff numbers dwindling,” reported Winknews.com, a news site in Florida. “We had 45 workers. From 45, now we have 20,” Bautista said.
Notice how so many Americans have rushed to be hired into Bautista’s construction business, swelling her employee rolls from 45, to 20.

Sure, Bautista may find those Americans eventually. But the pay - as the article notes - may double, and that means that the cost to customers will be increasing.

This is normal and expected with free market capitalism, but I’m always amused by the folks bitching about Chinese imports and illegal immigrants supposedly taking American jobs, while simultaneously bitching about prices and buying cheap crap in Walmart that’s made in China. More domestic replacement for imported goods, and more booting of immigrant and green card labor in preference for higher wages paid to their replacements means that the standard of living for many Americans may be negatively affected as a result, because of increased prices. There’s no free lunch here.
Yep. It's capitalism 101. TANSTASFL is an ironclad rule.

I found this article from April of this year describing the already existing labor shortage in construction. https://www.wesh.com/article/florida-co ... e/43535736#

None of this is an endorsement of the current underground labor market in the U.S. It does, however, illustrate the insanity of restricting immigration in a country with an aging and declining population and workforce while at the same time demanding no inflation.
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