The Mockingboard.

[_beastie]

If I respond with an example from my own life, who wins the anecdotal war?

Mockery is not always rooted in anger. Anecdotes certainly can demonstrate this. If you provide an anecdote demonstrating that sometimes mocking IS rooted in anger, you haven't disproved my point at all.

Nobody seemed to really answer my question as to whether it would be reasonable to mock living persons and the liturgy of local Jews -- anonymous hit pieces against your local synogogue. What they wear to service, their devotion, their holy days, what the wear on ordinary days?

Yes, they did.

If the local Jews were a dominant group in the area, and their belief system entailed several assertions that were fundamentally insulting or belittling to those who do not accept their claims, or once accepted and now rejected those claims, and felt free to openly express those insulting or belittling beliefs, if they taught that those who rejected their claims were inspired by satan and would be punished by God in some way, if certain beliefs or habits could be reasonably seen as ridiculous, bizarre, and disconnected to reality, then it would be reasonable for individuals subjected to these teachings to mock them in return.

Of course, this doesn't describe the vast majority of Jews, if any. I haven't studied Judaism, so I'm just guessing, but I suppose some of it could apply to the most conservative, literal form of Judaism. For example, if conservative Jews were dominant in an area and openly presented their beliefs about not touching a menstrual woman in a public manner and stated that those who mock these beliefs mock God and will be punished by God, then I believe it would be reasonable for the minority to mock those beliefs.

To relate it to the example I offered from my own life, if the Jewish community funded several large billboards reminding people not to touch menstruating women else suffer the wrath of God (if that is their belief), I would say they would be begging to be mocked by nonbelievers who are sick of having strange beliefs paraded in the cartman police uniform thrust in their faces.

I clearly stated above that simply because a behavior, belief, or statement is cloaked in the cartman police uniform of religion does not mean that it automatically deserves some respect, and those who refuse to bestow such respect are labeled "bigots".

[_beastie]

And here's an additional problem to consider regarding how some believers are not able to differentiate between criticism and mockery:

Some beliefs are simply so ludicrous that when one states a criticism of those beliefs, it sounds like mockery. In reality, it's just restating the belief in a skeptical manner.

[_Mercury]

I understand what you're saying. Do you want to know what it looks like to an outsider? It looks juvenile. It could be that Vegas uses this kind of board as an outlet for his anger. If he wanted to be taken seriously and actually change someone's mind about the church, he would drop the "spitting". No one will listen to someone who can't seem to control themselves.

No truer words have ever been written.

Ray, there is nothing I can say that will convince you that Mormonism is a fraud perpetuated by a conman. So instead of trying to convince you that my way is the correct way I play with you, like a cat and mouse game.

[_Ray A]

Ray, there is nothing I can say that will convince you that Mormonism is a fraud perpetuated by a conman. So instead of trying to convince you that my way is the correct way I play with you, like a cat and mouse game.

Would you say that Catholicism is also a fraud? Do you believe that all religion is fradulent?

[_Mercury]

Ray, there is nothing I can say that will convince you that Mormonism is a fraud perpetuated by a conman. So instead of trying to convince you that my way is the correct way I play with you, like a cat and mouse game.

Would you say that Catholicism is also a fraud? Do you believe that all religion is fradulent?

Yes I would. What are you getting at?

[_Ray A]

Yes I would. What are you getting at?

Then at least you're consistent. So ALL religion is fradulent as far as you are concerned. I was a Catholic for 20 years, born and bred, and I don't consider Catholicism a fraud, though they have a more tarnished history than Mormonism, including incestuous popes. I would consider some popes to be frauds, but not the majority. Likewise, I don't consider Mormonism a fraud, and you're right, you won't convince me. I believe there are some false ideas in Mormonism, but that's not the same as fraud.

[_Bryan Inks]

Yes I would. What are you getting at?

Then at least you're consistent. So ALL religion is fradulent as far as you are concerned. I was a Catholic for 20 years, born and bred, and I don't consider Catholicism a fraud, though they have a more tarnished history than Mormonism, including incestuous popes. I would consider some popes to be frauds, but not the majority. Likewise, I don't consider Mormonism a fraud, and you're right, you won't convince me. I believe there are some false ideas in Mormonism, but that's not the same as fraud.

So. . . you don't think Catholicism is a fraud and you don't think Mormonism is a fraud.

Vegas does and he knows that he can't say anything to convince you of that so he "plays" with you.

. . .

What's your point Ray?

[_Ray A]

So. . . you don't think Catholicism is a fraud and you don't think Mormonism is a fraud.

Vegas does and he knows that he can't say anything to convince you of that so he "plays" with you.

. . .

What's your point Ray?

If I have any "point" it is that his anger towards Mormonism accomplishes nothing. I think it's even counterproductive. I'm not trying to un-convince him of anything, so I don't know why he thinks, or seems to think, he needs to convince me Mormonism is a fraud. He's obviously trying to convince a minority of other posters here of that, because I would say the vast majority here thinks like he does.

[_truth dancer]

Hi Jersey Girl...

Lets discuss "male privilege" (a term we often discuss in group therapy for abusers), for a sec...

Men having rights, privileges, opportunities, and power, not afforded to women.

Do men in the LDS Church have rights, privileges, opportunites and power that are not afforded to LDS women? I think they do. I think you are offended by the implication that LDS men are abusers. When you saw this post did you question truthdancer to see if she intended to make that connection? From what context was this post born?

There was no intention to equate LDS men with abusers.

My point was that, in the therapeutic community there is a specific term for organizations, men, or groups that do not allow women similar privileges. opportunity, and power as men... the term is "male privilege."

The LDS church is one such organization.

I in no way was suggesting all LDS men are abusers or that the church teaches abuse or any such thing.

Hope that clarifies. :-)

~dancer~

[_Mercury]

So. . . you don't think Catholicism is a fraud and you don't think Mormonism is a fraud.

Vegas does and he knows that he can't say anything to convince you of that so he "plays" with you.

. . .

What's your point Ray?

If I have any "point" it is that his anger towards Mormonism accomplishes nothing. I think it's even counterproductive. I'm not trying to un-convince him of anything, so I don't know why he thinks, or seems to think, he needs to convince me Mormonism is a fraud. He's obviously trying to convince a minority of other posters here of that, because I would say the vast majority here thinks like he does.

I am no longer involved with Mormonism. THis alone justifies my anger. By removing me from its mind prison the anger I extend towards Mormonism has MUCH worth.

Anger precipitates action.