True Doctrine

[_marg]

Indeed, he (God) has the propensity for choosing the weak and the simple as instruments by whom to manifest his knowledge and power.

(Prophets and Prophecy, Joseph Fielding McConkie, Bookcraft 1988)

It seems most major religions are started up by men between the ages of 30 to 40 years. I wonder why God has a preference for men in that age group? Does God ever choose women to be prophets?

[_Quantumwave]

Indeed, he (God) has the propensity for choosing the weak and the simple as instruments by whom to manifest his knowledge and power.

(Prophets and Prophecy, Joseph Fielding McConkie, Bookcraft 1988)

It seems most major religions are started up by men between the ages of 30 to 40 years. I wonder why God has a preference for men in that age group? Does God ever choose women to be prophets?

Hi Marg

My take on prophets is they are not "chosen" by anyone or any entity. The ability for prophecy is a gift from nature, just as some have a natural "talent" for music, math, tennis or whatever. I suppose one could generalize these "gifts" as from God, but since I definitely do not buy into the "guy in the sky" willy-nilly making decisions and changing his mind, I prefer to attribute these "gifts" to natural causes, inotherwords, evolutionary growth.

Men start most religions and most other major organizations in society simply because this is the holdover of our clan existence, which for tens of thousands of years were ruled by the physically stronger males. The clan was necessary for protection in order to survive. The paternalistic theme in the Bible is a simple continuation of this clan mentality.

It turns out that one of the most famous and validated prophets ever was a woman named Jeane Dixon. She accurately predicted the assassination of Pres. Kennedy. "In 1952 she predicted the assassination of John F. Kennedy 11 years ahead, at a time when Kennedy was still a senator for Massachusetts. She was in St Matthew's Cathedral in Washington one morning when she had a vision of the White House and a young, blue-eyed man standing at the door and, at the same time, heard a warning that a Democrat who would be inaugurated as President in 1960 would be assassinated while in office. Her prediction was reported but later forgotten."

There are also many Prophetesses (?) referred to in the Bible, but then one needs to consider the source of such information. The Bible is mostly fictional and based on the "guy in the sky" model making decisions on insignificant matters as one will find in the D&C.

There are many self-appointed prophets, and of course J. Smith comes to mind, but I have searched in vain for an accurate prophecy he provided. Proponents point to the famous Civil War prophecy, and he was close on this one, but made some inaccurate predictions as to the extent of the war. He made a lot more predictions that were totally off the mark, including the time of the Second Coming.

[_harmony]

You are blessed for your adherence to the Laws that you obey. But when you stop living the gospel at such and such a point, you damn yourself. I do not mean that oyu are damned to hell, you damn yourself like a river is damned. Your progression stops. You keep yourself from living that part of the culture of heaven. You progress into the culture of heaven through obedience to its precepts.

Dam, not damn. Big difference.

And I have never stopped living the gospel. I think you confuse the gospel of Jesus Christ with some of the teachings of the leaders of the LDS church. They are not the same. When I see a divergence between the two, I choose to follow the gospel, not the leaders of the church. I am commanded by God to follow only my own personal inspiration, to have my personal relationship with God, to lean not on the arm of flesh but on what He tells me.

If you are questioning a gospel principle, ask yourself "Why would God give that law to us, what is the end goal there"

No, Gaz. I don't ask myself and I don't ask my leaders; I ask God. God gives me the laws he wants me to follow, and I am well aware of what the end goal is. I am not obligated to follow men; I am commanded to follow God. No man comes between me and God.

[_marg]

Hi Quantumwave,

Thanks for the information and insights. My take is similar to yours. I don't think anyone has any supernatural gifts from any supernatural source. People who claim to be able to prophesize may get "it" right on occasion, but what needs to be looked at is the overall success rate of all their predictions. I doubt Jeane Dixon had a higher success than failure rate.

You write: "Men start most religions and most other major organizations in society simply because this is the holdover of our clan existence, which for tens of thousands of years were ruled by the physically stronger males. The clan was necessary for protection in order to survive. The paternalistic theme in the Bible is a simple continuation of this clan mentality."

Well said!

[_Quantumwave]

By the way Marg welcome. Seems like you were here before the board crashed, but am not sure.

You are right about Jeane Dixon. What I remember is her failure rate was significantly higher than her success rate but her successes were quite phenomenal. But given that she had some undefined gift, I agree with you that it did not derive from the supernatural. It can be said with complete certainty that the laws of nature are never transcended. It is only through deception or the false interpretation of these laws that lead the credulous to believe in the supernatural.

[_Jason Bourne]

Indeed, he (God) has the propensity for choosing the weak and the simple as instruments by whom to manifest his knowledge and power.

(Prophets and Prophecy, Joseph Fielding McConkie, Bookcraft 1988)

It seems most major religions are started up by men between the ages of 30 to 40 years. I wonder why God has a preference for men in that age group? Does God ever choose women to be prophets?

It does? Examples please?

Jason

[_marg]

Hi Jason,

The major world religions I'm referring to are Christianity (Jesus, 30 years), Islam (Muhammad, 40 years) and Buddhism (Siddhartha 35 years).

If we look at the origins of particular cult groups which you could do at this page http://religiousmovements.lib.virginia. ... lpha.htm#b most are started by men, few by women. In addition there is a high proportion of men in the age group mainly 30 to 40 years..(plus or minus 5 years) who start cult and/or religious groups.


If we look at Mormonism, Joseph Smith was 25 years. when the Book of Mormon was printed but it is unlikely he was the writer of the Book of Mormon. More likely Rigdon wrote it adding to Spalding's manuscript and that Smith was recruited for the main purpose of helping to promote and sell the Book of Mormon along with Mormonism. I believe Rigdon was 37 years at the time.

[_Jason Bourne]

Hi Jason,

The major world religions I'm referring to are Christianity (Jesus, 30 years), Islam (Muhammad, 40 years) and Buddhism (Siddhartha 35 years).

If we look at the origins of particular cult groups which you could do at this page http://religiousmovements.lib.virginia. ... lpha.htm#b most are started by men, few by women. In addition there is a high proportion of men in the age group mainly 30 to 40 years..(plus or minus 5 years) who start cult and/or religious groups.


If we look at Mormonism, Joseph Smith was 25 years. when the Book of Mormon was printed but it is unlikely he was the writer of the Book of Mormon. More likely Rigdon wrote it adding to Spalding's manuscript and that Smith was recruited for the main purpose of helping to promote and sell the Book of Mormon along with Mormonism. I believe Rigdon was 37 years at the time.

Joseph Smith had no contact with Rigdon prior to Rigdon's conversion by Parley Pratt in 1830 thus that theory falls rather flat.

Why men in that age group? I have no clue.

Jason

[_Jason Bourne]

And I have never stopped living the gospel. I think you confuse the gospel of Jesus Christ with some of the teachings of the leaders of the LDS church. They are not the same. When I see a divergence between the two, I choose to follow the gospel, not the leaders of the church. I am commanded by God to follow only my own personal inspiration, to have my personal relationship with God, to lean not on the arm of flesh but on what He tells me.

Where does God tell you this?

No, Gaz. I don't ask myself and I don't ask my leaders; I ask God. God gives me the laws he wants me to follow, and I am well aware of what the end goal is. I am not obligated to follow men; I am commanded to follow God. No man comes between me and God.

Do you follow scripture? Who wrote the scripture.

Jason

[_marg]

Joseph Smith had no contact with Rigdon prior to Rigdon's conversion by Parley Pratt in 1830 thus that theory falls rather flat.

It is generally much easier to prove with a high degree of probability to a virtual certainty that someone had contact with a particular individual if there is affirmative evidence, such as first hand observations and/or reliable eyewitness accounts. It becomes much more difficult to prove with any degree of certainty that a particular individual did NOT come in contact with another individual if those individuals were within a reasonable travel distance of each other and had the time and means. Absence of evidence (of the event/meeting) is not evidence of absence (of the event/meeting). In addition it would be expected that evidence would be absent if the parties had reason to want to keep their contact a secret.

So what evidence do you have that J. Smith & Rigdon could not possibly have met before 1830..to enable you to state with such complete confidence..."the theory falls flat"?