liz3564 wrote:I have my own theory about this, which is probably blasphemous by most, particularly many of my fellow TBM's....but I personally think that Jesus was the literal son of Mary and Joseph. I do not think he was conceived by the "Holy Ghost overshadowing her" or God having sex with her, as Brigham Young and other prior LDS prophets seem to believe.
The "virgin birth" traditions go back a long way.
A recurring theme in ancient religion revolves around the manner of the sun god's birth, as well as the chastity of his mother. In a number of instances the sun god is perceived as being born of the inviolable dawn, the virgin moon or earth, or the constellation of Virgo. The virgin status of the mothers of pre-Christian gods and godmen has been asserted for centuries by numerous scholars of mythology and ancient religion. Nevertheless, because of the motif's similarity to a major Christian tenet, apologists attempt to debunk it by simply stating that these Pagan mothers were not virgins, for a variety of reasons, including their marital status, number of children and the manner of impregnation. Regardless, the virgin status of the ancient goddesses or mothers of gods remains, despite their manner of impregnation, because the fathers, like that of Jesus, are gods themselves, as opposed to mortals who physically penetrate the mothers. Also, the mothers are not "real people," but goddesses themselves, who therefore do not possess female genitalia. Thus, despite being a mother, the goddess retains her virginity.
http://www.truthbeknown.com/virgin.htmFrom the same link:
None of these writers originated this contention, as, moving back in time, we find reference to Devaki's virgin status in the writings of the esteemed Christian authority Sir William Jones from 1784:
"The Indian incarnate God Chrishna, the Hindoos believe, had a virgin mother of the royal race, who was sought to be destroyed in his infancy about nine hundred years before Christ. It appears that he passed his life in working miracles, and preaching, and was so humble as to wash his friends' feet; at length, dying, but rising from the dead, he ascended into heaven in the presence of a multitude."
Bio of Sir William Jones:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Jones_(philologist)
Again:
Regarding Krishna and Jones, the anonymous author of Christian Mythology Unveiled ("CMU"), who wrote around 1840, possibly 1842, states:
It has been admitted by most of the learned that the Shastras and Vedas, or scriptures of the Hindoos, were in existence 1400 years before the alleged time of Moses Sir William Jones, of pious and orthodox memory, confesses that, "the name of Chrishna, and the general outline of his story, was long anterior to the birth of our Saviour, and, to the time of Homer, we know very certainly. I am persuaded also (continues he) that a connection existed between the old idolatrous nations of Egypt, India, Greece, and Italy, long before the time of Moses. In the Sanscrit Dictionary, compiled more than two thousand years ago, we have the whole story of the incarnate Deity, Born of a Virgin, and miraculously escaping in his infancy from the reigning tyrant of his country." This tyrant, alarmed at some prophecy, sought the infant's life; and, to make sure work, he ordered all the male children under two years of age to be put to death. Here is the true origin of the horrid story about Herod, of which no Greek or Roman historian says a single word. That the Christian story was taken from the Indian allegory, is traceable in every circumstance the reputed father of Chrisna was a carpentera new star appeared at the child's birthhe was laid in a manger(celestial)he underwent many incarnations to redeem the world from sin and mental darkness, (ignorance and winter) and was, therefore, called Saviourhe was put to death between two thieves he arose from the dead, and returned to his heavenly seat in Vaicontha.
It seems there were many stories circulating about virgin births, and it was an almost common theme in the pre-Christian Old World. Also, the Hebrew word for "virgin" translates to "young woman", one not necessarily a virgin in the sexual sense.
It was the Trinitarian bishops at the Council of Nicea in 325 AD who decided on the doctrine of the Trinity. The council lasted about two months. Even at that time the virgin birth was being disputed, resulting in the Arian "heresy", which held that Christ was a "created being" (ie, mortal).
If you want to watch an entertaining video from You Tube, scroll to the bottom of the page:
http://www.truthbeknown.com/index101.htm
I think mythologist Joseph Campbell understood all of this perfectly, and in his book
The Hero With A Thousand Faces, he explains this.